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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

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Original poster

All gender toilets

159 replies

MissBax · 12/05/2017 18:43

Bit of a lurker on the fem chat usually but just wondered people's opinions on this.
At my university today I noticed they'd changed the women's toilets on one floor to "all gender" toilets. At first I thought ah ok that's not a big deal, there must be someone in the uni who is trans and that's why they've done it. But then when I came out of the toilets I noticed that the men's toilet and disabled toilet hadn't been changed. I can't understand the rationale of changing only the women's toilets? Or am I being overly sensitive? I'm not sure how I feel about it...

OP posts:

WhereYouLeftIt · 17/05/2017 00:50

The very point that is made in this article FerretsAreFeminists.

This is why we have women-only spaces, and why I don't want to hear your complaints

Ineedacupofteadesperately · 17/05/2017 10:21

Where that is an excellent article and hits the nail on the head very eloquently. I've often felt wrong footed by men acting hurt when I've pointed out the need for women's safe spaces - because I can see that they feel personally maligned and often ended up being manipulated into feeling bit sorry for them. Being middle aged has some benefits in that now I am largely ignored rather than harassed, but I have two daughters and their growing up frightens the hell out of me, and is why I've reawakened my inner feminist . I now also see that, whilst it is maybe a bit unfair if you're a decent bloke to be excluded from women's safe spaces (although surely if you have any female relatives and the tiniest morsel of empathy you can see the need) it's even more unfair to be a woman questioning if you can do a thing men routinely do (e.g. walk home alone after a night out) safely and without assault.

Ineedacupofteadesperately · 17/05/2017 10:33

Or indeed, go to use public toilets....

Terfing · 17/05/2017 13:12

This will especially affect religious women who probably won't use public facilities at all now.

Ineverdidmind · 17/05/2017 13:20

Yes I was going to say similar Terfing.

In my works loos today a muslim colleague was using the mirror to re-do her head scarf. She took it right off to do this. I doubt she'd want to do this with a bloke in there with her.

sticklebrix · 17/05/2017 13:45

Re. headscarves - definitely an inconsistency in SJW thought here.

sticklebrix · 17/05/2017 13:51

Posted too soon. An inconsistency between supporting religious women's preference for modesty and removing the single sex facilities which enable them to balance modesty with work, study, life outside the home.

GingersHaveSouls · 17/05/2017 14:10

We went to view secondary schools for my DD. The first school that we viewed had open unisex toilets. They were just off the corridor with a big round sink in the middle. The cubicles were not floor to ceiling and I could tell by my daughters face that she would not use them. I wouldn't have either.
I would feel so uncomfortable as a girl using them, with the boys using them and messing around by the sink, and what about when you have your period... ugh, I was really not comfortable about it. Asked the teacher showing us around about it, and he said it was a new thing that the school had incorporated to prevent bullying in separate toilet blocks.
Needless to say, She didn't go to that school. Fortunately the second school we viewed was lovely with separate loos for boys and girls.

YetAnotherSpartacus · 17/05/2017 15:41

gingers

What were they thinking????

I mean Really?

Datun · 17/05/2017 15:50

I suppose the original idea for introducing toilets with gaps at the top and bottom was for safety. If someone had fainted for instance, or was being held in there, maybe?

I prefer a completely enclosed cubicle, but if I was drawing up plans for an office, or school, I would have to take other things into account.

Yet more reasons for sex segregated facilities.

TheCountessofFitzdotterel · 17/05/2017 16:21

I imagine the gaps at the top and especially bottom of the partitions also help to make cleaning easier as it means there are fewer corners to trap dirt.

TheCountessofFitzdotterel · 17/05/2017 16:22

Datun - y, and to stop people going in in groups and using them for sex or drug taking / dealing.

SirVixofVixHall · 17/05/2017 22:21

Gaps were to check that no-one had collapsed in the loo, or would be locked in when loos were locked at night. They make sense, but make it easier for a man to film women.

iasppark · 19/05/2017 16:56

just saying there's only 1 gender, men women are just objects why would we need a toilet for an object?? i completely agree

WhereYouLeftIt · 19/05/2017 19:17

iasppark I am not following that at all, could you explain what you mean please?

AssassinatedBeauty · 19/05/2017 19:23

I imagine there should be a full stop after "men", as well as some other punctuation!

"Just saying... there's only 1 gender - men. Women are just objects - why would we need a toilet for an object?? I completely agree [with turning the women's into gender neutral]"

I think that's what was meant. So a poorly written goad, rather than a sensible point. But I could be wrong.

RufusTheRenegadeReindeer · 19/05/2017 19:59

Even the goading has gone down hill assassinated

I despair i really do...

We used to get a much better class of goady

WhereYouLeftIt · 19/05/2017 20:05

Or it could have been meant sarcastically. And 'i completely agree' means iasppark completely agrees with other posters' take on the subject.

AssassinatedBeauty · 19/05/2017 20:14

It's their only post (at least with that username) so I'm erring on the side of piss poor goad.

Datun · 20/05/2017 06:41

I'm erring on the side of piss poor goad.

I'm going to start writing these things down.

WhoAteAllTheJuice · 20/05/2017 15:14

Toilets are about sex. Nothing to do with gender. I'd get rid of the sign of female in a dress across the board that confuses people.

If a male is that uncomfortable using a male toilet use the disabled/family/baby changing toilet.

TitaniasCloset · 30/05/2017 14:34

I have had enough of this. And yes to the posts about Muslim women who need to adjust their hijab or wash for prayers or fill up a water bottle for the loo.

And not having sani bins in the Loos? What planet are these people on?

I want to actually do something about this now, posting on here though I'm glad I can, isn't cutting it anymore. I have had enough of this bullshit.

SirVixofVixHall · 30/05/2017 14:53

I've had enough of the bullshit too. On Twitter yesterday I was reading all the comments supporting Northern Irish Women's Aid, who "support all women, including transwomen" And so welcome transwomen into their refuges. It is as though the 70s never happened. A women who is in danger of being killed, who may have traumatised children with her, and has had to flee her home, will have to be in a space with people with penises, who are sexually attracted to women, and clueless/careless enough about actual women's safety that they are taking up space in a refuge. NI women's aid had been responding to an incorrect rumour that they were getting a new head who was a transwoman, and they were waffling on about intersectionality. Well, I personally care far more about my daughters' safety, and my own, than I will ever care about some man's feelings. Having wounded feelings is nothing like actual wounding. And as a victim of male assault, I know the bloody difference!

VestalVirgin · 30/05/2017 16:37

In my works loos today a muslim colleague was using the mirror to re-do her head scarf. She took it right off to do this. I doubt she'd want to do this with a bloke in there with her.

Indeed. And it is not only that. A woman might use this female-only space for all kinds of readjusting clothes.

I once saw a woman take off her t-shirt and hold it under the tap to get it wet before putting it back on. (It was a very hot day.)

Those are all things you can't do if males are allowed in there.

This limits women's freedom, but not men's. Men are not expected to hide their hair or chests from women, thus will be perfectly able to do all those things on the unisex loo.

TitaniasCloset · 31/05/2017 10:24

Yep. I have had to change clothes in the Loos many times. There will literally be no clean private spaces to take care of these things anymore. So if you bleed all over your skirt or have to change on a hot day you will have to seek out a disabled loo.

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