TERF

[ReallyFuckingFedUp]

So I have seen this expression a lot lately... and TERF gets thown out a lot when feminists are discussing things that are only capable of affecting biologically female women.

And I just can't get my head around it tbh. I don't think feminism should exclude people I think it helps everyone. I get really upset when white feminists forget about WOC or Lesbians, or other minority groups because the point of feminism is to make women's lives better. SO if there an issue that is unique to black women (for example) it is still all of our issue and should be dealt with by all feminist.

So if trans women want in on feminism why do they think can exclude the majority of women by saying we can't discuss our issues? And if trans people want to be accepted and have their rights championed by feminism is that fair since the majority of feminists aren't also suffering those same problems? Is it not a huge double standard?

Abortion rights and prenatal care and contraceptive health, vaginal rape. Are these things off the table now for feminism?

Am I getting it wrong, missing something? It feels to me like male privilege, telling women what they can and can't talk about..and doing so in a way where they actually feel guilty as though they have done something wrong.

Just fucking do it.

D'you know, I'd never thought of that.

Lucky there's someone who knows so much about women's experience, to tell me.

And women who call themselves feminists give this house room and don't notice the problem with it?

I just keep being astonished.

Because feminist experience oppression, they don't want to oppress. They are also politically active, so if you want to have a ready set of people to fight your corner ever at their own detriment you couldn't do better.

It's probably mostly because they've just not thought about it/are aware of how it is eroding our rights.

If you'd asked me a year ago I would have said I was pro trans rights because in my mind there was no real difference between being gay and being trans - it's just something that you have no real control over and doesn't affect anyone else. The idea that being pro-trans meant also being pro-penis in women's changing rooms hand't occurred to me. I also wasn't aware of the large number of trans women who have no intention of having surgery that feel it is their right to have sex with lesbians.

It was the thread about the transwoman who wanted to be a paraplegic that opened my eyes. It piqued my interest and found a post about it on gendertrender (awaits someone popping up to shout bingo). I ended up reading half the site that day but didn't really believe it until I started interacting with trans individuals and saw that everything GT said about how they like to silence women with accusations of being transphobic and in depth explanations of how mentioning that sort of thing severely damages their mental health.

"trans women are just as likely to commit violent crimes as anyone else with a Y chromosome ".

Is that true? I'm not sure that it is.

Nothing to add right now but marking my place as this is a very thought-provoking thread. I only came across the term TERF tonight in Laurie Penny's tweets this evening so it's a self-education moment for me.

BillnTed, the largest long-term follow-up study on transsexuals after sex reassignment showed that MTFs demonstrated male-pattern behaviour WRT to crime, including violent crime:

Second, regarding any crime, male-to-females had a significantly increased risk for crime compared to female controls (aHR 6.6; 95% CI 4.1–10.8) but not compared to males (aHR 0.8; 95% CI 0.5–1.2). This indicates that they retained a male pattern regarding criminality. The same was true regarding violent crime.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3043071/

There's also just the fact that some rapists and serial killers identify as transwomen, which automatically leads to 'females' being recorded as committing the types of crimes that women simply do not commit. Serial rapist Richard 'Sherri' Masbruch, serial killer Douglas 'Donna' Perry and serial rapist Christopher 'Jessica' Hambrook, who was mentioned up thread, are some examples. In Australia we have Paul 'Paula' Denyer, who murdered three women in the 1990s and is trying to force the state to pay for his gender reassignment.

These kinds of sadistic sexual crimes are intensely and peculiarly male, as everyone knows. Women do not stalk, torture, rape and murder other women for sexual satisfaction, but now, for the first time in history, we are being asked to believe that they do, and the worst kind of misogynistic violence that men inflict on women will be recorded as female violence. Nothing illustrates that we live in a male supremacy more clearly than the fact that men not only annihilate women for being women, they can, after doing this, claim to be women, and have the whole of society recognise this demand.

I agree DonkeySkin.

Since we are now not supposed to mention that someone is trans, this story can be reported (sorry, Daily Mail again) without mentioning that this is a transwoman:

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2366260/Body-Integrity-Identity-Disorder-Chloe-Jennings-White-58-disown-legs.html

Or the recent reports about an Arizona "woman" arrested for soliciting bestiality on Craigslist?

Next we'll have Ally Fogg along to say how men and women commit the same crimes.

Thanks, Donkey.

Here you go OP

Second thread

I lurked on both and found them hugely informative and helpful in figuring out my own stance on these issues.

Not sure what you are asking exactly, but speaking as member of many minority groups, and very close to several trans people, I think it is best if we remember, there are Trans people & there are Trans people.
Several hours ago, a fello "activist" became verbally abusive when I didn't accept his view of the trans issue. He is a hetero male btw

THIS THREAD WAS STARTED OVER SEVEN YEARS AGO

As would have been pointed out to Anti when posting, yet anti chose to resurrect this thread to contribute that post.

ZOMBIE THREAD

And more to the point, hadn't been updated for more than six and a half years before being resurrected.

And thanks to that I've now earwormed myself with this: