Rape within marriage

[tabouleh]

Yes unashamedly a thread about a thread.

It is like entering the bloody twilight zone over there.

Jeez there are MNers basically caring more about OP's husbands right to sex rather than believing OP and helping her.

Totally understand if this gets deleted for being a thread about a thread - but if it gets more of the feminist viewpoints onto that thread then great.

if she remains motionless and mute

"If a woman strips off naked in the bedroom, lies on the bed with legs wide apart in front of a man without saying anything, I personally wouldn't blame the man for thinking, 'She wants sex.'

It shocks and saddens me when our fellow women collude in misogyny.

Marantha - how on Earth would we be able to assume that you were not referring to trafficked women, the women in your scenario have no voice.

How absurd would it be if Marantha entered a room on her own free will, and happens to have no clothes on, and legs are not closed, would mean she wanted sex?

OK, I'll try again.
Scenario. Man and woman enter bedroom OF OWN FREE WILL Woman strips off (of her own accord), lies naked (fully conscious and of her own accord) and spreads her legs.
Are you seriously trying to tell me that the bloke in this position would be unreasonable for thinking, 'She wants sex'. I mean, really, FFS.

Marantha -Your posts are sickening.

electra It's not misogyny, really it isn't.
I am prepared to say that 90% of people would think, 'Yes a woman who does this is expressing in a non-verbal way to the gentleman that she wishes to indulge in some form of sexual activity'.

sickening indeed

Just look at the language you are using;

'spreads her legs'

That language is used by people who have absorbed and, in the case of women, internalised misogyny.

Why are you calling him a gentleman now?

I really think you need to get educated.

At no time are you challenging the behaviour of this male, you think it is acceptable for him to assume what he does.

You do not believe that rape could happen in this scenario.

I find your posts degrading about women.

Smear test?

Good point, Captain.

Second Dittany's post - Why are you concocting these ridiculous scenarios that never happen???? What are you trying to achieve?

dittany I am not even talking about the other thread here. My post was in response to someone who said that all consent had to be verbal. It clearly doesn't.

TBH if a woman went into a room with a man and took all her clothes off and lay on the bed with her legs spread (yuck) I would think she was a bit nuts. Where's the kissing, teh foreplay, the touching, the slurping and smooching and whathaveyou. It seems a pretty unlikely scenario. People don't just walk into a room and take their clothes off and lie on a bed with their legs spread, with no speaking or other indication of what's going on, nor a come hither smile or whatever it might be. Strange.

TBH if I was with someone and they did that I would ask them if they were alright, not simply shag them.

Anyway.

Anchor I saw your thread earlier and I was at work so couldn't post. I was also extremely bothered by the responses and was worried for you that you would be left reeling but I see you are OK, that is good. I wanted to say quickly that I saw you are suffering with panic attacks and don't want to go out. I had something like that when I was pregnant (I had a specific fear though) and I was referred for CBT. The referral took a year to come through but I do think that it has helped a lot. May be worth talking to your doctor about?

As for what happened with your DH I concur with the others on here, I'm not sure anything else needs saying.

Hes entitled to think what he wants isnt he , but if she objects it ends there. Other people dont get away with commiting serious crimes because they " thought ".

I was wondering earlier why those sort of threads get so nasty, and i think its like what someone else said , it forces people to explore the issue and possibly look at their own lives.

As i went through my divorce i lost what i thought was a good freind , it upset me a lot at the time , but now , i know why. This freind is in a in bad marriage too, and watching me walking away and making changes forced her to look at her situation, she just didnt want to and wasnt ready.

You could see it quite clearly on that thread, women angrily stating that her husband needs sex, she should make an effort ect. Looking seriously at the issue would make them question their role as a wife , and if on occasion, they are being treated in a similar fashion.Someone actually said it sounded like a typical scenario in bedrooms across the country!

No one said ALL consent HAS to be verbal. They did say that the verbal objection overruled 'nonverbal' (which was used in the context that thread - of a non responsive, half asleep person - how non verbally consensual is that??)

Marantha - your scenario did not prove that consent could be non-verbal and I found it degrading to read.

If you want to prove consent can be non verbal - obvious markers like kissing and eye contact (!) and wandering hands are involved. Laying there motionless is astoundingly non consensual.

Yes dignified I thought it was very strange the "lie back and think of england" approach that was being advocated, like people were in some kind of time warp.

I don't understand why people would say that a woman must force herself to have sex when she doens't want to? What kind of man would want sex on those terms anyway?

It has been said on here before that rather than being man-haters, the women on this topic generally seem to have higher regard for and expectations of men than elsewhere. This would seem to be one of those.

If I lose my libido after birth, for some time, my DH does not look elsewhere, or get angry, or get upset, or whinge, or grope me, or rape me.

He understands that I have lost my libido for a reason, that it does not mean that I don't love him, and we talk about it and look forward to a time when libido recovers/think of ways to help it.

(OK he tries a bit of a fondle occasionally but that's OK )

The point is he takes no for an answer, quickly and without repurcussion.

He wouldn't want to have sex with me if he knew I didn't want it, why would he?

I honestly couldnt respect someone who wanted sex with me despite the fact i didnt want to. I would question their charecter and morals and their veiw of me.