Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

Trans Understanding Help

239 replies

Itsallveryconfusing · 26/08/2016 13:29

Hello.

Please be gentle as I'm not very knowledgeable about this but I'm trying to learn.

My eyes have been opened due to the recent threads like the I am Spartacus ones. I have always been very liberal and believed that someone can be born in the wrong body when it comes to makes feeling like a woman etc. I've come to see that gender is more a social concept.

I've been speaking with DH about this who, again, is very liberal and believes in equality and is pro women rights, although his workplace is very male orientated. He's not afraid to argue against the party line that women are weaker emotionally etc. His view on trans is very much live and let live he firmly believes that if someone wants to identify as female or male then they should be allowed to, as it must be awful to feel trapped. He was shocked that my view is changing and that my views are more in standing with hard right wingers who look at equality is a dirty word.

Sorry for the essay but I'm struggling with what I know is correct in my head with the concept that people should be happy and if that makes them happy then I should respect.

OP posts:
BertrandRussell · 29/08/2016 13:21

Anyone interested in how many women are murdered in the UK every day?

LumpySpacedPrincess · 29/08/2016 14:56

I would be very interested in those figures if you have them to hand. Isn't it 1000 annually?

venusinscorpio · 29/08/2016 16:13

As a pp said (though it may have been on a different thread) the majority of murders of trans women happen in South America. In Brazil they are still massively outnumbered by the number of biological women murdered each year.

noeffingidea · 29/08/2016 16:58

lumpy, no, the whole number of homicides are lower than that. Thankfully, we live in quite a safe society.
www.citizensreportuk.org/reports/murders-fatal-violence-uk.html

brasty · 29/08/2016 17:09

MtT are most at risk of being murdered in situations women are in Britain. Both are most at risk if they are prostituted, and it is pimps and punters who are the murderers. And partners. Both are at low risk of being murdered by strangers.

LumpySpacedPrincess · 29/08/2016 17:16

Thanks noeffing, I'll read that later, off on a poke hunt now! Smile

SirVixofVixHall · 29/08/2016 18:46

If the stats are that one transwoman per year is murdered in the UK, then it is simply not possible for that to be "One of the main causes of death" as quoted upthread. I would also hazzard a guess that the one TW murdered per year is likely to be someone in a situation where murder is more likely for anyone. (e.g. prostitution). Not that it is even relevent. Women should not give up their safe places because of male violence, in fact the reverse is true.

venusinscorpio · 29/08/2016 20:40

You're right SirVix. They're also in countries where murder is more common across all social groups. And where thousands of women are murdered annually. It should go without saying that doesn't make it right.

venusinscorpio · 29/08/2016 20:46

Sorry didn't read your post clearly enough. Generally trans women who get murdered are disproportionately prostitutes, black and living in countries where life is cheaper and murder rates are high overall. I think it's incredibly misleading to present murder of trans people as a common cause of death in terms of UK trans people. Particularly when trying to erode women's rights, given how many women are murdered by men.

Original poster
Itsallveryconfusing · 30/08/2016 08:48

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3763538/Don-t-call-Transgender-Tory-councillor-calls-police-Labour-opponent-keeps-calling-meetings.html

I have seen this today. So could misgendering be a hate crime? May be that is why MN is getting twitchy with the delete key

OP posts:
Prawnofthepatriarchy · 30/08/2016 09:05

Princess there are other groups of men who might feel at risk in the gents. Effeminate men (though I haven't seen any push from gay men to gain the right to use women's loos), men who belong to a racial group that's a threatened minority in the location. I've even heard of men being worried about using the gents because they support the wrong football team! Shock

But finding men's facilities threatening is no reason to expect women to allow you access to spaces designed as female-only. Because if MtTs have the right to use those facilities then all men inevitably gain the right too. Male transgenders may be scared of male violence but women have at least as much experience of that and are considerably less able to defend ourselves.

Demands for phoney changed pronouns, access to sex-segregated spaces, and all the rest can only be achieved by shitting on women and up with this I will not put.

VashtaNerada · 30/08/2016 09:07

I don't think this is new, I think persistently misgendering to cause upset is already a hate crime isn't it? (Which is not the same as a one-off mistake). And to be fair, even the most critical posters on MN generally say they respect someone's pronouns when talking to them.

VashtaNerada · 30/08/2016 09:09

(My post was in relation to the article confusing linked to)

Prawnofthepatriarchy · 30/08/2016 09:10

I suspect that in small pubs and venues where an individual transgender man is known there's a lot more leeway about loos. But that's because of his known character and is more like a domestic situation.

LumpySpacedPrincess · 30/08/2016 12:41

Good point well made Prawn regarding other groups who suffer at the hands of toxic masculinity. I do think the push for access to women's spaces is more about validation than safety, I really do.

If mis gendering is a hate crime then cis needs to be added to the list too, I despise the term and it causes me discomfort to be called it.

SirVixofVixHall · 30/08/2016 13:35

I've just seen a link on Twitter to a company who make "tampons" for trans people. Tampons! Filled with capsules that dissolve to mimic blood. Tell me that isn't totally delusional.

FreshwaterSelkie · 30/08/2016 14:19

Now that upsets me. Pretend menstruation, WTF? Would they like my authentic endometriosis experience too? I mean, it'll kind of wreck your life, but what could be more womanly? 20 years of bloody carnage, pain, fatigue, medications, painkiller addictions, infertility, lost jobs, surgeries, medical bills and the overwhelming knowledge that the medical establishment hasn't the first idea how to treat it. But yeah, carry a tampon and pretend you're a real live woman, what fun. Not at all appropriative and clueless. Jesus.

Original poster
Itsallveryconfusing · 30/08/2016 14:23

Isn't the tampon sorry fake? I remember something about it last year

OP posts:
BertrandRussell · 30/08/2016 15:03

"I've just seen a link on Twitter to a company who make "tampons" for trans people. Tampons! Filled with capsules that dissolve to mimic blood. Tell me that isn't totally delusional."

That's fake.

BertrandRussell · 30/08/2016 15:05

Snopes

FreshwaterSelkie · 30/08/2016 15:16

Yes, I had a google and was about to come back with a snopes link for the trans tampon. Thank dog that's not true.

However, as I was having a read around, I found that the subject of sanitary protection coming up repeatedly in the context of trans, themes being "jealousy" of women's periods, using sanitary protection as some kind of dress up, and the bonding opportunity of being able to offer a woman a tampon if she needs one.

Honestly, just bleurgh. Bleurgh.

SirVixofVixHall · 30/08/2016 15:21

Apologies then, if the tampon thing is fake. It was posted by a feminist and seemed genuine.

venusinscorpio · 30/08/2016 15:24

I think some of it is so absurd it is beyond parody. Trans tampons wouldn't surprise me for that reason.

titchy · 30/08/2016 15:52