That school that is implanting girls with hormonal contraception without their parents knowing...

[BasilRathbone]

... that is a feminist issue, is it not?

Hormonal contraception can have very serious side effects. They are having 13 year old girls injected with them, I'm not sure whether they ask these girls first, if they are actually having sex and wanting sex.

I feel very disturbed by this, it smacks of contracepting girls ready for boys to fuck them without having to negotiate other ways of sexual activity, contraception, consent issues etc. Also where is the protection from sexually transmitted diseases in this approach to tackling teen pregnancy, where is the regard for the girl's long term health, where is the discussion around whether they actually want to be penetrated by boys at this stage of their lives and whether the sex they are having is truly consensual?

Would they inject boys with hormonal contraception with such alacrity?

What do you lot think?

Hmm. A mature 14 year old will also be aware that if there is an unplanned pregnancy, she can have an early abortion so her education doesn't need to be disrupted.

I must have been a freaky teenager, Sposh - because I honestly don't remember having any urge to be sexually active. But I don't have much of an urge to be sexually active now either, so freak it is.

Perhaps it was me that was the freak

I was 15 when that Gillick woman tried to get the law passed that meant that you would need parental permission to get contraceptive advice and for a few months whilst it went through parliament you did indeed need permission. Thankfully my mum was nice and liberal and came with me to the FPC otherwise I'd have been stuffed as I was in a long term relationship and (very) sexually active.

I took my own 15yr old the get the MAP recently. She doesn't need me to go with her because she's entitled to it all on her own but she wanted the company.

My now 15 year old went to the GP with her friend before her birthday to ask about the implant. I knew before hand, and was sat in the waiting room but I wasn't approached by the surgery.

My daughter has chosen the implant, not because she wants to have sex but because she has very heavy painful periods that limit her life. I had the implant fitted for exactly the same reason even though my DH has had a vasectomy and it has improved my quality of life considerably.

So although the Daily Wail can moan about schools forcing children to have long term hormone contraception, how many of those girls are doing it in order to relieve their period symptoms instead of wildly having sex behind the bike sheds.

The current implant used is Nexplanon and if it removed then the hormone effects leave the body as quickly as stopping taking the pill.

I think we need to remember that if underage girls are having sex with underage boys then they are breaking the law and if caught, those boys could end up on the sex offenders register.

As stupid as it may sound, at 15 you are not legally entitled to have sex and the repercussions could ruin a boy; imagine his job chances if he's put on the sex offenders register?

Both sexes need to be told where the law stands on this as it is potentially very serious. They also need to be told that hormonal implants or the pill will not protect you from STIs and that no contraception is 100% safe. They also need to be told that there is no shame in saying no. Comments about 17yr olds remaining a virgin whilst with a boyfriend make it seem like being a virgin is a freaky way to be. If that is what adults think then imagine what these kids are saying to each other? The pressures to have sex with different men is huge for teenage girls and I think society needs to regress a bit there. There seems to be more shame to remain a virgin at 20 than to have shagged 10 boys by the time you get to 20.

It seems to ok to tell our children HOW to have sex, but not to tell them about all the risks involved so they can make properly informed choices.

mrspnut - I was put on the pill due to my very heavy and very painful periods.
I wish I never had been though. I wish my GP had picked up on my severe depression and the pill and I wish I had read the side effects on the information leaflet (instead of thinking that was just for people who didn't want to get pregnant).

That law is (almost) never enforced though Rhubarb, unless there is an age gap bigger than about 3 or 4 years I think.

It's specifically designed to protect children from peadophiles, rather than to stop them having sex with each other.

Basil, it is enforced if the boy is older than the girl. So a boy of 17 who is having a sexual relationship with a 15yo is liable to prosecution, even if she is a 'mature' 15yo.

My dd has also been on the pill (and subsequently the implant) since she was 13, due to incredibly heavy periods.

Her periods were painful and really affecting her life. She is very sporty and suffered the mortification of blood leaking whilst playing rugby etc. She was also in agonising pain, had anaemia etc.

I don't think painful periods are something which women should suffer, so after trying usual routes (menlafamic acid etc) she went on the pill, and then the implant. She doesn't get any periods at all now, and is able to live a normal life.

I am aware and vigilant of the issue of hormonal contraception, I know they don't suit anyone.

But, to cut a long (and dull) story short, if I was not the kind of mother who my dd would have been comfortable talking t6o about periods, I would like to think that she could go to a drop in centre to discuss it in privacy.

The BBC has done a useful encyclopedia on underage sex and the law

Rhubarb I also had bad experiences with the pill. I went on it because of severe PMT, which it replaced with equally severe episodes of depression that came on suddenly and with no warning - a much more dangerous scenario.
And this wasn't one of the side-effects described in the leaflet, which I read assiduously.

Well that's what I mean.

They don't actually tell you what the side effects are.

You have to read a book before you find out about all the effects hormonal contraception might have on you. And the thing is, most people don't bother, because the really horrible side effects are actually very rare and most of us don't know anyone who suffered from them. But if you happen to be one of those very rare cases, it's a bit of a bummer.

Even grown women don't know the potential effects of the pill. I very much doubt they are giving teenage girls better info than they're giving us.

'the really horrible side effects are actually very rare'

and actually some of them may not be rare, they just don't get reported. I never reported to anyone what happened with the Pill and my depression, I just stopped taking it, so it won't have found its way into the stats. It was only afterwards I realised it was a side-effect of the Pill rather than a side-effect of me being rubbish.

(like the thing about vaccine reactions where if the doctor has already formed the view that the fit is not caused by the vaccine, they sometimes do not even report it)

I know of so many women who have suffered severe depression whilst on Microgynon, yet it is still not widely known to have this side effect. I doubt this is a rare case at all and there are probably many other women suffering and thinking that it's just them.

My dh suggested I come off the pill for a bit and when I did, it was like someone had thrown open the curtains.

Teenagers, with their hormones all over the place anyway shouldn't be prescribed these hormonal contraceptives without their mothers being informed so they can advise their own children based on their own experience and can inform the GP of any of their own medical history concerning the pill.

My dd seemed to inherit my mother's menstruation cycle, in that she was utterly impossible to deal with a week before her period, was in agony during, and weak and seemingly ill afterwards.

The pill helped enormously with that - like you said Rhibarb it was like the curtains opened for her.

I still think girls that age should be prescribed these things in confidence.

How on earth could one parent a child who is being given something that is effectively a mood-altering drug, without knowing that these things may be a major factor in any behavioural problems they are having?

Giving a 13 year old condoms is one thing, but this is so much more invasive.

TheRhubarb wrote - "The BBC has done a useful encyclopedia on underage sex and the law".

The BBC web page appears to date from 1999. The legalities might have changed as a result of more recent legislation, e.g the various sexual offences acts which became law this century.

Of cours ein an ideal world, sexually active teenagers tell their parents that they are having sex, and make an appointment with the family GP to discuss contraception. In a non-ideal world teenagers would rather take the risks of unprotected sex than be seen in the GP waiting room by their neighbours, and we have high (for Western Europe) teenage pregnancy rates.

I remember going to a similar clinic (although not in a school) aged 15, and being ver intimidated by it all. And that was a clinic set up for teenagers! Good access to contraceptives is important, more so than parental knowledge if the teenager doesn't feel able to approach their parents.

I say this as someone who doesn't do well with hormonal contraceptives btw, and will be telling DD about side effects I suffered when she is around that age.

I think there's a real dilemma here.

I want girls to be able to access contraception without having to tell their parents, because some parents are nuts and won't let them have it because of their opposition to their children having sexual intercourse.

OTOH, I have no faith in the medical profession, to protect the interests of girls better than those of their loony parents.

So what's the answer?

Mine would be, that they're only allowed to prescribe barrier methods which don't have any long term side effects. OTOH I know that's wrong, because some girls prefer the pill and want it for periods as well as contraception.

So I still don't have an answer.

Good point vesuvia.

MrsHoarder, for those teenagers there are condoms. Why would you want your child to get hormonal implants just to protect her against pregnancy? It can alter her mood, cause other side effects and it doesn't protect against STIs. Whereas a condom has no known side effects and protects against both pregnancy AND STIs and ensures that the boy takes his fair share of responsibility too (unless he's one of these fuckwit boys who tell girls that they won't wear a condom).

And even if they don't want it for periods, if they're happy with it just as a contraceptive method, they have the right to have it - I don't mean to imply that girls should only have the pill for problems iwth their periods.

I don't know.
Certainly it's her body, her right etc.

But I don't know of any 13 year old who has the emotional maturity to deal with the consequences of sex. The consequences are not just pregnancy, though that's all anybody seems to see, never mind the emotions etc. Once the pregnancy problem is sorted, a lot of teens -and adults - will think that's it then, there's no reason not to.

I suspect it won't help the kind of girls who need help the most, the vulnerable ones who seek validation from sexual encounters.
The girls with the loving boyfriends would be more likely to insist on condoms - or feel better able to slow down the rate of experimentation to what they are comfortable with (guessing that few well adjusted are ready for full sex at 13), the girls with the close mothers will have a range of options and guidance.

I do find it very bizarre, this move from medics pushing condoms as they did when I was a teen in the 80s to pushing hormonal implants which seem to be worse for the women in so many ways.

Do they not think the recent rise in STDs (the comeback of syphilis, gonorrhoea etc) has anything to do with it?

I know of many girls who have suffered severe depression after teenage pregnancy and/ or abortion. Talking with the girls I work with most would have preferred an implant to the alternatives they experienced. Their world view doesn't allow that sex before 16 is wrong for them or their partners. I can't think of a single criminal prosecution or even warning against any of their partners regardless of age gap. I think theory and practice are very different on this point.

As a point of principle competence is all important, parental input irrelevant unless sought. Around this though care should be good, I have sat and listened as clinics have shared full info re contraceptive choices and talked about wider issues with girls younger than 16. Really I believe that most sexually active 13 year olds are vulnerable, I can't see any situation where pregnancy helps them. In the absence of being able to change their wider situation at least an implant, if they want one, helps with avoiding pregnancy or abortion.

I would have signed up in a flash as a teen, I do remember those strong urges and what fun I had gratifying them. I remember too how busy I was trying not to get pregnant and how I failed on this point...

Agreed Tunip.

I do think there's weird double standard regarding sex in society.
On the one hand it's just another function, a bit of fun, why not, it's no big deal. (This is a down grade from the sixties idea of it's a beautiful, life affirming thing that shouldn't be shrouded in shame).

OTOH the older view remains - it's so serious, a person cannot possibly be expected to do without it, having sex outside your relationship is the worst thing you could do.

So which is it? Whatever suits, apparently. I pity young teens trying to develop their own stance on it with these contradictory messages being shoved at them simultaneously.