sexualisation of children vs slut shaming

[bikeandrun]

My DD is y6, having a great time with a fancy dress parades and final party. Being having lots of discussions with other mums and my mum about what the girls have been wearing. Finding my responses to this difficult
" cant believe mums let their daughters out of the house dressed like that" response to crop tops, mini skirts, lots of slap high heels etc

"girls don't understand the effect they have on men when they dress like that" this was aimed at a girl in dds year who has obviously gone through puberty and has a woman's body
Are just a few quotes I have heard
As a young single woman i used to enjoy dressing in an extreme and sexual way and felt empowered and confident.BUT

These girls are not sexual beings yet but is it slut shaming or just protective parenting to not want 11 year olds to dress like this.

I persuaded dd to wear converse rather than high heels mainly cos I know she wanted to jump around like a manic but I also really didn't like how she looked in those heels.
Help me find a feminist way through these feeling as I support my daughter as she grows into a woman

some of us cant afford to shop in Next. All of my dd's Sainsburys t-shirts are tight on my daughter, the shorts are practically hot pants. Yet my son has baggy t-shirts and shorts above the knee. One is 2 the other 3. I don't know why it should be thus... The sexual objectification of children starts young.

Captain buy bigger sizes on the t shirts. My daughter is tall and skinny, nothing is ever right on her!

captainproton your posts reads like you know the sexualisation of female children is wrong but you don't have any interest in changing it, you just want your daughter to avoid any damage that might be done by it. Is that a fair summary?

I only have a boy and my main annoyance with his clothes are the constant vehicle motifs and slogans about him being loud and cheeky. I don't think that'll do him much long term damage in the scheme of things though.

*its meant to say tight not right!

No it is not a fair assumption. I don't feel the need to drag my child into my personal opinions on how we should try to change things. I do follow the let clothes be clothes campaign, and I do try to get unisex clothing for my children but it is expensive. And my dd has a lot of navy clothing and not pink, as it seems that is the second colour available to girls.

I am not going to put her in a position of being called a slut or think she is up for it by men/boys before she knows what it all is about, properly understands that we shouldn't use that term. I don't care if you want your daughter to go out like that. I don't care if you think it is the only way to change the views of many by allowing your dd to dress like that. Personally I would rather we mothers boycotted stores that sold this shite but it's not always possible due to cost.

Just so you know captain, the situation in which your DD is most likely to be attacked is when she's in a house with a man she knows and trusts.

Yes it's the same for boys. They are expected to be tiny tearaways, mini-heartbreakers and car/dinosaur mad. My lad likes to play dolls with his sister I know that will change when he gets to playschool and society expects him to be into cars and dinosaurs. Just as my dd is all about princesses since she started. Sigh.

Yes thank you for stating the obvious there. Are there any parents on mumsnet not aware of this fact. But please do not think that women who are drunk/dressed in tight/short clothing don't get unwanted sexual attention either.

Of course they do. Because men attack women no matter what they do. Men don't attack women because those women are wearing certain clothes. They attack them because they are sexual predators.

I'm a feminist and my DDs are older teenagers. My observations are: primary aged, clothing was never an issue. They went to a posh prep with a unisex, very practical uniform. Very occasionally among their peers there might have been a crop top at a party, but it was irrelevant as the occasional national dress or slogan t shirt. When they went to single sex senior school, they both went through phases of heavy make up and rolling up their skirts in year 8/9. I decided I say nothing as I couldn't think of a safer environment to work out what messages that sends, wrongly or rightly, than in broad daylight with their friends. They both separately came home at different times incandescent at being chatted up or told off by teachers and now dress tbh pretty frumpily and rarely wear make up. I will occasionally remind them to take a coat and/ or comment that a certain outfit is great when with friends but not for taking the night bus home alone, but the whole concept of slut shaming and asking for it clothes has never risen.
I'm aware that not rolling up their skirts or wanting to wear crop tops etc until they were 14 is not the norm though.

Calm Down dear I don't think jeans and a sweater are a rape shield. I do think you need to respect the fact that some mothers will not allow a child completely innocent of sexual wants and desires to wear clothing that is seen as sexual by a fair proportion of society. And nor do we want our children to have to be confronted with the term slut. I will wait until they are mature enough to explore the rightswrongs etc. and I'm not going to think it's ok that clothing for girls has to be right/short right from toddler age. And I don't care if you think it's all fine and dandy cos rape statistics show what you are wearing makes no difference.

That's fine captain.

"And I don't care if you think it's all fine and dandy cos rape statistics show what you are wearing makes no difference."

Do we know for a fact that there are no kinds of rape or rapist for whom dress or drunkeness makes no difference? I wouldn't necessarily expect such factors to make any difference to the husband/boyfriend rapist, or the man lurking in the bushes awaiting a victim rapist, but what about the opportunist at a party or club rapist say.

What do you mean, JAPAB, that the victim somehow causes a man to rape her because she's drunk?

cailindana
Nope. Just querying about drink or dress making no difference to rapists.

JAPAB don't even bother trying. I can't seem to get the point across either. we are victim blaming apparently.

I haven't used the term victim blaming captain. I get your point - that men think women who dress a certain way are sluts so women have to dress differently so men don't assault them.

My point is that women in all sorts of clothes get raped.

Some rapists target drunk women, some target sober women, some target women who are completely covered up, some target women who are showing skin.

No I think some people assume that you are on the pull. Whether you are or not. It leads to unwanted groping and sleazy come ons. Never got that shit when clubbing in sensible attire.

There is a world of difference to having your arse pinched and a guy try to stick his tongue down your throat at a party and being raped. I don't want either to happen to my sexually unaware child. Be it a man or a boy doing it,

It's not just men who think wime who dress s certain way are sluts is it! Just because a woman calls a girl a slut doesn't mean she won't get upset by it.

So a woman's clothes lead to sexual assault?

*women

It leads to sexual attention, and some blokes can't help themselves. especially when you factor in drink. Are you saying wearing certain clothing doesn't lead to sexual attention. In my experience it does, and yes the more slutty my get up the more attention I got.

Some blokes can't help themselves??? So the poor loves just assault women because they have no control over their own behaviour?