Mother-of-two jailed for making TWO false rape claims

[Zaraa]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2188112/Mother-jailed-making-TWO-false-rape-claims-men-dating-didnt-liaison.html

"Emma Saxon, 23, claimed she had been raped in a supermarket car park
Her alleged attacker was arrested and subjected to medical examination
Police spent 90 hours investigating before concluding it was a hoax"

She was given 8 months (although she could be out in far less than this). What do you think? Should she have been given more prison time or should be have been given something other than prison?

Where do you get this statistic from?

www.fawcettsociety.org.uk/index.asp?PageID=244

This is one example. I also got that statistic from many newspapers and journal articles.

"feels to me as if it's minimizing the crime of rape, which I feel is more serious than lying, I'm sorry, but I do feel that. "

In this case the lie was enormous and could have destroyed the lives of the men she lied about - landed them in prison, destroyed job prospects, sex offender's register etc etc. There is no anonymity for the accused, so it certainly tainted their reputation in the community.

I do think her mental health should be taken into account, and doubt by just chucking her into prison for eight month and then letting her out again, without actually working on her rehabilitation doesn't help anyone.

But she did commit a serious crime in my opinion, and I don't think she'd punished too harshly.

Here's a blogpost about a man who got a six month sentence for falsely accusing another man of sexual assault:

smokewithoutfiremichaeljackson.wordpress.com/2012/01/26/six-months-sentence-for-man-who-falsely-accused-louis-walsh-of-assault/

Fine and suspended six month prison sentence for false accusation of theft.

www.newsandstar.co.uk/news/cumbrian-chef-falsely-accused-former-colleague-of-theft-at-top-hotel-1.976411?referrerPath=/

Zaraa - that's a pretty poor selection of articles to try and make your point with: one is clearly non-UK (Times of India) and most of the rest involve rape of children under the age of consent which is treated more seriously than rape of an adult.

Unfortunately I can't find a neutral source, but it appears that the average sentence for rape is four years. So much lower than you are claiming.

Fixed penalty fines for false allegations of street robbery:
content.met.police.uk/News/Tackling-false-reporting/1300000431051/1257246745756?scope_id=1257246934609&sourceview=team

My point with the above three links is that the woman's crime is making a false allegation and that the sentence described seems in line with other examples of sentences for false allegations.

Personally I think that this shows the name of accused rapists should not be released until convicted. Yes its rare, but being accused of rape ruins lives. I have seen it first hand.
I am not sure about this thread/OP though.
She has been punished. Imo the punishment was right.
Also in regards to mothers going to prison, the courts are not punishing the children by sending the mothers to court. That's the mothers actions.

Well, if we're discussing sentences, here's a man who got no jail at all for rape.

www.winnipegfreepress.com/breakingnews/rape-victim-inviting-so-no-jail--rape-victim-inviting-so-no-jail-116801578.html

Sorry.

www.winnipegfreepress.com/breakingnews/rape-victim-inviting-so-no-jail--rape-victim-inviting-so-no-jail-116801578.html

Personally I think that this shows the name of accused rapists should not be released until convicted. Yes its rare, but being accused of rape ruins lives. I have seen it first hand.

Why differentiate rape from other crimes? Being accused of lots of crimes, like murder, violent robbery, or defrauding pensioners is no picnic, but you still get named. What about the principle of open justice? People complain hard enough about the family courts being 'secret', do people really want semi-secret rape trials as well (which is what defendant anonymity would amount to)?

Eldtrich is right - there was a story in the Standard last night about a man who had merely been investigated for pornographic images on his computer. He didn't have any child porn - yet his life had been ruined because people asssumed 'porn on computer' = 'child porn'. AND he was found not guilty because the photos the police and CPS objected to were of consenting adults (doing stuff that is certainly a minority pursuit, but not at all illegal). Why should someone accused of rape get preferential treatment not afforded to people accused of other crimes?

Zaraa, less than 8% of all reported rapes are false allegations. Less than 8%.

You can always tell which side someone falls on, by whether they focus on the false claims, with the aim of blowing them out of proportion, or whether they focus on the majority of very real claims, along with a large number of unreported rapes.

Should people who make false allegations be punished? If you bear in mind that 99% of rapists walk free, because their attack isn't reported, then no. I don't think punishing the small number of false claimants is appropriate.

If you bear in mind that, of the small number of false claimants, a large number have mental health issues, or have simply misidentified their attacker, for a number of reasons, then no. I don't think giving them a jail term is appropriate.

Would punishing this woman as harshly as they have put off other women who would report rape but are afraid they won't be believed? I'm not doubting that the false report of rape is a horrible thing to do (my brother was a victim of it but luckily he was at work at the time the person had claimed it had happened), but with the 'bullying' to make the report in the first place and the fact she was 'vulnerable' (such a general comment that it could mean anything) surely punishing her that badly won't solve the issues that lead her to make the false report? Can judges sentence her to compulsory counselling or something to treat the problem rather then the symptoms instead?

Well I think that depends on whether you believe she has been treated harshly.
I don't think this is a case of making an example or being overly harsh. I think it's quite a reasonable (based on info so far, my opinion might change if there are further disclosures rwlating to the "vulnerable" aspect) sentence for a second offence of this nature

I honestly don't believe that justme. As someone has said - if you are falsely accused, you have the chance of having the accusation proven wrong. You have no such chance of undoing a rape.

"As much damage"

Really...

I've never seen any evidence for this.

I don't think she has been treated harshly, FWIW. I think it is difficult always when someone has mental difficulties to know what is the right thing to do, but clearly the judge knew she had those difficulties and had been 'bullied' - it was part of the case - and he made his judgement based on that. If we had a different justice system where we didn't imprison people with mental difficulties, it might be different ... but we don't. Within the system as we have it, I think her sentence was fair and what she did was awful.

I don't think she should get the same sentence as a rapist.

The crime is the false allegation itself - mayorquimby might be able to comments on sentencing guidelines for that crime.

Justme, I posted the sentences for other false allegations to put this one in context. Do you also believe that false allegations of robbery should carry the same sentence as robbery?

No, sorry I do not believe that in the vast majority of cases the false allegation does as much harm as actually being raped. That really minimises how awful and damaging rape is, especially when perpetrated by someone one ought to be able to trust.

Also, it does seem that false allegations are rare, whereas rape is a commonplace. They really aren't equivalent problems in any way.

"The accusation of rape can do as much damage to a mans life and future as rape can do to a woman's."

No.

Justme, if asked to choose between being raped or facing a false accusation of rape, which do you think your DP/DH would choose?

The average sentence (according to the guardian) for perverting the cause of justice is 10 months. So this about average. Lying is not the same as committing a violent crime.