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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Depressing report - anal sex in under 18s

358 replies

noblegiraffe · 19/08/2014 17:45

bmjopen.bmj.com/content/4/8/e004996.full

The link goes into much more detail but the gist is:

"First, some men's narratives suggested that mutuality and consent for anal sex were not always a priority for them. Interviewees often spoke casually about penetration where women were likely to be hurt or coerced (“you can rip 'em if you try and force anal sex”; “you just keep going till they get fed up and let you do it anyway”), suggesting that not only do they expect coercion to be part of anal sex (in general, even if not for themselves personally), but that many of them accept or at least do not explicitly challenge it. Some events, particularly the ‘accidental’ penetration reported by some interviewees, were ambiguous in terms of whether or not they would be classed as rape (ie, non-consensual penetration), but we know from Jack's interview that ‘accidents’ may happen on purpose.

Second, women being badgered for anal sex appears to be considered normal.

Third, the commonly circulating ideas that ‘everyone’ enjoys it, and that women who do not are either flawed or simply keeping their enjoyment secret, help support the erroneous idea that a man pushing for anal sex is simply ‘persuading’ his partner to do something that ‘most girls would like’. Even Alicia's narrative contains some of the apparently coercive features of anal sex that other women report in negative terms, despite Alicia reporting enjoying anal sex.

Fourth, anal sex today appears to be a marker of (hetero)sexual achievement or experience, particularly for men.18 The society which our interviewees inhabit seems to reward men for sexual experience per se (‘every hole's a goal’) and, to some extent, rewards women for compliance with sexually ‘adventurous’ acts (enjoyment signifying not being naive, unrelaxed, etc), although women must balance this with the risk to their reputation. Women may also be under pressure to appear to enjoy or choose certain sexual practices: Gill describes a ‘postfeminist sensibility’ in contemporary media, where women are expected to present themselves as having chosen behaviours that conform to a stereotype of heterosexual male fantasy.24 The common portrayal of anal heterosex in terms of men breaking women's resistance can be compared with narratives about first vaginal intercourse25 and perhaps have superseded them to some degree in the British context where premarital vaginal intercourse is considered normal and so perhaps less of a ‘conquest’.

Fifth, many men do not express concern about possible pain for women, viewing it as inevitable. Less painful techniques (such as slower penetration) were rarely discussed."

OP posts:
FamiliesShareGerms · 29/08/2014 23:24

I'm so depressed by all this Sad

Callani · 02/09/2014 11:28

As sad as this report it, it doesn't surprise me - many of my earlier sexual partners were incredibly selfish in terms of pleasure and I think a lot of that was down to porn being so male focused. Their entire narrative of sex was "you get naked, give me a blow job and then we'll have sex in a variety of poses". There seemed to be no awareness of the importance of female stimulation, all enjoyment was vicarious or achieved via the wonder-penis and sensuality was nowhere to be seen. Still, despite putting up with some rather lacklustre sex, I still had the courage to say "you first" to the guy who pestered me for anal - unsurprisingly he wasn't keen.

grimbletart · 02/09/2014 11:41

I still had the courage to say "you first" to the guy who pestered me for anal - unsurprisingly he wasn't keen.

Good for you. This should be the stock answer to male pester power.

WineWineWine · 02/09/2014 15:12

many of my earlier sexual partners were incredibly selfish in terms of pleasure and I think a lot of that was down to porn being so male focused
I find it interesting that you think a lot of that was down to porn being so male focussed. In the days before porn, was it any different? I don't think so. The attitudes that many people have towards sex are far more deep rooted than the availability of porn could ever explain. Porn is a symptom of the problem, not the cause. Too many people see sex as something that men do to women, not something that is a jointly pleasurable venture.

In the days of 'close your eyes and think of England' or 'pull my nightie down when you are finished', it was not any better.

7Days · 02/09/2014 15:24

That's the point isn't it.

Sexual pleasure for women was not valued then, nor is it valued now. It may as well be 'Brace yourself Bridie'. I suppose it's arguable which attitude was worse.

But things aren't great now. Things should change.

I do think porn is both a symptom and a cause though, a horrible feedback loop.

WineWineWine · 02/09/2014 22:43

I agree 7days, so what is it that makes some people get it and other people not?
There's a lot more to it than porn, that's an overly simplistic explanation.
There's something in what we teach or don't teach some of our children, that leaves our girls laying back and thinking of England, and our boys seeing girls as conquests. Just telling them not to do things clearly doesn't achieve anything. We need better communication than that.

AskBasil · 02/09/2014 23:05

For one brief glorious moment for maybe five years, the sexual revolution meant that young girls actually expected to enjoy sex.

That didn't last, did it.

CoteDAzur · 02/09/2014 23:07

""you first" to the guy who pestered me for anal"

That would be an awesome MN t-shirt Grin

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