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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

anyone feel uncomfortable about Military Wives Choir?

263 replies

Bennifer · 19/12/2011 13:20

That?s it really. Although I like the idea that the wives are raising money for charity ~(and that we won't have an X factor number 1), there?s something a little unsettling about the military wives angle I can?t quite put my finger on. Am I overthinking this?

OP posts:
yellowraincoat · 19/12/2011 13:38

But Cinderfella, isn't that sad? That we are still at a point where men would feel embarrassed about joining something that is "for women"?

It's good you're not offended BluddyMoFo, I'm not offended either. Just here to discuss things.

MudAndGlitter · 19/12/2011 13:39

I don't get feminism tbh. I agree with equality for men and women but half the threads on here with people getting hysterical over female choirs and male Morris dancers seems pathetic and only really serves to back up male myths about whinging women.

PortBackForChristmas · 19/12/2011 13:39

I find it a little unsettling too ... and again, can't quite put my finger on why since it's for a good cause and all that. Having said that, i didn't watch the programme - perhaps if i had i would be less uneasy about it all. Perhaps it's the 'wives' bit reminds me too much of 'readers' wives'...

SardineQueen · 19/12/2011 13:40

Bluddy that doesn't make sense though.
Someone upthread said the name is suitable as they are wives.
But if lots of them aren't wives then the whole thing is bizarre.

AliBellandthe40jingles · 19/12/2011 13:40

Sardine - in the program there was a bit where they were discussing the name. Gareth said they could call themselves the Military WAGs Choir if they wanted to...

I actually think that it takes a very special kind of woman to be a forces wife, especially at the moment when deployments are regular and dangerous, unlike in the more recent past.

sportsfanatic · 19/12/2011 13:40

So what happened to the women who wanted to sing but were not married to their partners?

They were in the choir as well. In the first episode they agreed to the choir name because they wanted to identify with the barracks but singling out girl friends made the name too long. Nobody wanted it to be the WAGS choir (as I recall). Grin

yellowraincoat · 19/12/2011 13:40

Who's getting hysterical MudAndGlitter?

BluddyMoFo · 19/12/2011 13:40

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster
Bennifer · 19/12/2011 13:41

mudandglitter,

I don't want to give the impression I'm hysterical about this, or outraged, just a little uneasy

OP posts:
anastaisia · 19/12/2011 13:41

I see what you're saying. Not sure how I feel but yes, wouldn't a mixed choir have been nice - to recognise that we have military personnel of both genders. I mean some of them might even be in same sex relationships too. Military wives of brave male soldiers have every reason to be proud of their partners and themselves but it IS a bit stereotyped isn't it and seems to make the others a bit less visible....

MudAndGlitter · 19/12/2011 13:41

Ok hysterical about this thread was a slight exaggeration but it just seems like a non event.
Of course that is my opinion and I know nothing about feminism.

Original poster
Bennifer · 19/12/2011 13:41

I'm not suggesting I'm saying they shouldn't be allowed to start a choir, I think you might be missing my (admittedly ill-defined) point.

OP posts:
PortBackForChristmas · 19/12/2011 13:42

The men do job x
The women are married to the men that do job x

I assume individually they have more going for them than that...

BluddyMoFo · 19/12/2011 13:42

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

yellowraincoat · 19/12/2011 13:43

I don't think anyone is suggesting anyone force anyone to do anything, BluddyMoFo.

I think we just wanted to discuss how gender roles are still so defined and how that's still so normal for most people that it's not even questioned.

MudAndGlitter · 19/12/2011 13:43

I also don't think so much should be made of the use of 'wives'. It is what they are. Partners of members of the military probably wouldn't have fit on the cd box

SardineQueen · 19/12/2011 13:44

So all of the names considered were to do with being girlfriends, wives, partners? That seems a little odd.

Although I haven't actually heard of them before or heard the song so I don't really know anything about it.

Did they not consider any names which identified them as themselves, rather than to do with their relationships?

AliBellandthe40jingles · 19/12/2011 13:44

OP I do see where you are coming from, I've had thoughts along the same lines.

But I think it is one situation where you have to be more pragmatic. Yes there are women in the military, but the reality of the situation is that very few of them continue in roles that actively deploy once they have children. The majority transfer to roles where they stay in the UK, and largely stay on base - or they leave the military altogether.
Now whether that is a feminist issue is another matter, but it is the reality.

yellowraincoat · 19/12/2011 13:45

Why not read what people are talking about then, MudAndGlitter? A few years ago, I knew nothing about feminism either.

Please don't get the impression that feminists are shrieking harpies who want to castrate all men (although some of us are ;) ) Most feminists just want equality and to be able to discuss things and come to conclusions without being told they are being hysterical.

SardineQueen · 19/12/2011 13:45
Confused

So did they let unmarried people in
Or not

And if they did, then they're not bloody wives are they, so why the stupid name.

yellowraincoat · 19/12/2011 13:46

Yes, SQ, they did.

I think they said that WAGS (wives and girlfriends) would have sounded stupid.

I'm not sure the name bothers me that much though.

SardineQueen · 19/12/2011 13:47

They didn't think of any names to do with what they were about?

Like waiting
Hoping
Worrying
Keeping the homefires burning type stuff?

Just names to do with them being in a relationship?

I find that a bit odd.

MmeLindor. · 19/12/2011 13:48

So all of the names considered were to do with being girlfriends, wives, partners? That seems a little odd..

sardinequeen
The group, the choir came about when Gareth Malone went into the barracks and said he would like to start a choir.

The women are not all married, some of them are DPs but the alternative name was daft, Military WAGs.

It is not odd, it is just a description.

MudAndGlitter · 19/12/2011 13:48

I have glanced at the feminist boards but all that's stuck in my mind is that I shouldn't let DD have anything Disney princess and leaves me confused as to whether it's ok to put her in pink or dresses.
Although she's got a garage for Xmas and DS has a doll.
I would love to find out more about it but at the same time I feel as though it's a terrible thing for me to sit at home and raise the kids until I qualify when the reality is that's what works for us at present.

SardineQueen · 19/12/2011 13:49

Also would like to clarify that I am not calling for a ban or suggesting that all these women should be banished or anything.

Just chatting on the internet.

I suppose it's just the idea of women simply identifying as "wife" has throwback connotations to do with worth and being property and so on.

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