The Gender Critical Manifesto

[venusinscorpio]

Let's put a list of salient points together about what the issues are with the trans agenda. It will be a useful resource.

Late to this but still in time to say - excellent post gold.

Having been a bit upset about the election and all that entails I thought I'd tell dh about my new thinking project which is basically worrying about the implications of all things trans. Dh is a top bloke, feminist, and extremely right on. Ah. I suspect you can see where I am going here - dh thinks I am a "daily mail style bigot". A succinct list would be valuable to many of us I think.

Faceicle

Ouch! A bit the same here. DH doesn't think men dress as women to invade safe spaces. He thinks transpeople have had the op. And when I showed him Magdalen Berns' "Give it up, Riley " video his main point was that Magdalen is annoying and sarcastic (I can see she's Marmite, but still )

I like this thread. It feels like something is being "done".

By definition, a manifesto should take the form of a set of key points - aims, policies and the like. So, we need clean and direct language:

There is evidenced harm in broadly and without question allowing people (particularly MtF trans people) to self-identify as one gender or the other. Ref: prisons, sex offenders, autogynephiles etc.

A transwomen with a penis is not a woman.

Where there is a clear need for a separate female space (women's refuges, toilets, change rooms, hospital wards) these should be provided and respected as such.

The type and use of language centred around a woman's biology, her body and and genitalia should be determined by women and not by men or transwomen.

It is wrong to encourage children and young people to classify themselves as transgender when they are in a vulnerable adolescent state and may go on to make irreversible, regrettable and damaging changes to their body.

I'd like to see the use of 'gender' banned. If people had to substitute 'gender' with 'sex' the whole trans idiocy would become much clearer.

For example: this stupid use of the word 'assigned'. If, instead of saying 'the gender assigned at birth' it became 'the sex assigned at birth' it would provide a FFS moment. Penis = male. Vulva = female. It's really not rocket science.

If TAs have their way no one will ask "is it a boy or a girl"? It will be "what gender is it is it"? To which the response could well be: Let's just wing it shall we for a few years and see how baby identifies itself?

Oh tiger I feel your pain! Just shown dh the same video and he huffed off half way through. To be fair, he didn't like the shining bit (I can see his point on this). What made him walk was me referring to Riley as he. I suspect I will have to spend some time on this.

Faceicle

Google some articles on the cotton ceiling and AGP. It was AGP that I told my DH about first. He got immediately.

Oh, and I meant to say the most important thing is the science behind all this, I think. Get rid of the transwomen are women bit and the rest all follows.

For most men I know, peak trans was the sports issue. When I pointed out a few examples like Fallon Fox or that charmer Lauren Jeska or the recent changes to the Olympics rules, they literally couldn't believe this could be allowed happen. Sporty blokes tend to have a strong sense of fair play, and it really annoys them to see mediocre men invading women's sports, it's just cheating.

Ask him if he actually really believes Riley is a woman. I can't believe anyone does, apart from EF subscribers. Most transpeople don't even! I suspect he just thinks it's cruel and that everyone has to pander to the pronouns. Because it doesn't affect him.

Faceicle Try Magdalen Berns' DSM5 video. My DH totally got it after that.

Following, not got anything to add at the moment sorry

cuirderussie

Yes I always forget about the sport issue in terms of persuading people. But you are right, it does seem to be the one that picks up the stragglers.

A lot of people only acknowledge the sports issue.

A lot of people only acknowledge the sports issue.

Apols for double post, on a train and didn't think it went through.

I realise my idea of recording sex and gender separately in the stats is flawed, in that it gives gender (as a concept) credence. I couldn't report myself as sex = F gender identity = F (FF) because I think gender is a bullshit, strait-jacketing social construct. I could buy into it if, in addition to recognising the 53 or whatever different gender identities out there these days, there was a value which meant "rejects the concept of gender".

We need to refute the sometimes distorted or unsubstantiated statistics that so frequently circulate in this debate and, by the same token, more research into transgender identification of all kinds (girls with autism for example).

faceicle my DH is the same we watched the BBC "transgender children: who knows best?" And he started to get some of the points I was making.

Yes I agree the children issue is the way to go with resistant people. Once you chip away at the idea that transgender politics is unequivocally a good thing, the other points will be clearer.

I think we deserve that as a "gender", Mortificado. Especially as you can have an array of bollocks concepts as "genders". It would be nice to have a sensible one, for sensible people.

I'd want to include women as "other" /non-men.

So when the group known as women includes all biological females, trans identifying males and trans identifying females, plus everyone who is vaguely non-GC in any way.

Eg (from my crappy memory so may be slightly inaccurate) back when jack monroe was identifying as a trans-man, and won a women's literacy award, not long after jenner's woman award.

Yes that's the point isn't it. It doesn't affect him and therefore he can't imagine that it affects me. Brilliant.

The trans women in women's sports speaks to men. So, often does the issue of potentially irreversible intervention with children.
But issues such as why we would have an issue with trans women in female spaces require an awareness of the problem of male violence, which even your most right on man will not acknowledge. As for trans women benefitting from awards and quotas/ positions designed to benefit women, they are unlikely to care because - well they're not taking something away from men, and usually they are seeing trans women as 'not men' = women. If we were seeing trans men taking ground from men - which we're not - that could be different. Does every glossy male magazine have a column by a trans man? Does a trans man win Man of the year? How many trans man parliamentary candidates do we have for this year's general election?

For my DH it was the Iranian football team that helped him to get it - the idea that he (as a rather tall man and decent enough hobby-footballer) could probably decide to play as goalie for a women's team and get picked above the women