Why sexual abuse should be taken seriously...

[tabouleh]

There is a thread at the moment where a MNer has discovered that her DS is abusing her DDs.

Very very sad.

What is fucking shocking is posters trying to trivialise this abuse as "doctors and nurses" and suggesting that the behaviour is more innocent that it seems.

I don't want that support thread de-railed.

So I have linked to here.

So yep I have form for thread about threads lets debate it here.

Everyone is different pickled, and comes with their own personal bundle of personality traits. The fact that you have not had long-lasting issues (if you haven't, that's great for you) isn't because you are better or because other people are "letting it eat away at them", it's down to lots of things including the circumstances of the assaults, level of support they got at the time, experiences since etc.

It's insulting to ALL the people who are posting on that thread to imply that their grief, anger and other feelings are somehow their fault. I'm sure if they could have glided on regardless they would have.

And you can hardly pretend that the women who are assaulted (nearly all women) have exactly had a plethora of chances to talk about this over the years. Silence hasn't healed them, maybe talking will?

Thankyouthankyouthankyou Elephants and Lenin and seth.

I am not criticising anyone. I am just trying to find a 'solution' like all of you are.

I am not on that thread because I have no desire to hurt or upset anyone.

It never ceases to amaze me how quickly you guys close ranks and alienate those of us that have remained strong in the face of the same adversity that we all as women suffer.

I'm done, you will be pleased to know. Thanks for the chat and apologies to any of you that I may have offended.

Pickled, there is no closing ranks, there is no "you guys", I don't know STBW or any of the other posters on that thread from Adam.

As for "alienat[ing] those of us that have remained strong in the face of the same adversity" - you clearly have the idea that being affected by a traumatic experience (and that thread covered everything up to and including rape) makes someone weak. This is a horrible viewpoint and the reason I am responding to your posts is not out of personal loyalty, and not because I have been suffering the after-effects of assault myself(I haven't), but because I think that victims of entitled twats deserve a safe space in which to talk about how much or how little it has effected them, without being accused of weakness or unwonted negativity.

Hmm

I really do think that anyone who thinks that rape/sexual assault is down to men feeling unstoppable urges which can't be helped

And that women who feel traumatised by their experiences are being hurtful to men, painting a negative image and wallowing in it

Is probably someone devoid of empathy and compassion, and I would wonder what sort of ghastly life and experiences they must have had to so glibly deny women's humanity

and I would really feel pity for them as I would imagine that their internal life must be very dark indeed

Feelings of shame, guilt or self loathing are not usually indicators of remaining strong - that is what I mean. Do you think they are?

and I guess I am sort of lucky in that despite everything that has happened to me i can still relate to others as human and treat them with dignity and compassion

I guess not everyone can

How very very sad

I sure hope none of that toxicity gets passed on to children

The way you are treating me with dignity chibi

Pickled, I didn't mean to alienate you at all, and I can see how naming other people and thanking them does do that. I'm sorry.

The reason I thanked those posters was that your reference to 'allowing it' to eat away made me feel like you think it's my own fault that I feel so bad about having been attacked, and those posters said some things that I was temporarily unable to say because of those feelings.

I like the idea of healing sooner rather than later. But I think it isn't only a case of individuals healing themselves. If I'd been responded to after the first time I was assaulted the way that MN has responded to me now, I would have been healed much sooner. I also would have been safer, because I would have known without a doubt that there was protection, should anyone try it again. Instead, because I was left to deal with alone - and told not to tell anyone that it had happened - I knew without a doubt that there was no protection, and when I saw it was going to happen again I knew there was nothing I could do to stop it.

I think that other thread is wonderful.

how am I not treating you with dignity

I don't have to agree with you for that surely?

I suppose I am just musing on the motivations for the kinds of opinions expressed on this thread, which are really quite alien to me

My first reaction to a woman telling me that she had been forced up against lockers at school, pinned and groped would not be 'oh FFS stop wallowing in it, he had uncontrollable urges, and going on about it will just make other men feel bad'

Pickled, the feelings of shame and guilt are because we're told it's not a nice thing to talk about, and because of the persistant idea that women are the ones who have to stop sexual assault against them.

I know I said I was finished but your apology has spurred me on Supposed.

I too think the thread is wonderful in the way that it has allowed so many women to open up and connect with others etc. It is great that people can heal but not that they should have to, and so many many have to.

Where is the hope?
What is the solution?
What can we all do to help stop the seemingly endless cycle of 'small abuses'?

Great, tell your daughters about their 'spidey' sense but why should you have to?

This is not going to stop just because people are opening up and 'talking' about it.

Talk to you children about sexual urges: apppropriate and inappropriate.

Talk to them about personal space.

Talk to them about 'no' means 'no', 'don't' means 'don't'.

Teach them how to stand up for themselves, how to use their words to convey their feelings.

Foster close relationships with your children not by buying them everything that they ask for but by talking to them about all of these things.

Sorry for the huge rant .

And how will those things stop our daughters being sexually assaulted in our current society, pickled. How will not buying her everything she asks for, prevent a man sticking his hand up her skirt on a crowded bus?

All those things are a really good idea, pickled. I share your frustration with wondering how we stop it.

Coming to RTN?

"It is great that people can heal but not that they should have to, and so many many have to."

Yes yes yes!

I CompletelyNeedToBeWorking and am not even here.

If she is aware of the possibility that it could happen, that's a start - no?

I'm not sure that 'suffering the consequences' is enough of a deterrent, even if the consequences where very harsh indeed.

Teaching your child to not behave in a particular way because there will be consequences is not what I mean.

Teach them to be good and to value what is important in life. To be the best person they can be. I talk to my DC about these things.

Why fear? You can be 'aware', cautious even, without being frightened.

Which women/girls do you think are not aware of the threat of sexual assault?

Lenin do I have to spell it out to you, a victim of abuse is NEVER at fault.

I have a genuine question and I apologise if this is in sensitive.

Do victims of abuse talk to their DC about the fact that they have been abused? Are they encouraged/discouraged from doing so by any of the help organisations that they may have come in to contact with?