Ways men can support feminism...

[BertrandRussell]

I thought this was interesting, and posted it on Chat, but sadly only got two responses, so I thought I'd try here!

Karen Ingala Smith has written a good explanation of why she doesn't think men should be feminists here.

And as usual, the most important thing seems to be making sure men are comfortable. So many interesting bits in the original blog post but what are we talking about? What title should men have................

"...men had eleven and a half thousand years to do something about sex inequality – if only a) you had wanted to and b) you weren’t too busy enjoying the benefits. What’s suddenly happened for you to want to get in on the act?"

That made me laugh. That's an interesting article.

I'm for:
-A society where women feel they are equal and responsible partners in it.
-Women are free to go about their lawful business without fear or impediment.
-Women's achievements in sport and just in general are celebrated as much as men.
-Well written and nuanced female characters in fiction be they average, heroic, romantic or even villainous in nature.

I'm against:
-Two women a week murdered at the hands of partners or ex partners.
-Women being raped and assaulted.
-Women being paid less for the same work.
-Women being over represented in low paying jobs, and under represented in high paying prestigious ones.

I am not a feminist as I either disagree/fail to understand certain feminist analysis. However whatever I disagree with I would never begrudge anyone the space to explore and examine, because ultimately we all want a better, fairer society. That can't happen if anyone feels silenced and ignored.

"I am not a feminist as I either disagree/fail to understand certain feminist analysis"

Could you expand on that? I think your other points are fantastic!

Yeah, definitely a woman.
The Karen Ingala Smith piece is well argued and certainly goes beyond the "shared experience" point made earlier. It does weasel out a little in the end with the simple assertion that men calling themselves supporters tend to be more valuable to feminism.
...which brings me back to my first post. In the article and on this thread there is the sense that only one definition of feminism is acceptable.

OK. Can someone please ring a bell to attract my attention when we start talking about what men can do to support feminism (as so many want to do) and stop talking how feminism should adapt to suit men? Thank you.

(I've been doing this since 1975 and I'm a bit tired)

They seem common sense ways to have a good relationship with women.

I am a man and they don't strike me as being especially 'feminist' but basically just part of being a decent human being.

I suspect most men do most of these things already.

Bertrand I sometimes feel that I would settle for men NOT to actively undermine women, never mind support feminism. I am not optimistic. Like the blog said, they've had a few years to have a go...

"The main sufferers of sexism are women as a class and the main perpetrators of sexism are men as a class. "

This was what I meant, ego. If a person doesn't agree with this statement, then feminism probably isn't the movement for them.

Do you disagree with the statement?

"I suspect most men do most of these things already"

That's good.

"I don't think some people on FWR realise how they come across to new people who post on here. "

Given there's a thread about it once a quarter, you seriously think this? You've been here for several cycles of "FWR are meanies"!

Ok, then what's your personal definition of feminism, if you don't like that one?

Mmm, ok. But you've taken offence at something I said (not the reading up thing) so that's the thing I'm trying to clarify with you.

I don't think "women suffer from sexism perpetrated by men more than vice versa" is a controversial core pillar of feminism, is it?

Or maybe you didn't read my original post in that way and that's why you found it offensive?