"Wifework"

[jamaisjedors]

I would have liked to post this in cognitive dissonance but it's all a bit erm... muddled and off track there so I thought I'd start a new thread based on this comment from the thread:

"Sakura Wed 29-Sep-10 11:48:51

... Read "wifework" by Maushart and you'll find that a husband increases the workload for a woman."

DH is away for 2 days, and this evening I have SO much more time on my hands.

Is this true for everyone?

Is it just because there isn't someone else to talk to?

Surely the workload (2 DSs house, garden etc.) should have doubled?

Any thoughts ?

My friend used to throw away any pans that got burned rather than scrub them. I admired her spirit. Luckily she married a wealthy man and now pays someone else to scrub them. I 'encourage' my husband to go out. But he does a lot around the house and with the kids. Go figure.

What is the core argument in the book as to "why" the workload decreases?

frgr, there's some thread on cognitive dissonance that have got a little , but essentially, some women think they're happy with the status quo, even though they aren't really, as a coping mechanism. It's a trick the mind plays on itself to keep sane.

One of the points the book makes is that although women have started to less housework over time, men have not taken up the slack. So sunny's situation isn't unusual in that rather than her DH taking on some of the cooking and cleaning, it either just doesn't get done or it gets outsourced (eg the ready meals). It's usually women that under pressure to keep the house tidy and provide nutritional meals for their children and get the blame when these things don't happen.

happysmiley - My husband does all cooking on weekends, all ironing and his morning off he gets 2 hours free and does a deep clean. I mainly just do uncle bens sauce dinners as he gets in late, hoover and make piles and hide them .

My husband would never ever ask me why I hadnt cleaned or cooked dinner. He praises me every night as I have improved greatly to what I was like before. He used to do 100% and I basked in my own trampyness. I realie you cant live that ridiculously after kids though!

Frgr, one of the surprising stats in the book was about how few couples actually share housework equally. There are so few that researchers who have tried to study couples who share the workload fairly failed to find a large enough sample population.

Sunny, i don't mean that your DH creates the pressure, more that society generally expects these things from mothers not fathers.

"Only if you let them" - that old chesnut of 'blame the woman' again

happy- yes you are right about smiley- her husband is praised when he leaves dishes until the weekend to clean them but a woman would be expected to do them every day (or 3 times a day, if they're a really good wife )

My parents probably had equal responsibility for meals but come to think of it we got takeaways only ever on Dad's 'shift'

E&M, basically the book is saying that husbands create lots of work. They cleaning up after, cooking for, want sex which becomes a chore and need their emotional needs met. If they aren't around, wives can have a break from all these things.

foreverastudent - I am at home more and leave the pots out and do all manner of untidy things but my husband tells me I am the best wife in the world. He texts me that or something along those lines most days from work. It doesnt make me a bad wife because I dont clean up or cook properly. (Not to me or him anyway). No one ever comments on it and all the mums I mix with are the same and we often make jokes about it.

I suppose it does if you put a lot of value on that type of thing but I doubt someone would marry someone like me if they did care about cooking and ironing.

the wink was to indicate sarcasm

I dont think there is any extra pressure on women personally. Then again as I said my dad cooked all meals when I was growing up as it was his trade and he loves it. So definitely wouldnt associate cooking with my mum (you havent had to try her attempts at cooking . I suppose that is why I dont feel pressure to do it as why I dont assume women do these things as I never grew up seeing a woman doing them.

I think your set up sounds good. But it probably will change and it isn't typical of most relationships.

I doubt it will change as its been 8 years and I still dont do the things I didnt in the first place. If you start of shit then your husband thinks your god if you do anything at all. Thats my advice to you all . I didnt do it on purpose though it wasnt something I thought about but it does now man I get praised for whatever I do and pick and choose the bits I like.

Sunny, I think your situation is particularly unusual because not only do you say you have a 50:50 split, but also you don't feel any societal pressure to do all the domestic work. Although in our house it's DH's job to tidy if we are expecting visitors I know that it is me that will be judged harshly if he hasn't tidied up. If DH didn't do it, I'm not sure I could hold back because I don't want to be thought of badly.

But it changes when your child gets older or if you have more than one and/or become a SAMH.

I do hide stuff when my parents come as they say we are being tramps such as what I said on the other thread I stick all my washing up in the cupboard if I need to. They call us both tramps though when they do come round and its messy and give us both a lecture on it but they usually do that because we are young and say all young people live like tramps. They praise us both when its tidy and dont say it is responsibility of one or the other. It usually follows the same format and they go round my brothers and do the same speil.

Other than that the people who come round are all our friends and I I dont know any with clean or organised houses. Now some of us have kids we look like the flash ones and get told we are the grown up ones as our houses arent full of ashtrays, old cans and randoms sleeping on the sofa!

'But it changes when your child gets older or if you have more than one and/or become a SAMH'

Neither of us would ever stay at home. We arent loaded and couldnt afford anything like that. I also doubt it would change when we got older as it never did in my parents house still hasnt now and they have been together over 40 years! They had more than one kid to and my mum only worked part time.

redundancy?

Im a near minimum wager and so his he. There are always jobs in our wage range if you are willing to do anything at all. We couldnt afford to even have a month of work as we wouldnt be able to cope as we cant get HB and we are on low wages anyway.

you're making me feel quite old- maybe things are better for the younger generation.

Even I get a bit of this sometimes, despite the fact that DS' dad is not my partner and doesn't live with me and DS. He's great with DS, looks after him frequently when I want to go out to play, even cooks (properly, and often as not washes up too) but whenever he comes over I have to endure a lengthy monologue about his job and at least appear to be interested. Sometimes I get to hear the exact same story three times in a week. Right now he has a job that I fully appreciate is Very Important and Worthwhile, but he was just the same when he was stacking fucking shelves in Sainsburys, and his interest in my jobs is kind of sub-zero.

'you're making me feel quite old- maybe things are better for the younger generation.'

I think I am quite strange in that I got really Monica out of Friends obsessinally tidy about some things and some things I dont care about at all. I hate it when the living room is untidy and do it everyday and my big thing is hoovering the living room.

I dont live in a particularly fancy or posh place though. Its also 3 bed in a flat so has no garden to worry about, no stairs and not the greatest amount of floor space.

I do think pressure comes from more affuent areas. I dont know anyone in my generation that would try and dress their kids in clothes from fancy makes like on here, or care that much about what your place looks like and 90% of AIBU is not something I would ever think would be an issue in RL.

We have parents from more affluent areas who come to groups and it is them that care about the random stuff but they are usually a lot older.

Have just read this book. While loaded with anecdotes and not brilliantly written in parts, it describes my marriage completely and the way my anger and resentment have grown and grown over "wifework" over the past few years. And, yes, that's since having a 2 DC and being SAHM / part time work from home. She has put into words all my thoughts and tears. In fact at times I thought the author might have been listening into the arguments in our household...

And, yes, the book is lacking in solutions. But I really liked the way she boiled it down to not comparing yourself with other marriages. ie. "oh, well he may be hopeless at doing this or that, but at least he's not as bad as Jo's husband, or Mary's partner". It's about equality within the marriage - two people only.

As for me, there is no equality in my marriage whatsoever. And, luckily for me although perhaps not so luckily for my children in the short-term, I have the ability to say no more. I really can't take it any longer. Just like 3/4 of the separations mentioned in the book, its been initiated by the woman - me. (He was, and remains, "perfectly happy", just completely unwilling to do anything that would make me happy too). And yes, I earn more and am better educated, just like the book describes.

I really recommend the book. As to why I married one of these "wrong" men, the signs were all there. I just chose to ignore them and really didn't understand the implications, particularly as life gets more complicated with children. I wish someone had given me this book as a wedding gift - or maybe a 21st present would have been handier!

But sunny, you said on another thread that after looking after 8 kids all day, it was you who did the cooking and cleaning because your husband was too tired