Chrissie Hyndes victim blaming SMH

[FayKorgasm]

guardian.com/society/2015/aug/30/chrissie-hyndes-rape-comments Link

I always liked her but not after this.

That is not going to apply for the specific crime of rape as they are not potential victims. Well not in the same kinds of ways anyway

Just because men aren't raped in the same numbers as women, and rape is very much a gendered crime, men do get raped by other men. Are men who wear tight tops and don't guard their drinks also responsible for being raped?

"Whereas it is perfectly possible to believe that the rapist is 100% to blame for their own actions while at the same time think it wise or sensible for a woman to not leave her drink unattended, not wear A, B or C, not get drunk past a certain point, not take a shortcut down a dark alley at midnight, and various other examples that often come up."

You see that is a mathematical impossibility. Blame/responsibility for a crime can only total 100% whichever way you split it up. Saying that the rapist bears 100% of the blame but then saying women can somehow avoid being raped means they bear a level of responsibility. So the responsibility for the crime suddenly tops 100%. Which is impossible. So the only way to make the sums add up again is to reduce the blame/responsibility of the rapist.

Best estimate, JAPAB - how many fewer rapes would there be if every woman had one drink fewer on a night out? The latter is a very specific piece of advice.

Some numbers to start you off:

It is estimated that 0.5 per cent of females report being a victim of the most serious offences of rape or sexual assault by penetration in the previous 12 months, equivalent to around 85,000 victims on average per year.

Ooh ooh more maths. Excellent.

Some more figures to help out: over 50% of rapes happen within the home; 75% rapists are known to their victim.

Aah right. I was working from clearly a bad memory. Well JABAP's figures should be even more interesting then.

BuffytheReasonableFeminist
I'll accept general, gender neutral self care. I won't accept special, gender specific restrictions to my freedom, which we have no actual evidence to suggest make any difference other than to shore up rape culture.

Are you anti all advice to women? If you hear someone warning young women due off to university about how it is best to not leave drinks unattended then your back stiffens? Similarly if someone warns young women not to walk alone late at night down dark alleys?

scallopsrgreat
You see that is a mathematical impossibility. Blame/responsibility for a crime can only total 100% whichever way you split it up.

If I say that someone is responsible for acting in ways to minimise their own chances of falling victim to burglary say, I am not saying that they bear responsibility for the crime of burglary itself. Only the burglar does.

There is not just one pie labelled "the crime" from which if one person takes a slice, another person in necessarily apportioned less. There are two pies.

It is why a person can consider you "irresponsible" if you go on holiday while leaving all your doors unlocked and putting a sign on your front lawn saying "no-one will be in the house for two weeks, please post mail and leaflets next door", while at the same time consider any burglar 100% guilty and responsible for their own criminal actions, without contradiction.

But the best advice to avoid being raped is to never be alone with a man (or a group of men). Definitely not to get a boyfriend or male mates. Even male relatives.
The chances that someone will spike or drink or will attack you in a dark alley are much lower.
Then what?

YonicScrewdriver
Best estimate, JAPAB - how many fewer rapes would there be if every woman had one drink fewer on a night out? The latter is a very specific piece of advice.

And if you find someone putting forward that specific piece of advice then you can ask them.

And once again, even if someone cannot come up with something like 'if all women never left drinks unattended then there would be x point y percent less rape each year' that does not necessarily invalidate the advice.

Is having men in our lives open door invitation to rapists? Is that careless?

Minding drinks and dark alleys should be advice given to both genders. Both could be mugged or randomly attacked. There are enough serial killers or random violent men that attack men.
Why does that advice have to be gender specific?

And do you think your house will be safe if a burglar is intent on robbing it? The same with a rapist intent on attacking you.

Lweji, I have addressed that point in previous posts, for instance the one timestamped Wed 09-Sep-15 11:05:03.

Which specific point?
And why then do you keep insisting on gender biased advice that is in fact almost irrelevant and if at an should be given to both genders?

Are you only advising on rapes cases involving drink spiking? Do you mean with GHB?

Those are vanishingly small.

If you don't like my "one drink" reduction, pick any specific advice you like and estimate the reduction in the overall number of rapes. Hair in a ponytail/not a pony tail is an interesting one, google it if you are unclear why.

I'm not asking for accuracy to the decimal point, I'm asking for an estimate. A rough idea of what you think it might be. Consider it as one of those interview questions where you have to estimate how many hoovers are sold in Iceland, or whatever. Call it your hypothesis rather than your estimate, if you like.

If some advice about behaviour to reduce an action has no numerical impact on that action then yes, I'd say that would invalidate the advice. Wouldn't you?

YonicScrewdriver
If some advice about behaviour to reduce an action has no numerical impact on that action then yes, I'd say that would invalidate the advice. Wouldn't you?

Indeed. For any crime there is "works" advice in the sense that it will minimise the chance of it happening to you, and "doesn't work" advice that will make no difference. And within the "works" advice category there is advice that while if followed it would minimise risk, nevertheless inhibits freedoms too greatly, and advice that would work and also does not.

I'm sure the date-rape drug category of rapes do form a very small proportion of overall rape, just as I am sure that email scams involving Nigerian Princes form a very small part of the overall theft crimes that take place per annum. Still, you wouldn't necessarily say that there is no value in warning people against NP emails just because of the low proportion of annual victims of them.

I think one of the things that helped me out in situations when I was threatened with rape was my anger. Unfortunately you only know when it happens how you will react and it is not something you can control, a lot of people freeze when threatened.

The other one is walking with lots of confidence, even if it is down an alley at midnight. Rapists assume that you are confident for a reason.

lweji If you're talking about older girls and boys, I agree completely. Teenage girls, or at least post-pubecent ones fall into 'woman' category, and are complicit in thier own rapes. And of course, all teenage and indeed pre-teen boys want to do is fuck so really they should be great full.