That school that is implanting girls with hormonal contraception without their parents knowing...

[BasilRathbone]

... that is a feminist issue, is it not?

Hormonal contraception can have very serious side effects. They are having 13 year old girls injected with them, I'm not sure whether they ask these girls first, if they are actually having sex and wanting sex.

I feel very disturbed by this, it smacks of contracepting girls ready for boys to fuck them without having to negotiate other ways of sexual activity, contraception, consent issues etc. Also where is the protection from sexually transmitted diseases in this approach to tackling teen pregnancy, where is the regard for the girl's long term health, where is the discussion around whether they actually want to be penetrated by boys at this stage of their lives and whether the sex they are having is truly consensual?

Would they inject boys with hormonal contraception with such alacrity?

What do you lot think?

[OrmIrian]

"How on earth could a 13yr-old have enough knowledge and emotional maturity to decide whether or not they want to take that particular risk?"

Agreed, but I suspect that quite a few 13yr olds don't have enough knowledge and emotional maturity to deal with pregnancy and/or termination either. I guess it's a pragmatic decision to supply these implants. I can't say I like it though.

[SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius]

I have a nasty reaction to adrenaline in local anaesthetics - palpitations and feeling utterly dreadful. Would you be happy if your child had such a reaction after receiving a local anaesthetic without your knowledge? I wouldn't.

[SaraBellumHertz]

basil what evidence do you have for saying that the male pill is not being released because it carries the same risks as the female pill?

[AThingInYourLife]

But Basil - that is a different issue

If your problem is with hormonal contraceptives and the damage they do to women, then I'm right there with you.

But denying access to young girls because of their age puts you on dodgy ground, IMO.

PMSL at Mail Online being the world's most popular news site because of SEO :o

[BasilRathbone]

I wouldn't object if they were supplying condoms or diaphragms. Or even the pill - you can stop taking it if you get a severe reaction or you just don't fancy feeling sick and bloated all the time. You can't do that with an implant, it's more work to get rid of.

[BasilRathbone]

Well I don't think that's a different issue in the sense that as a grown woman, I can choose to weigh up the risks of long term contraception and decide that the benefits outweigh the risks.

But as a child, I can't. Which is why I think it would be better that any contraception they supply, is something that doesn't have long term effects, or that can at least be quickly stopped if there is a bad reaction.

[SaraBellumHertz]

Tbh if my DD had a bad reaction to an anesthetic that she had received whilst covertly obtaining contraceptive I would be too busy feeling disappointed that I had failed so miserably in my parenting that she had been unable to discuss the matt with me to feel unhappy with/in relation to anyone/thing else.

[AThingInYourLife]

I wouldn't be happy for my child to be given a contraceptive implant without my knowledge, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't have the right to have one.

Presumably your medical condition is in your medical notes?

Not a secret that only your mother knows?

[AThingInYourLife]

"Which is why I think it would be better that any contraception they supply, is something that doesn't have long term effects, or that can at least be quickly stopped if there is a bad reaction."

Yes, that would be better.

[SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius]

Yes, my medical condition is in my notes, but as I said earlier, the family doctors of the girls given the contraceptive implants were unaware of this too - which suggests to me that they hadn't been asked for the girls' medical records.

[TheRhubarb]

My experience of hormonal contraceptives is a bad one. I suffered severe depression whilst on the combined pill, so much so that I tried to hurt myself and those I loved.
On the mini pill I just bled and bled until I became anaemic and had to come off them.

I will impart this knowledge to my daughter so that she can decide when she is old enough which contraceptive device to choose. But many of these girls don't know the side effects and their mothers probably haven't given them their own medical history because they don't think they are taking contraception.

This is something that should be discussed with a family GP who has the families medical history and also, if possible, with the parents are the mother may well be able to pass on vital information that may or may not affect the daughter.

I think that any school which advocates this does not have much faith in their own sex education policy. Children need to be taught about the law, about keeping themselves safe, about being able to say no and about how to obtain contraception if they need to.
Also what does it say about the boys responsibility?

Many children that age may also not be aware that having unprotected sex can lead to STIs.

It's impossible to say how this school is able to do this and there surely must be more to this story, but there are so many issues that this raises and so many reasons why it's a bad idea.
Make condoms readily available if they must, but don't go around giving this to girls as it only protects against pregnancy and lets boys get away scott free.

[SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius]

Rhubarb raises a good point. Even if the girl is aware of her own medical history/allergies/bad drug reactions, she may not be aware of familial medical history that could make a contraceptive implant contraindicated, even dangerous for her.

[coppertop]

"Bear in mind that when your child reaches that age you've had 13 years to build up the kind of open, supportive, trusting relationship with your daughter that would enable discussions about matters of health, sex and relationships to take place within the family."

True, but it still means that ultimately a 13yr-old child still has to decide whether or not the convenience of an implant outweighs the small chance of it also leading to her becoming disabled several years later. I'm not sure I would want to make that choice even as an adult.

I recently had to sign a consent form to allow the school to give my ds paracetomol if he feels ill. He will be 12 this year. If he's deemed incapable of deciding whether or not he should be given a single paracetomol, how come a girl of a year older is suddenly able to decide whether to be injected with hormones?

By all means make other methods of contraception available.

[SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius]

Side effects of norplant (an implanted hormonal contraceptive):

Side effects may include irregular menstrual periods for the first approximately three months, including periods lasting longer than normal, bleeding or spotting between periods, heavy bleeding, or going with no period for the mentioned period of time. Common side effects include weight gain, nervousness, anxiety, nausea, vomiting, mastalgia, dizziness, dermatitis/rash, hirsutism, scalp-hair loss, headache, depression, and acne. Sometimes, pain, itching or infection at the site of the implant will occur. Ovarian cysts may also occur, but usually do not require treatment, although they can cause pain even if benign.

I would not want any child of mine being given a drug that had all these potential side effects without my knowledge.

[OnlyANinja]

The school part is a red herring.

The question is whether you approve of technically-underage-yet-deemed-competent-to-make-this-choice teenagers being given a contraceptive implant at a drop-in clinic.

[BasilRathbone]

Yes, sorry, you're right, the school is a red herring. I was just short-handing and being careless.

I suppose the issue is, does the medical profession have the right to give your child a drug which has potentially serious side effects, without your consent.

Only in the area of contraception, is it allowed to do this.

And the difficulty is that even the normal pill, can cause serious health problems for a tiny minority of people. So in a sense, is the long term hormonal issue a red herring as well?

[BasilRathbone]

Although of course, it's allowed to take your child into care and get a court order to give your child medication, if you refuse it. (They're always talking about Jehovah's Witnesses in connection with this, but I don't know if they often do it)

[OnlyANinja]

Only in the area of contraception, is it allowed to do this.

No.

"As a matter of Law the parental right to determine whether or not their minor child below the age of sixteen will have medical treatment terminates if and when the child achieves sufficient understanding and intelligence to understand fully what is proposed."

In the matter of any medication under-16s can choose to consent to their own treatment without the knowledge of their parents of they are deemed competent. It's only in the area of contraception that they feel the need to do this, because we are all so hung up on sex.

[BasilRathbone]

Ah right, I didn't know that.

I thought you had to sign all consent forms if your kids are getting operations, medications etc>?

At what age are they allowed to sign their own forms then?

[Sposh]

I think that girls who pass Fraser Competence should have every right to access contraception without their parent's knowledge.

Victoria Gillick's daughter became a single mother at about 18yrs old, I believe. I suspect that was because she didn't feel able to talk to her mother about contraception.

There are many parents out there who are horrified at the idea of their kids being sexually active under the age of 16 but that doesn't mean it isn't happening. I've read posts on MN where a mother swears that (for example) a 17yr old daughter is still a virgin despite having had a boyfriend for two years Not impossible, of course, but highly unlikely I would have thought!

[lubeybooby]

My DD is 15, but if for any reason she felt she couldn't come to me to discuss contraception from 13 onwards I would be happy for any school or family planning clinic to administer what she needed without my consent or knowledge. It's HER body and her right.

However they would also need to heavily press the issue of condoms and STI prevention, and provide free condoms.

I do know my DD would be able to come to me.. but some girls might have, say, abusive or strictly religious parents they can't approach - surely anyone would rather they were protected against pregnancy if they are going to be sexually active anyway (which some will be no matter what rules or curfews are in place at home)

[sportsfanatic]

I disagree with this idea that it is the mature under 16's who are ready for sex, whether or not they use contraception.

A truly mature 14 year old will have researched contraception thoroughly and will know that no contraceptive is 100% effective even if used perfectly. She will know that therefore there is a small risk of pregnancy. And if she is unlucky she then runs the risk of having a baby she may not be emotionally ready to cope with, her education (still at a basic stage) may well suffer and the parents she has chosen to cut out of her life in this aspect, will probably have to help her pick up the pieces. A mature 14 year old will understand that she has a lifetime ahead for sex and her priorities now should be different. The inability for delayed gratification - to wait until a more appropriate age to have sex - is a true sign of maturity.

However, I suppose giving a child the ability to have sex while minimising the risk of pregnancy (though not STIs unless a condom is also used) is better than pregnancy if a child is determined to act immaturely. Though what would happen to the doctor/nurse who prescribes without parental authority if the child suffers e.g. a DVT or other life-threatening side effect I am not sure.....

[OnlyANinja]

So a mature woman is one who doesn't have sex at all unless she is prepared to have a child, is that what you're saying?

[Charlotteperkins]

As long as the girls are fully aware of the pros and cons I think this is a good thing and should be available in all schools.

[Sposh]

Blimey sportsfanatic, do you not remember being a teenager and how strong the urge to be sexually active was? I'm not sure that the desire to defer sexual activity is a sign of maturity!