Would you like to play "It's like Feminisim never happened" with me?

[Marchpane]

I have a gem: I'm sorting out the home insurance renewal but since the last policy I have taken redundancy and I'm going back to do a postgraduate course. Which I told them.

They now have my occupation listed as "housewife" which is pretty yuk, but under employer's business it say "domestic service".

Presumably my husband is my employer and I spend my time in servitude to him?

Any one more?

I can see what they mean, and that they are trying to ironically undermine a conventional retro image, but really...

I have a brilliant suggestion -- we could also have black people dressing up as slaves with armfuls of sugar cane and offering to put lumps of sugar into the cups of tea after the 50s housewives have poured them, in order to raise awareness of sickle cell anaemia. Wouldn't that just be deliciously ironic as a means of undermining stereotypes while getting across an important health message (and let's not forget the photo opportunities!)?

Erm, no, it wouldn't.

OOh Proflayton you need to go and post your slaves/sugar/sickle cell idea on the Stepford Wives thread.

Have to post this here: DH got a call today asking if it was ok to up the rent on our place, or if he'd like them to ask his wife!.

Yay!

And of course he got them to ring me, and admittedly it is a small letting agency, but still, it felt damn good!

My friend, who is Indian / Sikh / 2nd generation Brit, and an educated professional in her 20's with an MA, sometimes let's slip some gobsmacking details of her life at home with her DH, their 2 DC and her PILs.

For example, her DH has only ever changed one nappy. He claims to find the smell of baby shit too sickening.

She and her MIL do all the cooking, cleaning, laundry etc. And they have to cook only the foods that the men like.

On weekend nights, the men like to stay up late (wee small hours late) drinking, watching films etc. My friend is expected to stay up with them, no matter how tired or pregnant, just in case they want supper made for them at 3am.

This last is the most for me.

Not seeeriously MrsS? Don't they feel bad for keeping her up so late?

"For example, her DH has only ever changed one nappy. He claims to find the smell of baby shit too sickening."

A friend's DP once claimed he should be excused from any nappy changing, as women are genetically predisposed to not mind the smell of shit, so it's not so unpleasant for them. But as men have no such protection it's unfair to expect them to do it.

DH tried the nappy trick in the first week. I told him to fuck off and that I wasn't put on this planet wot wipe up shit either. He did his fair share of nappies after that.

Ephiny that reminds me of something I heard recently. A family friend living in Switzerland had a baby last year.

In the hospital the midwife told her it was best if she got up with DC during the night rather than her DH as "women are genetically programmed to need less sleep."

Porto I cannot believe your story! You did the right thing! That was very strong of you at 23, too.

My grandmother said a similar thing to me the other day. I was worrying about my long commute and having a baby, and I said, 'it's one thing having a baby and working full time, but adding in all the travelling and I'm worried it'll be too much'. She said, 'yes, and who's going to run the home?'

I said DH would do it. But ha ha ha ha ha at the idea that anybody 'runs' our home. I don't even know what she means by that! I cook and hoover, DH does the washing up, keeps the plants alive, and does all the washing. We both have a meltdown about the bills every now and again and check through our finances. When people are coming to visit we clean together - otherwise we live in a mess. I don't think that counts as 'running' a home!

Got an invite to the preschool coffee morning which is "a great opportunity to meet the new committee and other mums too" eeerrrrrm.... so dad's aren't welcome then?

At the same preschool DH is currently doing our turn at snack preparation for this half term, comments so far from the 'teachers' include
"well done daddy do you do washing up at home too" and "DD's a bit messy, mummy will have to wash her clothes" !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They'd be shocked and outraged at the amount of 'women's work' DH has to do I'm sure!

I am not married, and if I ever do I won't change my surname, but dd has dp's surname. I thought hard about it and one of the things that swayed me is that dp is dd's parent in just as real a way as I am, but I gave birth to her, breastfed her, and it seemed important to mark that he counts. Not in a "what about the menz" way but to show (who? Not sure - not him, he doesn't need to be shown anything) that he is as responsible for her as me. Now dd is no longer breastfed he parents her more than I do. He is such a great father, he does the practical stuff and the emotional stuff and they have a lovely relationship. I am so glad of this, not just for them, but for me, because the days (the very early months) when everything was all about mummy were utterly draining. So I am happy for her to be officially his daughter, in her name.

I like your post vezzie. On the name change thing I constantly get amazed responses at work that I did change my name when I got married, though I'd get amazed ones from my family if I hadn't.

I thought hard about it too, especially as it meant my PhD was in my married name and that can't be undone, so I will have this name throughout my career no matter what happens to me and DH. In the end I went for it because:

a) my dad kept sending me birthday cards and the like with First Name His Name-DH's Name on it, to persuade me to keep 'his' name. This felt weird and proprietorial to me - like he wanted his stamp on me. DH doesn't think like that, so it felt like a free choice to take his name and not a free choice that I'd had the old name since birth.

b) I thought it was actually a privilege to be able to do that. I know he could have done it the other way around, but I liked taking his name and I liked that he liked it that I had. It was important that it was a choice rather than something that was forced upon me, and it felt like a nice thing to do for my husband and a nice way to start our live as a unit. I think it is a beautiful gesture and a big vote of confidence.

c) DH's surname is way nicer than my old surname

It is a bit weird I felt all traditional about it since in mostly everything else I'm a pretty hardcore feminist. We share the chores, the breadwinning, and the responsibilities 50:50 and I wouldn't have it any other way. Still, it's what I did. I think it's up to the individual woman concerned and it doesn't matter what she chooses, as long as it's her choice.

Reading through a news magazine, I noticed that there were many more photos of men than women. I counted, and there were 41 men and 14 women (7 of which were in a small film still taken from a rom-com).

Although some of the women were featured because of their achievements, e.g. Julia Gillard, others were famous victims, such as the Iranian woman sentenced to stoning, and Natascha Kampusch.

And actually, the stories of the latter two can be added to the "like feminism never happened list" (well, certainly the Iranian woman, I suppose it's debatable what relevance feminism has to the evil nutcase who kidnapped NK considering he was insane, but he certainly seemed to have some extreme ideas about women).

This idea of "running the home" is so funny! I agree that once upon a time, there were probably much higher standards, and no labour saving devices. It WAS a full time job for someone to do washing/cleaning/cooking/shopping. Can you imagine, during the war you probably had to spend half a day queuing to get anything decent to eat! And you couldn't waste fabric, so there would have been lots of mending/restyling having to be done too.

I guess this is where my GMs attitude springs from.

My nan was only born in 1939 though!

Plus, women had to work during the war (as well as 'running the home'!)

I think all that stuff is a bit of a fiction. You had one wash day back then, and wore far fewer clothes. It wasn't expected that there'd be a gourmet meal from a different continent each night on the table - a bit of pie from the butchers and some boiled veg would do it, etc etc. And women have worked since time began - the 1950s housewife image is such a huge myth. We've been working for millennia - just for low pay and no rights!

Grrrr

New Chair appointed this week, he came over to the dept with a senior manager from the school, who on entering the dept office (three young women) said 'Oh yes, I wouldn't mind working here' (in leery tone...) This is a senior manager in a prestigous university......(if I had been in the room I'd have been straight on to HR)

"It's not something I'm particularly fussed about though, it's only swapping one man I love's name (My Dad's) for the other man I love"

What? No, you're swapping your Dad's surname for your partner's Dad's surname, which has much less connection with you.

Why is your husband's father's surname now your husband's... yet your surname, inherited from your father, still your fathers?

I never understood why people attribute your original logic to these things - it's as if a woman isn't capable of making something (a surname) truly her own, whilst her husband in the EXACT same position... is.

Friends of mine (married, both teachers) were applying to work at the branch of an English school in Dubai. During his interview they wanted to discuss pay/benefits etc., not hers. He found this hilarious as she's the one who deals with all the finances so he basically had to repeat everything they'd said to her, so she could decide, and then go back to them.

I know women who STILL have their husband's name as their email address...

I just started a thread asking what happened to the pink campaign. It seems that it's ok for mumsnet to promote equality from childhood because they know that the majority of people will support that, but when it comes to adults and esp how women are seen, they can employ double standards.

But then how can we think straight when we have been bombarded with this kind of crap from the age of dot.

Insurance company (who we had to ring after attempts to screw squeaky floorboard into place led to hole in central heating pipe under said floorboard) wanted my husband's permission before they would talk to me despite the fact that the cover is in both of our names.

The female (!) on the end of the phone sounded quite put out when I took the phone back from DH to continue the conversation, methinks she detected the utterly disgusted tone of voice I may have used when passing the phone over to him.

Meanwhile the water kept on a-pouring....

and I get very fed up with my dad (who could be excused) and a FEMALE friend the same age as me, who sends letters and cards addressed to Mr and Mrs

BTino, wow the link is just amazing.

"Worlds Apart do a range of children?s bedroom furniture; full of soft pinks for girls and bold red and blues for boys. So let them embrace their true genders"

And silly me, thought I don't have to be pink a fluffy to be a woman. How wrong I was..

Oooh, I've got another one.

New Head of Year doing her first assembly today, to Year 9. Very nervous. Gabbling about importance of being prepared.

'For example, next year, you might be doing Collegiate courses. Like...er. Hairdressing. Or er. Construction. & boys, those of you who do construction will have to turn up in steel toed boots. & you can't always rely on your mums to get everything ready for you, you know!'

I was explaining to an older female colleaguethat u started out as a PA. She said "oh so you are xs pa" and was stunned that I was actually his boss because he was a man and I was a woman. In 2007.