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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

DP wants to go on new DC's BC

525 replies

Jackieharris · 18/05/2015 14:03

He has just raised this out of the blue.

He isn't on our eldest DC's bc. That's never caused a problem. Now he's saying he wants that changed too.

I know this is 'normal practice' (hence posting on fwr not aibu/chat/parenting/relationships) but it's made me really anxious.

It came so out of the blue, I didn't have much of a response prepared. I said it hadn't caused any problems so why change. I said I didn't want to give up my exclusive rights. He said why and I gave the hypothetical scenario of him running off with a younger woman then being able to restrict where I live etc after a split.

He knew about my stance on this before we had dc1. He knows I had a very bad relationship experience before him (life threatening violence, stalking and breaking into new house after break up type stuff) so I just won't ever feel 100% safe with any man ever and need to have the security that I could escape if that happened again. From my PoV if he was on bc he could potentially use this power to continue to abuse me even if I left. (So many threads like that on relationships board and I know some irl examples too)

As long as he was never violent I'd always let him have fair access to dcs so I said to him why does he want it unless he doesn't trust me?

I'm now going to be constantly worried he'll bring it up again. Maybe he won't. I'll not mention it if he doesn't.

OP posts:
YonicScrewdriver · 18/05/2015 23:37

She is not oppressing him, Regina.

OutsSelf · 18/05/2015 23:37

Regina, this is the feminist board. Male privilege is feminism 101, not something I farted, unfortunately. Are you this rude in real life?

Reginafalangie · 18/05/2015 23:37

But you cannot blame her non violent DP for that Out

This man has done nothing wrong and maybe the OP should have sort counselling before embarking on another relationship with a man.

It seems a bit unfair to expect her DP to not be a legally recognised parent to the children she chose to have with him because of her past issues.

Reginafalangie · 18/05/2015 23:40

I am fully aware of what board this is.

No not rude at all but I find this brand of feminism distasteful and damaging.

You are basically saying that because she was abused by a man that every man she ever has contact with is an abuser or should be treated as one. Therefore he has no rights no opinion and is to blame for oppressing women simply because he is a man.

I was always of the belief that feminism was not about man hating but a few of you come across exactly like that.

scallopsrgreat · 18/05/2015 23:41

So you don't recognise male privilege, Regina? Is that right?

scallopsrgreat · 18/05/2015 23:42

And telling someone they are talking out of their arse is rude in anyone's books.

Reginafalangie · 18/05/2015 23:43

She is not oppressing him, Regina.

Is she not?

I was under the impression that she is exercising her authority and power of being a mother to stop him being legally recognised as the children's father. Last time I looked that was part of the definition of oppression.

Reginafalangie · 18/05/2015 23:45

I recognise male privilege in many forms whether it be in the workplace on tv yadda yadda yadda. However I won't sit here and say it is ok to label all men because of the acts of some of their gender.

LassUnparalleled · 18/05/2015 23:46

I stopped posting here a few weeks ago as it was clear that unless one toed the party line one's opinion was not wanted.

This thread however has prompted me to post.
I'm astonished at the posters demanding we should empathise with OP despite the lack of empathy displayed by her (apparently no one apart from OP knows what it's like to be in an abusive relationship)
I'm astonished at the suggestion that because her partner agreed to this he may never change his mind. Imagine role reversing that one.

The OP of course started a thread a while back about how now she is a feminist she doesn't have friends who are married women with children and all her real friends are single parents or lesbians which sort of supports the notion her partner is just a sperm donor.

Completely agree with Regina re everything scallops has said.

Oh I'm not new, used to be called Still, but much prefer my new name

scallopsrgreat · 18/05/2015 23:47

No it isn't the definition of oppression. Oppression is systematic and systemic.

He hasn't lost any rights through not being on the BC.

YonicScrewdriver · 18/05/2015 23:48

Not at all.

They agreed this previously and there's no indication he didn't agree it freely.

He's now suggested things change and she's come on here because she feels uncomfortable about it.

If you scroll upthread, you'll notice that I think this is something they need to talk over and resolve. I thought that's where you were too, until you agreed with arsenal, who has an awful lot of form for posting unpleasantly on FWR, that the OP should be called an abusive bully.

She hasn't even said no to the request yet, FFS. Dial it back please; there's a real person at the end of this thread whose life was threatened by her ex.

OutsSelf · 18/05/2015 23:48

No one is blaming her nonviolent partner. I am pointing out the things he has in common with her ex. Male privilege is such that we do look more kindly on male speakers, we do listen to men when they call women irrational, women are constructed as less reliabke, more emotional, more manipulative than men. Which OP may well have experienced in handling her ex, and which she justifiably fears if things go bad with her current partner.

I actually agree her strategy might not be working the way she imagines. I am just suggesting we don't minimise or dismiss her fears that she won't get a fair hearing and can't safeguard her children against a malicious ex. I actually think they are reasonable fears in light of her previous experience.

YonicScrewdriver · 18/05/2015 23:49

Dragging another thread onto this one, Lass? That's pretty unkind.

NeedAScarfForMyGiraffe · 18/05/2015 23:50

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

scallopsrgreat · 18/05/2015 23:50

I haven't said he couldn't change his mind Lass. Of course he can. That doesn't mean the OP wouldn't be disconcerted by that.

YonicScrewdriver · 18/05/2015 23:51

And Lass? You were pretty unpleasant to a number of posters who remained polite to you in face of provocation.

So if you could dial down the "unwelcome" rhetoric, that would be appreciated.

TheCraicDealer · 18/05/2015 23:52

I don't get the relevance of wanting to know why he's changed his mind. If he's as sound as Jackie says he is, he probably realised that her previous relationship meant that having a baby was even more of a Big Fucking Deal. Perhaps he thought, "she's shit scared, I'll not argue this point". Then, having welcomed his firstborn into the world he's realised, actually, this is ace- "I want everyone, even the random registrar, to recognise that I'm their dad and they're my DD/DS and I'm proud of them". I've heard various male friends say they found it hard to connect to the baby when their partner was expecting, but once it arrived it was completely different. It's very possible that this has been niggling at him for some time and the imminent arrival of no. 2 has forced the issue or provided an 'in' for further discussion.

From your posts it seems highly unlikely that he's doing this to control or upset you, so I think you should try and have an open and honest discussion and try to come to some arrangement. And if it's one thing I've learnt on the r'ships board it's that PR is granted relatively easily if applied for; is this really worth all the angst or has it turned into something 'more' than him being on the bc?

I'd be pretty gutted at the idea that one of my progeny could be on series 54 of Who Do You Think You Are and not know that I was my DC's mum.

Reginafalangie · 18/05/2015 23:56

But she has chosen to have children with this man knowing he will always be in their life. Yes he agreed in the beginning but he has a right to rethink that and change his mind. Maybe he has fears. Maybe he is scared that she will just up and leave with his DC and it will be a lot harder to have his PR recognised. The OP changed her mind about men after her experience and that is ok. Why can't her DP change his mind about being on the BC because of his experience?

The only thing he has in common with the ex is that he is a man. That's it.

Yes her life was threatened but not by this man. Not by the man she has chosen to have children with. Why is it ok for her to hate all men/be fearful/protect herself but not ok for her DP to want to protect his rights as a parent?

OutsSelf · 18/05/2015 23:57

See, I find the way people jumped on here to kick OP who is obviously vulnerable distasteful and damaging.

It's perfectly possible to discuss her concerns with her without accusing her of abuse etc. I think in the context of the many structural oppressions of women it is possible to see her point of view without in any way denouncing all men or indeed her current partner. I've even suggested that he might be cack handedly trying to celebrate with OP how far her abusive situation is behind her. And let's not forget, he agreed to her conditions in the first place.

OutsSelf · 18/05/2015 23:59

I agree with the first para of your 23:56 statement Regina. Except I don't think years in, that PR will be hard for him to assert or prove without the BC

Maryz · 19/05/2015 00:01

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Reginafalangie · 19/05/2015 00:01

That is their opinion and they are entitled to it. Many posters didn't jump on the OP but they did point out that what she is asking is unreasonable and unfair to all concerned. Many suggested counselling for her and them. It was not a thread full of abuse.

And let's not forget, he agreed to her conditions in the first place.

So what? He was a first time father and probably didn't fully grasp how important being on the BC is. Why is he not allowed to change his mind?

LassUnparalleled · 19/05/2015 00:02

Really , not allowed to mention other threads? Why not? I think her other thread was very pertinent.

Some of the views on this thread are just horrible. Her ex was violent so the new partner has to pay for it?

He has to stick to the agreement made years ago?

OP no doubt expected unanimous support. Regina is correct- this looks very like man hating

Momagain1 · 19/05/2015 00:03

So, basically you think not having him on the bc gives you the right to take them away in response to whatever situation you deem suitable? It doesnt you know. He is still their dad, they have a right to know and be with him.

It isnt about you, no matter what your issues are. Nor is it about him. It's about the,children and their rights.

You can make this easy on them, by putting him on the bc and giving up the idea them being a toy you no longer have to share if he breaks the rules.

Or you can make it harder on them by forcing him to have to jump through medical tests and legal hoops to gain access to his children.

scallopsrgreat · 19/05/2015 00:04

He is allowed to change his mind. And she is allowed to be unsettled by that.