Feminist Pub 17: The Bluestocking frolics in the fells and fens of feminism

[AKnickerfulOfMenace]

This is the 17th incarnation of the Feminist Pub!

Here be goats, cannons and chat on feminism and related themes. Also snacks. And booze, copious booze.

Welcome!

Stormy, if you value your blood pressure, stay away.

Karen Danczuk recently disclosed that she had been abused as a child, her mother has apparently been fucking vile about her in a newspaper, so someone started a we believe you thread. A well known woman hating woman and yes, she really hates women and some of the other usual suspects have piled on and said that we believe you is basically a bit of a shit campaign because women lie about being raped.

Yeah. Nice.

stormy basically it's about the 'we believe you' campaign. A number of posters have confused it with assuming an accused rapist is guilty until innocent in a court environment. As opposed to supporting victims and encouraging them to come forward. As victims might lie and falsely accuse.

For supporting the campaign I got told 'karma will bite me on the arse' if my son's are ever falsely accused of rape.

As this group of posters includes one who told me if I wanted an abortion I shouldn't live in Northern Ireland. Incidentally, I'm quite angry.

Anyway, I've said my piece, and I've bowed out. I find the poster Enormouse mentioned to be one of the most obnoxious and vile people it has eve been my misfortune to converse with and I have no doubt she will try and engage with me again. Despite me asking her politely not to.

I've reported the thread. No doubt nothing will happen, but hey, it's the only way to stop this handmaidenry.

puffins you can't argue with stupid or vile, for that matter.

I just find it galling that she can be all over rights for rapists yet she thought it was fine for me to have none. I'm bowing out too. It's bad for my blood pressure.

I once got told ' never get in a pissing contest with a skunk.' I think that applies to this sort of thing. Someone who will throw around offensive insults and loaded phrases and misogynist bullshit will always keep going like a broken record. You'll never get anywhere. So sometimes you say your piece for anyone else who is interested and listening and leave them to it.

"The thing for don't understand is - how can anyone look at the current rape statistics (number of rapes, reporting rate, conviction rate, number of false accusations) and decide that the most important thing to do is to protect men? (Excluding male rape victims obv) And that it's really important to argue against a campaign to support victims?"

Honestly? People who think that rape doesn't really 'count' unless it's a stranger in a dark alley. Sober. In daytime. Other rapes, well they might be a bit unpleasant. But you know, lots of things in life are unpleasant. Cleaning up kid vomit. That's unpleasant. So unpleasant vs false accusation is an easy equation.

Beggars belief, but that's my take on how they can feel that way.

Also people who have bought into a weirdly moral idea of sex so that women who have 'let themselves down' by having ONS or whatever make false accusations. I blame religion a lot for how that has permeated even those without religious beliefs.

Actually, scratch dark alley. You shouldn't have walked down the alley. In a brightly lit high street.

I love the skunk and pissing contest metaphor

I'm just struggling with the level of stupid on the thread and people belligerently refusing to understand the difference between a support group and changing due legal process. The bit I find particularly funny is that they believe one poster is a lawyer because she says so. Awful bit of irony there.

Well, thanks to that particular misogynist arsehole poster I contributed my story to 'Amnestys my body, my rights campaign' and am going to the briefing for it later this week. Hopefully, it will achieve something for women here. It's weird how I got so much support from a huge number of posters here but that single persons comments still stay with me.

I think you're incredibly brave house and wish you luck for the trial. And also thank you

I was a bit as from what I've learnt in basic first year criminology is that the cps will not bring a trial to court without definitive proof of actus reus (that the guilty act can be proved beyond reasonable doubt) and mens rea (intention to commit said crime).

Well we know that at least one rape specialist police lot are totally onside, because we have a female police officer posting who has said that. We do have a male lawyer who's said some stupid stuff and, I believe, a male police officer who said some equally stupid shit.

Things are changing, but if a female lawyer is still propagating falsehoods about how rape victims are treated, that's worrying.

enormouse, your posts on that thread have galvanised me to step up my support and activism for ANS and other groups working in that area

*ASN

petula that means a lot. Thank you. And for all the support you offered. As did the vast majority of posters (i haven't forgotten any of it ). The web chat looks likely to be on the 2nd March.

house I guess they want to be seen as completely egalitarian and open minded and they possibly read the Daily Mail. But you can be so open minded your brain falls out.

What I don't understand is, if your friend said that her husband beat her, you would support her. You wouldn't wait for a trial and hedge your bets until then. This campaign is basically just about choosing to be the friend sometimes. We don't all have to pretend to be the jury.