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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

Is pubic hair a feminist issue?

193 replies

Pipbin · 03/04/2015 18:57

Sorry if this has been done to death already.

Following on from another thread elsewhere there seems to be a divide between women who do and don't remove their pubic hair.

Some women who don't do it see it as another form of control that men have over women. That women are removing all their hair to please men and because it is now being normalised.
The women who do do it do so because they want to and they like it.

So, is it a feminist issue? Should women be able to do what they chose or are women doing it because it's another form of control even if they are doing it through their own free choice?

OP posts:
thenextday · 03/04/2015 21:11

But I feel good pinkpanther.
Its a personal choice.
I am not a 20 year old jellyhead.
I am 55.

ThatBloodyWoman · 03/04/2015 21:12

I can't for the life of me think what message is telling men to shave.
Is it Joey Essex or something? Confused
I don't know any men that I can imagine shaving anything other than their chin (occasionally)

meandjulio · 03/04/2015 21:13

I've definitely been influenced by 70s porn in that I like a massive bushy triangle down there and royal blue polyester suspenders

StillLostAtTheStation · 03/04/2015 21:13

I shave armpits because armpit hair is ugly and I assume anti-perspirant works better.
I never wear trousers and don't shave my legs in winter when I wear opaque tights but do in summer as I think hairy legs look awful.

Have never shaved pubic hair as always wear shorts style swimsuits bottoms or 50s style costumes, including the ones with sort of little skirts.
I have zero interest in navel gazing about why I make these choices or having to justify them to anyone and even less interest in whether they meet with approval from some feminist code of accepted behaviour.

Witchofthenorth · 03/04/2015 21:14

Well because when I started removing my pubic hair, I hadn't watched porn. The only person I spoke to about pubic hair was my mother, who proudly sported a full on bush! So I can say I wasn't influenced by any outside source. I have never read gossip or celeb mags, never watched SITC

As for my daughter? No just because I shave, I wouldn't expect her to follow suit. I would expect that I have I've raised her to feel confident that her body is hers alone and she can do to her body hair anything she wishes to

TondelayoSchwarzkopf · 03/04/2015 21:16

I always hope that this can be discussed as a feminist issue (around capitalism, porn culture, etc) without criticising and interrogating other women for the decisions* they make about their bodies.

This hope is always in vain.

*the mandatory disclaimer that no decision is being made in a vacuum

PilchardPrincess · 03/04/2015 21:19

What we think looks good or bad is culturally conditioned, though obviously. I mean surely no-one can deny that.

Yes some people are rare individuals who are ahead of the curve in the fashion stakes, or genuinely don't care, or whatever. But even "alternative" people tend to adhere to a set of ideas and codes relating to the subgroup they belong to.

But most of us are just trogging along and consuming all the messages and having them affect our behaviour to a greater or lesser extent.

I mean surely no-one believes that in the last 30 years or so, the % of women taking all their pubes off has gone from "not that common or on the average person's radar" to "high street bog standard loads and loads of people do it" because a larger % of women, with no prompting whatsoever from any sources, entirely independently decided to start doing it? That's just obviously, highly unlikely.

StillLostAtTheStation · 03/04/2015 21:19

How can people be so very sure that they haven't been influenced by the porn industry

Apart from 10 seconds by mistake on a tv in a Dutch hotel I've never seen any porn.

Hakluyt · 03/04/2015 21:20

"have zero interest in navel gazing about why I make these choices or having to justify them to anyone and even less interest in whether they meet with approval from some feminist code of accepted behaviour."

With the greatest of respect- what are you doing on this thread?Grin

EBearhug · 03/04/2015 21:23

I can't for the life of me think what message is telling men to shave.

Other men, I'd guess. The rise of glossy magazines like Men's Health. And probably some women - I can't say I'm overly keen on a very hairy back, but I don't think I'd actually tell a man I was with (don't know for sure, as have never been in that situation.) But I have known women who were quite strong in their opinions about what their boyfriends wore, so probably some of them were also quite firm on how the body under the clothes would look. I don't know. I think it's probably mostly other men, though.

I think it was Anais Nin who inspired me to see how shaving would feel. It was an experiment that was worth the oral sex afterwards, as I remember. But most of the time, can't be bothered - it was just to see how it felt. Obviously destined to be single forever. Oh well.

PilchardPrincess · 03/04/2015 21:23

Tondelayo I think it's for the same reason that there is always a struggle to talk about it at a societal level etc without some posters taking the topic as personal criticism.

These threads always read like a lot of misunderstandings to me TBH.

I dunno.

I wonder what the next thing will be, to talk about. What will they have us (men women whoever) doing next?

StillLostAtTheStation · 03/04/2015 21:23

Why not? The question was asked. I answered I see it as more of the perpetual agonising about everything.

PilchardPrincess · 03/04/2015 21:25

I expect the men in porn take their pubes off to some extent / trim them back not least to make their cocks look bigger.

Body hair on men just isn't really seen in adverts any more. Back hair was always a no-no really, at least for some decades.

The whole thing is depressing really and seems to be heading inexorably in the direction of just more and more and more work!

PilchardPrincess · 03/04/2015 21:26

Anal bleaching.

Yerk.

Labioplasty?

The whole "soft armpits" thing pisses me off.

They invent "problems" and then they take our time and money to solve them.

StillLostAtTheStation · 03/04/2015 21:33

Pilchard Off topic but the Dove "women of all shapes and sizes are lovely " ad was mentioned in another thread. It occurred to me that I don't know what they trying to sell as I've never bought it. So whatever it is I've got by fine without it.

PilchardPrincess · 03/04/2015 21:37

No I don't know what they are selling with that. So that campaign is obviously ineffective on you and me for whatever reason.

The soft armpits thing has entered my consciousness though, I found myself having a look at them when I was putting deoderant on. Not for softness but for, I don't know what, general appeal? And I thought, well fuck me, I've never thought to have a look at my armpits before, I've never paid them any attention. Thanks Dove.

I know that some of this stuff goes in, some of it doesn't. That I'm not immune to messages, that they are bombarded from all directions about all sorts of things all the time, and some stick and some don't. I am always surprised that so many people think they are genuinely immune to this stuff.

It's like unconscious bias - we had a talk on that at work - same sort of process I guess. The trick is to accept that no-one is immune, and try to be aware.

UnsolvedMystery · 03/04/2015 21:43

I think that if the driver had been decided by women because it felt 'fresher' the discovery would have been made before the huge change in availability of porn (with VCR in 1980s)
80s porn all had pubic hair.

I was born in the 60s and started shaving from being a teen - simply because I preferred how it felt. This was before I had my first boyfriend and before I ever saw any porn. I still prefer being bald. Never once have I been asked to do it by a partner. Boyfriends in the 80s-90s were generally surprised - they didn't expect it

But they should do it in the full knowledge that it is a profoundly anti feminist choice
It is this kind of sanctimonious shit that puts me off these feminist boards.
I am a feminist. Of course women should not feel pressured into shaving, but if they WANT to, it is because they are capable of making their own decisions and are more than capable of knowing if they prefer it that way.

My pubic hair - my choice!

TondelayoSchwarzkopf · 03/04/2015 21:55

PilchardPrincess you speak much sense.

PilchardPrincess · 03/04/2015 21:59

Smile that's nice!

(I agreed with you on a thread earlier so maybe we can form a mutual appreciation society Grin)

PilchardPrincess · 03/04/2015 22:04

Hmm that sounds a bit weird. I'm not a stalker! Just recognised your name. It was the thread about the work dress, so another feministy one.

YonicScrewdriver · 03/04/2015 22:06

"But they should do it in the full knowledge that it is a profoundly anti feminist choice
It is this kind of sanctimonious shit that puts me off these feminist boards."

Sigh.

I disagree with this poster on this point. Most of the other FWR regulars on this thread have said nothing like this. On AIBU, relationships, chat, in the news, politics etc, there will be many posts that are considerably more robust.

I wonder, do those individual posts put you off those boards?

Heigh ho.

UnsolvedMystery · 03/04/2015 22:06

I don't see how being waxed in such an intimate area would make you feel good

If you've never done it, you wouldn't know.
It feels clean and soft. I hate it when hairs get pulled or catch on clothes. I hate it when it feels sticky with blood or discharge. I like being able to wear and cut of swimwear or underwear without hairs poking out, it is more comfortable.

It's the same reason why I prefer snogging my husband when he is clean shaven. I don't like kissing him when he has a beard.
No pubic hair makes the whole area soft and more sensitive. It is more kissable and sensitive to the touch. That feels great.

Pinkpanthershow · 03/04/2015 22:10

I do agree with pilchard princess - behaviour has clearly been influenced. It just wasn't an issue 20 or 30 years ago. It is one more thing for women to worry about and to pay to remove something that wasn't a problem in the first place. Also, do women need to look like young girls, it feels wrong

elphiethegreat · 03/04/2015 22:11

I'm single and am always clean shaven. Not because I am expected to be, but because I like to be. It makes me feel cleanser, tidier etc.

If I was a man I'd likely feel the same

UnsolvedMystery · 03/04/2015 22:12

Yonic this subject has come up a number of times on the feminist boards and every time I have said that I shave out of free choice, I get told that I am wrong, that I am giving into social pressure to conform and I am making an anti-feminist choice - whatever the fuck that is!

I am slightly reassured that this thread has been more balanced that my previous encounters but that post really did put me off.