Ms or Mrs?

[ovumahead]

OK, all you intelligent articulate women here, help me! I just got married recently. I'd never really considered being a Mrs, to be honest I didn't put much thought in to it (?). When it came to changing my name on everything, I couldn't stand being a Mrs, so I put Ms on everything. I thought, well, women have fought for this, so why the hell not? Why should everyone know what my marital status is? (Besides, I'll be a Dr next year so it won't matter for too long...)

Apart from the contradiction, perhaps, in changing my name to my husband's (I did put a lot of thought in to that, and did want to, for complex personal reasons!), I don't think it's a big deal to be Ms or Mrs. I was Ms before on most things anyway. So why change?

I didn't discuss this with my husband, but it came up in passing when a letter came addressed to me as Mrs (obviously a mistake!). He asked me, light-heartedly, whether I was a hairy armpitted lesbian.

Now, don't get me wrong, I do find a lot of blokeish humour quite funny at times, and while I can see it wasn't a long, considered response from him, I did find myself giving him a brief lecture on why I'd chosen to do that. But I sounded like a hairy armpitted lesbian.

Now I'm left wondering - how can one overthrow these collectively damaging quips, if one sounds like a cliché when doing so?

And does anyone have a feminist opinion on the Ms or Mrs thing?

CRB and Disclosure Scotland are the worst. i couldn't put Ms on the online application for disclosure as i didn't have any 'other names known by' (not married yet, will be in 3 weeks).

drove me mad!!!

i wanted to get everything as Ms Maiden name as i intend to be that once married.

I find it weird that on here everyone seems so attached to Ms and yet I don't meet them in RL. I have had 3 DCs through school and in all that time, and goodness knows how many teachers, I have come across only one Ms. In my teaching career I have come across 2 at work. Equally I can't say that I know many in other spheres. If it was liked, it would have taken off and I would be an old fashioned minority but everywhere I go I am in the majority (except on here!).
My name before this was my father's, father, father's etc etc name-I don't call that very liberating! I think that I would like my maternal grandmother's surname-it was really nice!
It makes you a family unit. I got left home years ago -why would I still want to be a unit with my birth family rather than the family I have given birth to?
If you double barrel it what happens to the next generation-do they have four hyphenated names?

I absolutely detest being referred to as Ms. I am Mrs DHname and proud of it. I am my own person. Taking DHs name has not made me loose my own personality or identity. I am proud of my children being in a traditionally named family unit. I couldn't be bothered correcting people if they didn't call me by the right maiden name or Ms. There are a lot more important things to get worked up about IMO.

I would feel a massive loss of my identity and personality if I changed my lovely surname, I must say. Nor do I wish to live in a unit, actually, either.

I just can't get excited about it motherinferior. Unit is maybe not best descrpition but I am happy as we are. No hang-ups at all. Each to their own

I don't bother correcting people either mears-DS1 has a different surname so I often get his-I just answer. In the great scheme of things no one know or cares if you are Ms, Mrs or Miss or you have changed your name or not. As a teacher, DCs at school will still call you Miss however you title yourself!! When I was a widow I took my wedding ring off so that people wouldn't assume that I had a husband-no one noticed-it made no difference whatsoever!!

sorry whatever not however.

I have retained my maiden name and use Ms or Mrs depending on the circumstances. DC's school calls my Mrs DHname because the kids have his surname which I never correct as I put it down to teachers knowing the child not the parent IYSWIM.
Changing your name on marriage is a cultural construct and is not universal. In DH's culture (North African) women don't change their names on marraige.

I highly recommend a phd as a good way to avoid having to gaff about discussing your marital status when all you want to do is change your gas supplier

Out of interest, it seems on this thread most Ms children have DH surname. Why is that?

pisces, there are a lot of us who use Ms for ourselves but get called Mrs dhSurname whether we like it or not! I sign all my ds's homework/notes with Ms Chipmonkey but when they phone me they still call me Mrs DhSurname. And I'm not bolshie enough to pick them up on it.
Ds1's audiologist rang my work no. once asking for Mrs dhSurname and my boss said there was no one here by that name, audiologist insisted I had given that number and she finally realised they meant me!

I got married before I completed my PhD. Until I had done my viva I was Ms Myname, I am now Dr Marriedname. I could never, ever visualise myself as a Mrs.
Since our marriage others friends have got married and have addressed their invitations to Mr and Mrs M Clem (my initial is S).
Whilst this engenders a temporary feeling of "grr, I'm a Dr" there is a more depressing and long-lasting irritation that these have been addressed by women in their 30s who claim to be feminists but somehow lose every sense when planning a wedding is involved. Mrs Clem I could just about cope with, Mrs M Clem suggests that I have no identity at all.

Lenin, I didn't know you had hairy pit!

Mine don't. They have my surname and their father's name, not hyphenated.

Mrs, plus Husbands surname. But I get cross when my mother (!!) writes birthday cards addressed to Mrs Husbands Initial Husbands surname!!

To my mind, the bit about which surname you use is less important than the bit where the term of address is designed to display to the world whether or not you are married. Which to my way of thinking is unfair because the same information isn't displayed by male terms of address, because despite not being married I was in a serious relationship for 17 years and therefore the equivalent of married in lots of ways (particularly once I had the dc) so didn't consider myself "single" either.

For example I heard (not directly but via someone else) that someone at work was surprised when I got pregnant as I wasn't married (I use Ms when obliged but at work am just First name Last name but I suppose I don't wear a wedding ring). I found that risible and ridiculous as I'd by that time been with my dp for 13 years, living together for 10 and ttc for 3.... Marital status is IRRELEVANT in this kind of context and pretty much any kind of context (why does your plumber need to know whether or not you're married?)

Ms is the only solution to these two issues which are the ones of crucial importance for me.

I think you wouldn't see many teachers being called Ms, piscesmoon, because as you say all female teachers are "Miss" even if they've been married more times that Elizabeth Taylor. TBH I'm not sure how often titles get used any more anyway - I'm surprised at the poster saying that friends send birthday cards addressed to Mrs hisname. Don't people just usually write firstname lastname these days, friends at least? I have no idea whether my friends use Miss, Ms, Dr, Duchess or whatever :)

I don't understand the argument that says "well, it's just your father's name anyway - that's not very independent!". Actually firstname lastname is my name. And the fact that my surname comes from my dad is irrelevant (although like others I can pick matrilineal names off the family tree that I would much prefer). It's the same as if I'd been named Elizabeth after my grandmother - I wouldn't find it easy to change my name to, say, Judy on marriage, on the grounds that "it's not your name anyway, it's your grandmother's!". I've had my name since birth, it's mine and everything I have done (good and bad) I have done in this name, and everyone I have met knows me by this name. I don't want to have to start again as if I'd just been born.

If you've changed your surname on marriage and think it's a good idea - would you have been comfortable changing your first name as well? To a name of your DH's choice for example?

Ms and proud of it!

Three reasons

• I watched my cousin go through all the hassle of changing her name when I was 16, and thought 'no way will I ever bother with that'

• my surname is more interesting than DH's, which is very dull.

• it's my professional identity

• plus I've got hairy armpits at the moment

Agree with Elephants. Yes, my surname is the same as my father's - and I don't like my father - but that is the fault of my mother, really, for changing to my father's name and colluding in giving me that surname. I don't really want to change it to DP's father's.

It's quite marked, when you try and track down old friends, how difficult it is with the women because they've changed their name to some bloke's. I do find it most peculiar.

Ms here, and a teacher, though I have to insist a little more in Australia than I did in the UK.

DD has my surname, not DH's.

Something I notice about colleagues here: most older women retain their maiden name, all but one of the younger set take their husband's.

As for Mrs - back in the day, Mistress was the name for an adult woman, about 14, Miss was for children. I don't know when the usage changed, but it's noteworthy that unmarried women copped the child's title. True adulthood was reserved for the married.

Perhaps the more radical action would have been for feminists to reclaim Mrs.

Hate Mrs, but think that Ms sounds contrived. Why can't we just be known by our bloody names anyway? Men are Mr and there is no indication to their marital status.

I might do as my friend does and when she has to fill in internet forms, she puts Lady or Viscountess just for a laugh. Such a load of crap. I might just start my own mini revolution and refuse to tell people my title. Not a feminist by any stretch of the imagination, but this really is an anacronism.

Oooo, a side notw. Despite being a happy Mrs Hisname my blood BOILS at Mrs HisFirstname HisLast name or Mrs and Mrs Bothhisnames. That is taking his identity over mine way way too far. Any company that does it gets all mail binned without opening and any relatives that do it are corrected. I certainly do not have a male name and I am not someone without a name to be known. I'm happy with our family name (we like it, we did actually discuss thought taking a new name altogether as a family name originally).

mears, my dd is Esmerelda hissurname mysurname

Will her children be 'name his yours dhdad dhmum' How will double-barrelled names work out over the generations I wonder.

I am Ms Myname but DS has my surname as a middle name, and everyone in our families assumes we have double barrelled. I don't care if people are trying to be polite and call me Mrs Hisname, but I do get cross if it's people like the bank phoning us because we have a joint account and they know my name perfectly well. So I just tell them there is no Mrs Hisname here and hang up.

I never considered changing my name because why would I? Even if I wanted to I don't think I could be bothered with the admin. DH was a bit surprised and I gave him the option of being Mr Myname if he felt strongly. He didn't. I'm always surprised how many people do change their names these days.

I do agree Ms can sound a little contrived but the more of us that use it, the less unusual it will seem and maybe the eye rolls will stop one day...