To all those who say on threads 'I am too scared to go into feminism' - this topic isn't scary!

[GetOrfMoiLand]

I think it's a shame when I see threads where the OP says 'I am too scared to put this in feminism' or something.

I am certainly not knowledgeable about feminist theory, but have never felt that my opinion on this thread wasn't wanted or I was vilified for stating what I believed.

I think this topic is pretty inclusive - yes some people are forthright with their opinions, but nobody's word is god, and I would hate to think that mumsnetters were put off contributing to threads in this topic because they mistakenly think the posters on here are viragos.

'Susan Faludi wrote a really interesting chapter on women in the Republic party and/ or conservative Christian churches in the US in her book Backlash.'

Amazon ahoy. Thank you.

I'm not a radical feminist but I have enjoyed listening to the radical feminist points of view on this board. These threads have effectively managed to shut those voices down, either by forcing them to post less or not at all or by ensuring the waste their time and energy to defend themselves rather than discuss their feminism.

Backlash is one of the most depressing books I've ever read

Brace yourself Goblin

SGM
Susan Faludi wrote a really interesting chapter on women in the Republic party and/ or conservative Christian churches in the US in her book Backlash. It was all about this group of women who worked full-time, had nannies, and traveled constantly within their church groups/Republic party whose work focused on castigating, belittling and bullying women who were not stay-at-home parents who baked cookies. They only source of power this group of women had was judging other women and they took it.

I think i found it the most difficult part of the book.

I always think of Margaret Thatcher like that. She advocated a traditional family set-up, women at home, etc. while being a married woman who had two children and had evidently not become Prime Minister by staying at home and looking after Denis and the children. Admitedly not possibly the worst example of her time in power...

Does change never come from the outside, ans a possibly more disinterested eye on a subject?
Or because a cohort changes over time because of incomers?

karma spot on

'Backlash is one of the most depressing books I've ever read

Brace yourself Goblin'

I'll read it in the holidays.
I've read some horrible stuff over the years mainly linked to racism and disablism with a view to effecting change within my working environment and my personal practice. Sometimes you have to really look at shit and understand it if you are to destroy it.

What possible good can it do to 'reflect' on what posters who are not here should do to change the section? I don't get it.

'but we are always changing and we always have incomers goblin. all the time.'

Absolutely, and some are like sparky and some are like me and others are the ones that are annoying you and upsetting you. All will make changes of one sort or another, you are right.

"how do you reflect on being told you're aggressive, that being clever is wrong, that being academic is wrong, that saying things without providing evidence is wrong, that pointing out that things are misogynistic is wrong, that confronting shit stirrers and mra's is wrong, that not explaining what you're on about is wrong, but explaining is patronising, that referring books is wrong, that being serious is wrong, etc etc."

It hasn't been said that those things are wrong - it has been said that those things CAN be seen as hostile and aggressive in the way they are said

People exporing feminism will not all be at the same place. I have had my thoughts changed by reading things on here. I come from a 'traditional' family, where my differences to the norm are seen as flakely and even radical! Which is laughable as I so am not (yet) I come here to see women and some men discussing the things I would like to discuss. If people are put off from the section, then they will not change their views

And I am similar to Goblinchild in the fact that I have never ever been supported by women. I was terrorised by my school peers, been let down and treated terribly by my female peers. So much so, that I do not have one single female friend. I have also been seriously assualted and raped by one man. But, apart from that one man, the only people I feel supported by are my male friends - straight, gay and transgendered. Which is a huge shame

I think that is one of the things that I find depressing as I lumber over to the wrong side of 50. The 'backsliding'
The gendered toys, the WAGS and the silicone, the twiglet girls starving themselves to a size zero. The gym bunnies who are not doing it because they love exercise. The shallowness of the conversations amongst young women that I work with. The squabbling and judging.
I thought we'd have made a better world by now, at least in MEDC, and be in a position to support and influence change in other countries.
But we aren't.

If that's aimed at me, I change my name last week on another thread - I was scaredoflove, not a newcomer

I have no idea if I'm one of the people annoying you or not SaF, I was certainly on some of the threads that you mentioned.
But I've often found that a good, intelligent and well articulated response to a criticism is the best form of defence.