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Original poster

Anyone watching 'The other Boleyn girl'??

348 replies

Italiangreyhound · 01/06/2013 21:56

Seems like a pretty crap time to be a woman (or a girl)!

Anyone know how true it all is??

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Other_Boleyn_Girl_%282008_film%29

OP posts:
Louise1956 · 10/06/2013 05:32

I think Katherine Howard was extremely reckless. She must have known that what she was doing was extremely dangerous, but she went ahead and did it anyway. Perhaps she really thought she could get away with it, or that Henry was so besotted with her that he would forgive her anything.

Louise1956 · 10/06/2013 05:35

Anne Boleyn and Jane Seymour were undoubtedly both social climbers,and probably didn't require much pushing. they were both keen to achieve high status, and both clearly enjoyed being Queen.

Badvoc · 10/06/2013 11:11

Katherine Howard was only 16 when Henry married her.
What 16 year old has sense?
Especially one that is suddenly made queen from a servant? (Which is what ladies in waiting were when all said and done)
I admire Anne Boleyn. I can't like her...she was too cruel to Catherine of Aragon and Mary, but she was a woman of great learning and was a true believer in the reformed religion.
Jane Seymour I am not sure about. The speed at which Henry married her caused comment and unease at the time and Anne Boleyn wasnt a well liked queen! Even eustace chapuys who was Anne's sworn enemy thought she had been killed unlawfully and was innocent!
She played the game and lost.
Jane Seymour was just a pawn in her brothers schemes.

Inthebeginning · 10/06/2013 11:20

I used to love Phillippa Gregory books but their accuracies leave a lot to be desired.,then I read one that was part of a series with incest really graphically described but almost in a "pleasurable"way. It really hit a raw nerve with me.
Think the film adaptation is a pile of poo too.

Badvoc · 10/06/2013 11:22

Oh it is, definitely :)

LRDtheFeministDragon · 10/06/2013 12:39

louise, sorry, but that is really rubbish. It's a totally anachronistic way of looking at history, and you have no possible way of knowing they both 'enjoyed' being queen.

There is, however, plenty of evidence discussed on this thread to show why they might both (and particularly Anne) have ended up in that situation.

Presenting this as a nice little sexist 1950s drama where the woman who 'steals a husband' gets all the blame and the husband himself is blameless is ridiculous.

SaggyOldClothCatPuss · 10/06/2013 12:56

I disagree with the social climber comments about Anne. I get the impression she was more of a latter day Princess Diana. Young and impressionable, thought she could cope with the job. She was the pawn of a powerful family, and by all accounts a horrible father. His two children dead and he walked away scot free. Henry also wanted her. Does she give in and end up like her sister, married off to a nobody or aim for more of a life? Or maybe she thought that if she asked for marriage, Henry would lose interest and leave her alone?
Jane Seymour I see as much more of a schemer. Right from the start she played her hand almost perfectly, and achieved what she set out to do. Dying fixed her in history and in Henry's mind, in the position of his ideal wife. Who knows what would have happened if she lived. Surely a man like Henry would have been bored to death with her in a short while?

Chubfuddler · 10/06/2013 13:07

Jane had a son though so I don't think there would have been any further queens if she had lived. He's have shsgged around (if his health still allowed) but she would have been safe.

LRDtheFeministDragon · 10/06/2013 13:09

I think that's right, chub.

He would have seen it as God reassuring him he was doing the right thing.

Trills · 10/06/2013 13:20

I feel sorry for all of them. Henry included.

The pressure to secure the succession sounds very stressful, and the superstitions around "god blessing a marriage with children" (rather than it being a purely biological/physical/material thing that is happening) certainly didn't help.

SaggyOldClothCatPuss · 10/06/2013 15:44

See I'm not sure, Henry wrote his own rules. Who is to say that he wouldn't have turned against her when he got bored. She had 2 very ambitious brothers, who knows what would have happened! She died whilst she was still in favour, but he didn't seem to have a very long concentration span when it comes to women! And he put all of his children into the line of the sucession. There is no saying that he wouldn't have thrown off Jane, but kept his heir!

SaggyOldClothCatPuss · 10/06/2013 15:46

Think about all of the people Henry had relationships of one kind or another with, who were in high favour, but didn't ultimately give him what he wanted and ended up dead!

LRDtheFeministDragon · 10/06/2013 15:49

That's true.

TunipTheVegedude · 10/06/2013 15:50

You could well be right Saggy.
It had never occurred to me before that he might dump Jane but actually the idea that someone more fascinating might have come along does seem entirely possible.
Her brothers could have gone too far and then he could have set her up with them. Or someone who hated them could have framed her just like Anne was framed and convinced him she'd betrayed him.

TunipTheVegedude · 10/06/2013 16:11

In fact, in my alt hist version, I would have Norfolk doing the framing so he could put Mary Howard in her place. Perfect.

Badvoc · 10/06/2013 16:28

I absolutely think he would have tired of Jane eventually. Edward was a sickly child by all accounts.
Henry would have wanted more heirs.
If she had produced girls he would have been very displeased (sorry, make that religiously confused).
She could have gone one if 2 ways if his others were anything to go by...she would either have been put quietly aside/in a convent or she would have been executed in a trumped up charge/because her brothers were getting too powerful.
It chills me how little Edward felt for any of his family tbh...he signed the sea warrant for both his maternal uncles and may have done the same for his sisters had he lived....he certainly didn't think they were legitimate heirs.

Trills · 10/06/2013 16:33

I would very happily read a (novel-like) book based on the premise of "what if Jane Seymour hadn't died?"

LRDtheFeministDragon · 10/06/2013 16:35

Me too. I love alternative histories (Joan Aiken's ones set later on are brilliant too).

Badvoc · 10/06/2013 16:41

The Boleyn king is about what happened if Edward lived.....

cornypedicure · 10/06/2013 16:45

I must read the Boelyn king. Did he marry Jane Grey?

Badvoc · 10/06/2013 17:09

I haven't read it yet!
Just ordered it for my kindle....

Badvoc · 10/06/2013 17:10

Actually I am talking rubbish...it's about what would have happened if Anne had had a boy.
Sorry!

Trills · 10/06/2013 17:26

I have just added that to my Kindle price drop tracker thingy

Badvoc · 10/06/2013 18:40

What is this of which you speak trills!?

Trills · 10/06/2013 18:42

Kindle price drop tracker - it emails you when books on Kindle go down in price (books that you tell it you are interested in).

I use it as a sort of wishlist thingy - I've got enough books to read right now so anything that I think "that sounds good" I put on there and if it goes down in price before I run out of books then I buy it, if I run out of books then I look at the list and decide what to get next.