Transwoman using women's loos at work

[CharlieSierra]

I've posted a bit about this over the past few days on the MN response to Spartacus thread in site stuff, but someone suggested I start a new thread about it here.

Earlier this week I was surprised to encounter an apparently male person in the women's loos at work. I understand from a colleague that they have just started the transitioning process, and it appears from all the research I have done that there is no way to avoid them invading our space. It would be discriminatory to prevent them.
We also have showers, presumably the same applies. I plan to take it up with HR, since none of the women in the building were told this could happen, but I haven't managed to speak to anyone about it yet.
I feel angry, powerless, silenced. It's obvious using the next cubicle that they use the toilet as a man would. We will have to adapt our behaviour, hide any discomfort so as not to make them feel uncomfortable. There are unisex accessible loos on every floor, but no, they want to be in ours.

What the flip are we going to do. We could have fought against a law. But this is just pernicious

This. What are we going to do. Plenty is right, if I go to HR with this they'll probably give me diversity training. I'll be the problem. It has to stop.

charlie under the Equality Act, women are allowed spaces for females only. (This is one of the things under threat from Maria Miller's proposals - she actually said she couldn't imagine a situation where women might need space free of self declared "women")

So you can ask your employers to provide a new space which is female only.

I'll write to Maria Miller and my MP (who is a fantastic woman).

I also vow now if this happens to me to pursue it and bring it into the open. It will be easier for me than for others - for example I don't have a mortgage to pay. Sounds ridiculous but these things make a difference when you're deciding whether or not to make a fuss at work.

Bambam - Jenner was originally awarded Woman of the Year but was stripped of the award after the massive hoohah (sp?) and the husband of the 9/11 victim returning her award.

Jenner was also on Radio 4 Woman's Hour's top 10 most influential women list.

If anyone thinks that mixed cubicles without full length walls/doors are fine for unisex use, good voyeurism at swimming pools with mixed changing areas. There are prosecutions every few months across the UK.

And WhenSheWasBad - DW Sports gym near me has one changing room. All the rest of the changing area is open plan. Who should be in the changing room? I find it surprising that you are happy to expose you and your daughter to random penises.

Hermione does that mean transwomen are not 'females' under the Equality Act.

Perhaps we should start a letter/email writing campaign? Post draft letters on here, which people can C&P, Provide a list of email/addresses of the various parties, e,g, Maria Miller

I Believe: I would really appreciate a letter I can C and P. It's all straight in my head but I wouldn't know how to articulate it formally. I mean, I'll do one anyway, but maybe I'll steal some of the explanations on the other threads.

Winchester I might be totally wrong but I think one reason it's hard to get support on social media is that a lot of people either don't know what's going on, or, like me, thought that a trans woman meant a person who had had their penis either removed or treated so it couldn't function.
It wasn't till I joined MN that I realised this wasn't the case.
I admit I have bypassed media in te past becaus I just see media as being bonkers a lot of the time.

I think the vast majority of the population don't know what's going on. I also think they won't fall for "first female frontline soldier" btw.

I tweeted about the science museum and I know fir a fact that some of my followers were also pissed off but because they do link their work do their personal Twitter account, they felt unable to agree on a public channel.

Interesting Lorelei. The science museum got picked up on and there was a small retreat. Was it because of the mums net thread?

I've shared toilet facilities with several transwomen (including one always mentioned on these threads!) I don't have a problem with it.

But just because I don't personally have a problem with it doesn't mean that it should be happening or that women who DO have a problem with it should just have to suck it up.

Not helpful user. Michelle O is not a man. That's a ridiculous, goody rumour started by people who hate the Obama administration.

user1471734618

I would not have a problem with it on a personal level, but the greater picture is extremely worrying and therefore I would object. Besides, loos with cubicles offer some privacy. Unlike women's changing rooms.

Maybe get on the Jeremy Corbnyn web chat thread (to go live on Monday) and join in asking him about this? My question to him is pretty simple, does he think a penis can be female?

Lynda
I know, my gym is the same and all females, from very young girls old women are free to change without having to cover themselves. Although some do, and no one cares. God ,imagine if a transwoman was allowed in. WE would all be queuing to get changed in the loos. How is that fair?

And isn't there a big fuss made periodically on MN re the appropriate age for a male child to no longer change with his mother in the female changing room but move to the men's? But we are expected to accept trans males of any age with dick because they demand it? Fucking horseshit

*Corbyn

I only knew about the science museum because of MN
I've also shared the loo with a trans woman but I happen to know she'd had her penis removed because I've seen the area myself!!!
As I've said before, if someone tells me I'm anti male in not wanting to share a loo or changing room with them, that's one thing but I can't see how I can be accused of being anti trans.

Liney yes I will do that too. I don't think he likes women very much though.

winchester yes, the equality act as currently drafted does recognise that even with a gender recognition certificate, there may be places where TW are not appropriate and women can organise women only space.

The science museum was roasted over the obvious sexism and inaccuracy of "male" and "female" brains. Many People and groups criticising them (looking at your Green Party Women) are very pro trans and haven't made the leap between "a there's no such thing as a female brain" and "in that case, you can't be a women born in a man's body". They are holding two conflicting beliefs. It's quite interesting to watch. Green Party women are busy blocking amazing feminists for daring to say that TW aren't women.

"having a person who is transgendered in a toilet cubicle next to you on Monday does not mean your daughter will be forced to shower with three fully cocked males by Friday."

The transgenderism movement has been one long series of "That is TOTALLY hypothetical and would never EVER actually happen... oh, wait, hang on a moment, it just did happen."