Paris Lee talking at MN - thread 2

[shinynewusername]

1st thread here

MN has invited Paris Lee to speak at its Blogging event.

Meanwhile, actual women are being silenced.

Also watching and waiting for someone to report back. Did archeryannie go after?

Yes, I have been wondering how it went.

Yes, I feel like that too Betrand.

Didn't see any media reports on the blogfest thing. All quite quiet

This is odd. There doesn't seem to be any info on any of the talks actually.

Do MN usually write a de-brief after?

No idea and can't look as im mid-work. Can someone search last years and have a look what was presented when?

Nothing online besides bloggers posting their own blogfest fun

I've been googling and only reference to the Blogging For Good section I could find was from a blog. Slouchingtowardsthatcham.com. His blogfest summary is divided into The Good,TheBad and The Ugly.

Under The Good

I also found some of the points made in the Blogging: A force for good session about campaigning very apt in the light of Brexit and the US election result. The danger of online ‘filter bubbles’, where social media algorithms are biased towards showing you only opinions similar to your own. The importance of bridging the divide between strongly polarised views, seeking to understand the opposing viewpoint to help build common ground. Stonewall’s Ruth Hunt talking about how you deal with entrenched beliefs that denounce and deny the existence of the LGBT community.

Under The Ugly he's written this.

*Worse still, I felt the strongly feminist agenda (which I’m fine with) strayed too often from being pro-women to being man-bashing. At times I felt invisible as people talked only about ‘mums’ and ‘women’ rather than ‘parents’. And then someone would mention men, but only in the context of raising a cheap laugh, at which point I wanted to be invisible again. Mumsnet’s motto ‘by parents, for parents’ is inclusive. The behaviour and the language used in many of the sessions was not – that’s a subject for a separate post.

There were (I think) just six male bloggers present on Saturday out of (at a guess) 400 attendees. There was little to encourage them to feel welcome and want to return next year.*

Women just aren't inclusive enough to others, are they? Women should be talking about trans' issues and men's issues. God forbid women spend time talking about issues that affect women.

What is it with this insistence that the existence of the LGBT community is being denied, assuming those comments are being made in a UK context? Does anyone know a single person who denies LGBT exist, cos I don't!

LG and B are also considerably different issues to T. Constantly equating them doesn't help anyone imo.

L and G and B have different enough issues as it is!!

And nope, I know no one who denies they exist, though I may deny that they have one conglomerate community.

Just wondering, if the preponderance of women was entirely 'feminist' or sort of more like the WI - lots of women some feminist, some not, and whether one or other camp would be more or less likely to indulge in 'cheap laughs' at men's expense... and whether any of it was at all like male 'banter' at womens expense.

And I'm also wondering who was actually able to go and whether any of them are likely to report back here?!

I checked the tweets. Didnt see much positive (or much at all in fact) about that panel, there were a few posts from women on twitter who were similarly unimpressed by paris lees invitation.

Saw a few tweets by the guy who writes the above blog and a couple other people moaning about not enough men being on panels or made to feel welcome enough.

Some of the quotes tweeted from the 'Blogging for good' event made my eyes roll, for eg stuff about being able to deal woth different points of view. Like sure, advise the women in the audience that they need to make space for all sides while the panel hosts a person who proudly advocates for women to be no platformed if they dont pander to TAs. And PL said something about "dont ask dont get" which I thought was quite a male-socialised perspective, it being one of the oft cited reasons for the wage gap (men tend to ask for more, women tend to take what is offered).

Note to self. Be more welcoming of men. Otherwise they might not come back next year.

Good girl, Bertrand :)

I reported a post on the thread earlier today to ask MNHQ (maybe Rowan?) if they could pop in and let us know what kind of write up / read out there might be....

(Poor the menz - I wonder if that blogger complains when a panel show only has men or one token woman on it?)

That man needs a tumblr account...

Re Paris Lees, here she is making a cheap joke about a murder victim.

Paris Lees on Twitter: "Man murders man from Grindr and dissolves him in bath: I'm no prude but London's chem sex scene has gone way too far t.co/uVtAAy6U8r"
mobile.twitter.com/ParisLees/status/798206001451143168

What a lovely woman.

PL is such a wit!

Women have a long history of not being welcoming enough to men. Men, however, are perfect.

Tee hee.

Oh yonic, there is such an obvious response to your post, but the way things are I don't trust my account to be here in the morning if I say it!!

"Is there a veiled threat in Justine's comment that she thinks a civilised conversation on this topic may be impossible? "

I noticed this. I wondered whether it was a hint that things might be closed down; or just a more general and less thoughtful "general telling off" that people like her are prone to when mere plebs feel strongly about something, an unconsciously honed method of shaming underlings into silence by highlighting their dissent as unseemly.

It reminded me in tone of when whats-her-face of the WEP came on here to tell us that we were being "vicious" in trying to find out the WEP line on "who is a woman?" (was that what happened?)

(Yes pretty much

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/mumsnet_live_events/2617026-Webchat-with-Sophie-Walker-leader-of-the-Womens-Equality-Party-and-London-Mayor-candidate-Tuesday-19-April-at-noon?messages=100&pg=1)

an unconsciously honed method of shaming underlings into silence by highlighting their dissent as unseemly

The tone is very much, "You've let the whole Brownie pack down and spoiled it for the others"

Interesting...

Rrross1ges Wed 16-Nov-16 19:54:41
"I'm with you OP and I'm horrified by the transphobia on Mumsnet. I have done some work with Transmedia Watch who are trying to persuade MNHQ to treat transphobia as they would treat any other hate crime. I don't know what MNHQ have against the trans community or why they don't challenge the widespread belief that trans women are rapists in frocks who want to see fannies."

From the Aibu thread on toilets

Not suggesting Ross is PL! Just interesting that the "campaign" which Paris is "behind" appear to be lobbying mn.