Girls beating up boys

[Plymouthsupporter]

Has any girl on here ever beat up a boy?

Can't we be very clear that the men are the complete fucking problem here, and also say 'hey, this sort of phrase might not actually be the most useful in the long run, have you thought it through?'

But realistically what tools are there? quibbling over whether a 14yo should say " I don't fancy yours much" over " you're not good enough for mine" does nothing whatsoever to address the problem.

Yes language is important but when is language being used by the oppressed to get the oppressor to leave her alone and laugh at him at the same time, then in that moment does it matter?

comparing girls saying this, when the slur as defined by patriarchy is on themselves, with racism and homophobia feels back to front as well, to me.

Not a problem Jassy - agree. But the suggested alternatives were incredibly simplistic in some cases, and truly dangerous in others.

Responses are used to belittle the person, especially in front of others, to make them crawl . Get aggressive and you are likely to get an aggressive response back. You have to consider the SAFETY of the person making the response.

Sorry, was meant to say 'crawl away with their tail between their legs'.

The trouble is, yackity, that 'afford' is most often used to talk about price. How often do you use the word 'afford' in daily speech when it isn't about money?' And in a situation where women's bodies are consistently commodified, including a lot of really insidious stuff, thinking twice about language that suggests you could put a price on a woman's body doesn't seem like a huge leap.

Seven, I reckon there's more than one problem. One huge one is sexist men. Another is the the way women's bodies are treated in our culture and how women internalise those norms.

Yackity - agree with you there, it's about fitting the situation and some of the suggestions here won't work. But I think there are alternatives here.

jassy I Think it would be inappropriate at best to approach girls who have just said this to someone to ask them whether they've thought about what it means.

I'd be more inclined to say what did that man just say to you, and keep a bit of an eye on him if he looked like he was approaching Othery girls.

and if he was, then. um. Not sure what I'd do tbh

Oh come off it! I have NEVER heard of an example, either from myself or from my friends when teenagers, where saying 'you couldn't afford me' lead to a 'so how much money would I need' response.

Backing off has always been the response.

Someone that wouldn't back off to that response, wouldn't back off to any other response either.

I Would use the word predatory, rather than sexist, for these men, personally.

and I Really do have a problem with telling girls that there are wrong ways to deal with them, especially if those ways work.

Christ, I'm not saying it bloody would! If you'll read my posts you'll see that what makes me uncomfortable is the idea of girls and women talking about their bodies in terms of affordability - including on a thread in FWR which sparked this whole conversation.

Language matters as much because of the underlying assumptions it conveys to the user as well as to the recipient.

Agree with Seven - especially when the responses are accompanied with a sneer.

You're all focussing on the words, when it's so much more than that.

A quiet, timid 'you couldn't afford me' has absolutely no effect.

A sneering, crawl back under your rock attitude 'you couldn't afford me' conveys a wealth of meaning.

Well it needs to be changed elsewhere first.

To try and change it in these sort of circumstances is dangerous.

You take away the ammunition from people, without replacing it with effective alternatives.

Well yes I'd agree with that post jassy.

I have said throughout that it's a problematical phrase.

Seven - I'm unclear whether you don't think it's a problematic phrase, or whether you think it's just not problematic enough to bother about?

I'm not going to bother a bunch of girls I don't know. But if I'm talking to my cousin or niece or a poster on this thread, I might say 'hey, that's a weird phrase when you think about it' and have a chat about it.

Sorry, total cross post, Seven.

Yackity, that sneer can accompany other words, right? I don't get the defence of this phrase.

yackity and of course is only used in relative safety, more than one girl and when other people around.

You'd never use it if no one else were around.

I really wish there was a tool kit for girls and women against predatory men. That would be ace.

There is a tool kit - its called Self Defence classes.....

That would be extremely good. Though even better if all men were raised and socialised not to be predatory.

"But if I'm talking to my cousin or niece or a poster on this thread, I might say 'hey, that's a weird phrase when you think about it' and have a chat about it."

Thinks that's exactly the right thing to do, and have enjoyed the debate around it.

There's definitely pros and cons to the phrase.

Well I only have sons, so I'll be doing my bit for other girls!

Already had to pull them up on the 'girls can't do X' comments. They start it early!!!!!

So, I've just mentioned this thread to DD1 who is 15. She related this to me.

SHe was sitting alone at a busstop, eating a banana, which was part of her lunch. A passing man made a comment that she could do that to him, after. She just looked at him... and deliberately bit the top off the banana.

sanity!

Witty responses may turn away wrath when Fuck off creep would not.

On another thread a put down someone had heard was

"Go home dad...you're drunk"

I like that one

I'm 45 and don't get cat called anymore but I'm saving it!!!!