Not all Romans

[AskBasil]

The Romans built the first roads in Britain.

But not all Romans

The Vikings built ships which sailed as far as America.

Not all Vikings.

Rabbits are known for reproducing really quickly.

Not all Rabbits.

Etc. etc. I think I will add "not all" whenever anyone refers to anything ever, until people stop saying Not All Men as a first response to a class analysis of men's behaviour.

Never thought of that, buffy. True.

Jean,

The real last resort of the desperate. A complete non sequitur about one course at one uni (bizarrely the one I myself did) followed up by the ultimate dismissive personal insult .

I think they shake the plant rather than hand pick

I do knoweth. I was in a meeting about Athena Swan on Tuesday and they mentioned the Physics department doing this. So I do reckon if even the people setting the exams can recognise their own bias and want to challenge it, probably it is actually, you know, there. As opposed to being a figment of weirdo feminists' imaginations that can be mansplained away.

Buffy,

I suspect, with due respect and saying that this is merely a personal opinion, that cherry picking is about taking all the delicious ripe cherries and leaving the under ripe and rotten to others.

larry, it was one example, which happened to come to mind because I heard about it recently.

If you look at the Athena Swan project, you will see that universities across the UK have acknowledged and tried to eradicate bias against women in STEM. I picked Cambridge physics without knowing that it was your degree, and I understand you might feel a bit upset now you realise you got a degree that was skewed to be easier for men, but you must see it wasn't intended as a personal comment, and it wasn't your fault either.

Buffy, Larry was David Beckham, he did the course and attended the Cambridge department

Jeanne,

The thing is that there could well still be bias in some subjects at a high level. Did I ever dispute that? The population numbers, though, tell a different story about what is happening across the educational sector.

What is interesting is that Cambridge is actively tackling the bias. When it swings the other way, it is just accepted.

Kingie,

Yes, but not with vast distinction. I was more like a Man U apprentice. Thought I was brilliant....until I saw the really brilliant.

There is still bias in many subjects at a high level.

Population numbers show quite clearly how much women struggle.

Cambridge, and other universities, are tackling the bias, but it is certainly not 'just accepted' when it swings the other way.

It is a very interesting debate. How do they skew a course to males or females? I know nothing about this can someone explain please.
I can see how they can skew it towards people with out learning difficulties or dyslexia

It was a joke buffy. I know you don't follow sport so I was making fun of your choice of beckham

I'm really not David Beckham either, but thank you, buffy. I am very junior and I am not a physicist.

The point is that I trust people who are current, eminent physicists when they say they've changed their course because it was structurally stacked against women. And I do know that is what's happened. Not just in that one example, but in universities across the UK.

I'm going to go and be domestic now.

JeanneDeMontbaston wrote - "how dare we say 'as far as', which implies that Scandinavia is the natural point from which to begin measuring and locates America relative to it"

and you really mean North America, don't you?

Some Vikings who reached some parts of America are thought by some historians, some archaeologists and some other people to have started their journey from some places in Iceland, which may or may not be in Scandinavia, depending on which definition of Scandinavia you use.

Some Vikings reached present-day Canada not America.

Some Vikings who reached some parts of America or Canada started their journey from some places in Greenland, which is already in North America, but not in America.

kingie - I really want to answer that but I really do have to go.

It is fascinating, though. If you google Athena Swan, there is quite a bit of stuff about it.

That's not the case buffy

Bias is interesting. There was actually an interesting thread years ago on why women lose interest in physics. One woman said it was all about cars. Interesting that what merely serves as an example of the maths/science can put someone off a subject. I try to use non car (or gun) examples at least some of the time. Hard sometimes though.

Larry was the only one questioning jeanne's point of view