Women and Christmas

[Smartleatherbag]

Apologies if this has been done to death, but may I have a short rant with the like minded?
Everywhere right now, at the school gates, work, on social media, women are running themselves ragged while their male partners do sweet fa, or very little. So many women take on this responsibility and have it foisted on them.
It drives me potty!
My husband is in charge of Christmas here. I have health problems, so it's always fallen to him, apart from cooking. All the shopping, gifts, cards, organising, he does it. So then I get the 'ooh you've got him well trained" thing. No. Any adult can do these things.

Well I think it's marvellous that so many women not only don't do the Christmas preparation but haven't noticed who usually does it, so far removed from their lives it is. Exciting times we live in, clearly the world has changed far more than anyone would think.

This is why I generally avoid this board as if you ever offer a different perspective it is met with vitriol which is a shame as I thought the point of feminist chat was to discussion

"Doesn't happen to me, why are you talking about this" isn't really discussion though, is it?

I know what you mean, op. I know everyone on this thread has amazingly enlightened, egalitarian husbands, but I don't think most women are as lucky 😉
It made me think of #manwhohasitall on twitter

I do wonder what would happen at Xmas if there were no women. I think it might grind to a halt quite swiftly

vestal haven't seen you on for ages, I thought something might have happened to you! Glad you're back!

And ripples nice to see you posting too.

op weird things have been afoot wrt feminism the last few days, don't know what's going on but take some of the comments with a pinch of salt!

Oh thank goodness, the cogent discussions I come to mn for still exist! Thanks to all who get my point re the wider social, gendered picture.
It is frustrating that such a significant date in our calendar and our collective childhoods etc falls on the shoulders of women's unpaid labour.
I love doing Christmas dinner, but I've not come to that in a vacuum. I watched my mum, my grandmother, for years. And so on.

It is exactly this sort of trivial whiny shit that puts women off the Mumsnet approved brand of feminism.

There aren't any many articles in men's magazines about how to ice a Christmas cake and making a centrepiece for the Christmas table etc are there? I know there'll be some that say good housekeeping isn't aimed at women, but is aimed at both sexes, but I think that would be pushing it a bit.

Speak for yourself whatthese

It is exactly this sort of trivial whiny shit that puts women off the Mumsnet approved brand of feminism.

Oh dear! Well I shall never again notice who is trudging around the shops on the days before Christmas again.

Can't we offer an other view without derision, I thought that didn't happen on here

Well, "it doesn't happen to me so therefore it's not a thing" isn't a view though, it's an attempt to shut down a discussion.

It is exactly this sort of trivial whiny shit that puts women off the Mumsnet approved brand of feminism.
Ooh ouch. I'm hurt. No really.

Do these women not have the power of speech to ask for help?

Or to say, sod it, if you want Christmas , do it yourself.

Thanks Vestal, yes, it's that programming, isn't it? I totally get that

So incapable of independent thought as well as speech?

No understanding of the wider cultural assumptions, all very 'well, it's fine here, so let's not analyse the dynamics'.

Let's discuss the dynamics endlessly and then come to the conclusion it's too difficult to change anything.

That's not my point. It's about the cultural assumption that women will do it all. And that men only 'help'

And so what ? Are you actually going to do anything about or just continue to be a martyr?

Well, being 'forced' to a write a few cards that no one would notice if you didn't do it is the ultimate first world problem.

OK, for the hard of understanding, by discussion I meant an invitation to suggest reasons for the cultural phenomenon of women, as a class, doing all the fucking work, followed by posters suggesting why these are or aren't significant, etc etc.
A discussion is not 'misunderstanding the fucking point and then proffering a reason as to why the op is out of order.'

Well no I accept many women take it all on, my point is lots of people do manage to share out the workload. It's not hard. while I accept in the old days it was routine for the women to do it all, nowadays you will find its not routinely the case

It really isn't hard but a thread saying that would get no attention.

Are people only allowed on here if they agree?

I agree with you.

Well, thanks to those who actually got my point.
Fuck me, I'm off now.

I understood the point, but thought it was stupid & responded accordingly - discursive enough for you

I don't think you want a discussion- you want a pile of posters agreeing with you that Christmas is yet another example of patriarchical and societal oppression which women cannot resist and can do nothing about 'cos it's the patriarchy.

And you get no brownie points for your "hard of understanding" comment.

Smart, I hear you. Xmas is the social equivalent of the ultimate test for women.

We must:
Buy thoughtful present
Wrap beautifully
Prepare fabulous food without breaking a sweat
Look sensational and seasonal
Manage the family dynamics
Look after the halt, the lame, and the geriatric

And we are expected to enjoy ourselves cos, after all, it's all for the little ones, bless (vom).

And many (not all) absorb this pressure and convince themselves they do enjoy it, even if they don't.

A mix of martyrdom and power.

We must:
Buy thoughtful present
Wrap beautifully
Prepare fabulous food without breaking a sweat*
Look sensational and seasonal
Manage the family dynamics
Look after the halt, the lame, and the geriatric

You do realise the characters in the Tesco ads et al are just actors?

There's an episode of The Middle that illustrates this perfectly. Season 6 Episode 9. The Christmas Wall. You might find some cathartic laughs therein OP.

I think Bucking's synopsis has it right, though it's the media that is responsible for most of the pressure.to do a perfect job of creating Christmas. My own circle is perfectly happy with the same roast turkey and traditional trimmings. No one expects to be impressed by ground breaking cuisine. Roast dinners are pretty straightforward and the puddings are simple.

I've been thinking about this issue over the past few days, in a happy whirl, and came to two conclusions about my own personal position. First, that as my family is close and affectionate, I have always really enjoyed Christmas. Second, that I like doing Christmas my way, and that my DH's lack of interest suited me very well. His family Christmases, growing up, were classic bad ones: too much alcohol, grouchiness leading to screaming rows. When we started our family he left Christmas entirely up to me. At first I felt a bit hard done by, but when I thought about my reactions in depth I realised that I was actually really pleased that I got to do Christmas my own way. After a few years my DH got to like Christmas with my extended family. I love wrapping presents and decorating the house, but I only do what I want to do.

I think it's pretty obvious that many women demand too much of themselves, though it's not only women who do it. My DF still gets anxious about whether people will like their presents, a legacy of childhood trauma. But it is mainly women it affects, especially those who lack confidence or who have to spend Christmas with people who will judge them. You do get ultra competitive women who get a kick out of out Christmassing everyone else.

I do wonder what would happen at Xmas if there were no women. I think it might grind to a halt quite swiftly

Would that be such a bad thing?
Apart from a few exceptions*, most people I know moan about "what christmas has become", all the preparation, expectation, expense. Maybe these men have it right

*A few people I know, both men and women who love christmas and build for it from October.