New anti-trans legislation in North Carolina

[SlowFJH]

Of course it's been driven by the religious right wing. But it does aim to achieve what many posters here appear to advocate - namely that biological males can only use men's toilets and changing rooms etc. Biological females must only use women's toilets and changing rooms. Will it gain wider support?

"Equally we can't tar all men with the same brush and see them all as potential rapists and voyeurs. I know some are"

Well we acknowledge the risk they pose as a class and that's why we have safe spaces for women based upon sex segregation.

So inviting TW into this space women's safety is put at risk.

Saying to your daughter "I know this will happen to her too" is defeatist. I also have a daughter. I say there is no fucking way that I will ever allow this to happen…EVER.

That has to be the stupidest statement ever on Mumsnet. Unless of course Slow is planning to be with his/her daughter 24 hours a day, 7 days a week for the rest of her life.

Has Slow said whether they are a man or a woman yet? A woman who knows nothing about the midwife's role in childbirth or a man who claims to be a fucking lioness?

Saying to your daughter "I know this will happen to her too" is defeatist. I also have a daughter. I say there is no fucking way that I will ever allow this to happen…EVER

Not only is this stupid, it's also INCREDIBLY insulting to every woman who has ever been assaulted, or threatened. Because of course all of us allowed it to happen. Or perhaps our parents did. Like it's a choice.

SlowFJH I'd love to hear how you plan to prevent it from happening, I don't fully understand how to be a 'lioness'. Only I don't really want my daughters to deal with all the degradation and humiliating sexual attention that I've been subject to. So if there's a magic solution, please do share it.

Yes MrsKCastle. I totally agree. It is both stupid and unbelievably offensive.

countess

A woman with 3 chikdren with no idea of the midwifes role in childbirth

I still don't agree loos are important. How much time do people on this thread spend in pubilc toilets honestly? It's once in a blue moon I use them. I accept that those women who work full time will need to go 2 or three times a day but what are the chance anyone else is in there at the same time anyway? It's not as if we go out of our way to spend hours every day in the loos unless some people like to skive in there at work or I suppose the people just about always men who cottage in them if that's still done today.

Perhaps the simplest advice to people is drink less and make sure you go to the loos before you leave home. I just don't believe this has to be such a big issue. When female lawyers were banned back in the early 1900s one reason the used was lack of toilets for us.... what a joke! Is this all something to do with English Victorian hang ups.

Anyway I am sure it will all be sorted out.

So if there's a magic solution, please do share it.

I could be completely wrong here but after reading the OP's last couples of posts, I think it's got something to do with John Lennon

“AskBasil
There's this thing called Google. It works on the intertubes. HTH.”

And yet you feel entitled to demand that women posters wipe your arse re sources, evidence, proof etc.

Men on the internet eh.

“ I say there is no fucking way that I will ever allow this to happen...EVER.” How are you going to stop it? You won’t be there when it happens. Man on the internet.

“That does not mean retreating to refuges and accepting the inevitability of sexual abuse. It means being a FUCKING LIONESS.” What does that even mean? Your daughter isn’t a lioness, she’s a woman. All the women in the world, who have been assaulted, raped, or harassed by men, aren't lionesses, we're women. Identifying as a lioness won't stop men harassing your daughter, all it will do, is make her feel bad because she wasn't lionish enough to stop them, she was just a woman.

“Equally we can't tar all men with the same brush and see them all as potential rapists and voyeurs. I know some are.”

How can we tell which ones are and which ones aren’t? What do you suggest we do? Wait until the ones who are attack us? And then use the law which allows 94% of all reported rapists to go free?

"Perhaps the simplest advice to people is drink less and make sure you go to the loos before you leave home. "

WTF? Are you fucking serious? Are you sure you're a woman?

That's actually one of the twattiest things I've read on here Eustace, and let's face it, it's been a catalogue of twattiness from the OP.

But you've excelled yourself.

Women should ensure that they don't drink anything (so if it's 25 degrees in high summer, tough shit) and that they make sure they're never a couple of hours away from their toilet at home.

Oh and don't be diabetic.

I can't believe anyone who thinks they're being reasonable, can actually post this.

eustace Why should I "drink less and go to the loo before I leave home" in order to keep myself safe from potential predators who are currently not allowed access to female safe spaces?

I am often out of the house for 14/15 hours a day. I use public toilets in railway stations, shopping centres, conference facilities and leisure centres.
I pee and poo. I empty my mooncup. Refresh my hair and makeup. I may get changed, too.

And I don't want to be wondering whether the person who has followed me in is there to gain sexual gratification from my actions.

I live in a rural area, to go shopping for most things involves a drive of an hour minimum, two and a half if I go to the city, and so I would expect to be away from home for at least 4 or five hours, a whole day if we've gone to the city. Often with two young dds in tow. Eustace are you really saying that none of us is allowed to drink and/or need the loo in all that time? Or need to change san-pro? That is just insane.

So the answer is that women and girls should all stay at home, or only leave for short journeys, and never travel or go on holiday, or even leave the house when they have their period?

Jesus Eustace - when I was pregnant I was weeing every 1/2 hour weather I'd drunk or not, because all my bladder could hold (it seemed) was a teacup full I suppose I could have stayed home from about 35 weeks with DS1, but with DS2 that wasn't an option..

And these days I have 2 kids (and a post-pregnancy bladder), so I'll be in some public loo or other about twice a trip.

Oh, and I later found out that my work toilets (4 women, building full of men) had had some cameras installed by another employee - doesn't matter how often you use them really.

I pee at least once an hour.
There's no way I could go out even for a couple of hours and not need the loo.

Coco- clearly you should stop all fluid intake when you aren't at home. And wee before you go out, as I'm sure you haven't though of doing that, have you?
And all pregnant women should just stay indoors, we could be kept company by those with heavy periods and/or weak bladders.

Where is this magical land, where women don't have heavy periods or bladder issues, or IBS ?
Surprising that the most ridiculous post on this thread hasn't been made by Slow !

Should my nine year old daughter, when out with her father and needing the loo, have to be alone in a toilet with these men?

You do your argument no good at all and stoke the OP's fire with comments like that. I don't know who the person in the middle photograph is but Alex Drummond (yet again) and Nina Greenwood are in the public domain. Neither you nor I have any idea whether or not they pose any risk to anyone. I really don't want to side with the OP, whose posts on other threads and this one are generally fairly unpleasant, but picking on random transgender adults to illustrate your point is quite unpleasant too.

Or children who have to go to the toilet Now Now Now Mummy! Or babies whose nappies need to be changed.

But never fear, fellow females. Slow has shown us the way. When in danger, all you have to do is...

< drum roll >

Be a lioness!

A lioness wearing a Tena Lady, surely.

So that's what I've been doing wrong

Maybe we are supposed to channel our inner lioness and piss in a bush.

Even if they don't pose a risk

I don't want to share some spaces with transwomen I want to sometimes just share a space with females because that makes me feel more comfortable and sometimes I really do need to feel safe

If I were in a place where I was only expecting to see females a transwomen would raise my suspicions they may at a quick glance pass as women but their movements, build, bone structure etc give it away I might not quite be able to explain why I feel uncomfortable or even threatened by someone who has raise my suspicions why the fuck should I or any other women and especially girls be put in that position

If is utterly selfish of transwomen to overlook this and not accept our reality it's not theirs simply because they are not women ffs and it all comes down to male privilege that they even try to argue that they belong in female only spaces and delusional that they are real women

I agree with lass. I do not fear transwomen.

I fear the men who will take advantage of changes to legislation that will prevent anyone from distinguishing between trans-women and predatory men in women's safe spaces.

I fear the men who will wait outside women's toilets until a lone female goes in, knowing that they will not be challenged if they enter behind her, and once inside, have the safety and privacy to commit crime. It will be a lot safer for voyeurs to film under a toilet cubicle door than it is on a crowded tube train. Very little risk of getting caught. No witnesses, and even if the woman does challenge him, he can brazen it out, claim she is mistaken, and that he has a perfect right to be there, what with him identifying as a woman and all.

Predatory men will seek out the least risky and most rewarding situations to commit their crimes. It doesn't get much safer than a quiet, unmonitored space or more rewarding than a place where women go to carry out their intimate personal care.

Lass

Are you being ironic about naming Nina? I post a nameless picture and you fucking name them?

I didn't say those Taw posed a risk I said my daughter wouldn't want to share fucking space with TW who looked like men.