War and Peace Readalong thread 2022 - thread 2

[VikingNorthUtsire]

"The finest novel ever written on this planet"
"Here is a novel that is worth whatever time one gives to it. There is more life between its cover than in any other existent fictional narrative"

This is a really helpful blog post by someone who has done the challenge: nicksenger.com/onecatholiclife/announcing-the-2020-war-and-peace-chapter-a-day-read-along

1. Translations

The main complication seems to be which edition to choose. The blog post above contains some commentary of the different tranlsations that are available and their merits. There's also a pretty comprehensive guide here including samples from some of the best-known translations: welovetranslations.com/2021/08/31/whats-the-best-translation-of-war-and-peace-by-tolstoy/

The main differences that I can see are:

• some editions (including the free download on Project Gutenburg) have a different chapter structure. I think/hope we would manage to find one another if some are reading versions with more or fewer chapters but I have based the readalong on the versions with 361 chapters.
• there's quite a lot of French in at least some parts of the book. Some editions translate it into English, others keep it in French but use footnotes
• some translators have chosen to anglicise the characters' names. I guess its personal preference whether you prefer Mary, Andrew and Basil or a more Russian version.

Looking at the editions recommended and reviewed in the above blog:

The Vintage Classics edition, translated by Pevear and Volokhonsky: www.amazon.co.uk/War-Peace-Vintage-Classics-Tolstoy/dp/0099512246/?tag=mumsnetforu03-21

NB also this link for the kindle version: www.amazon.co.uk/War-Peace-Vintage-Classic-Russians-ebook/dp/B005CUS9AG/?tag=mumsnetforu03-21

The Signet Classics edition, translated by Anne Dunnigan: www.amazon.co.uk/War-Peace-Signet-Classics-Tolstoy-ebook/dp/B001RWQVXA/?tag=mumsnetforu03-21

The Penguin Classics edition, translated by Anthony Briggs: www.amazon.co.uk/War-Peace-Penguin-Popular-Classics-ebook/dp/B0033805UG/?tag=mumsnetforu03-21

As a general rule I would definitely recommend downloading a sample of any kindle edition before buying, so you can be sure that you are happy with it.

Obviously, some people will prefer to avoid Amazon! Feel free to use the weeks in the run-up to Day 1 to share any tips on what you are buying and where from. Can I suggest though that we stick where possible to the editions with 361 chapters otherwise we will all get very confused!

1. Reading timeline

Nick, of the blog post, has very helpfully done the calculations for which chapters fall on which days, except he did it in 2020 which was a Leap Year. So feel free to take a look at nicksenger.com/onecatholiclife/wp-content/uploads/2019/12/Nicks-2020-War-and-Peace-Chapter-a-Day-Reading-Schedule.pdf but see below the schedule for the Mumsnet Readalong.

Again, different editions name and number their chapters differently - some refer to four books divided into parts (as below), others refer to fifteen books although it's essentially the same structure just with different numbering. Hopefully there's enough info below to keep us all in sync, and always happy to let anyone know via PM what's happening in today's chapter so we can keep together.

Book 1: 1805
Book 1 Part One (25 chapters): 1/1 - 25/1
Book 1 Part Two (21 chapters): 26/1 - 15/2
Book 1 Part Three (19 chapters): 16/2 - 6/3
DAY OFF: 7/3
Book 2: 1806-1812
Book 2 Part One (16 chapters): 8/3 - 23/3
Book 2 Part Two (21 chapters): 24/3 - 13/4
Book 2 Part Three (26 chapters): 14/4 - 9/5
Book 2 Part Four (13 chapters): 10/5 - 22/5
Book 2 Part Five (22 chapters): 23/5 - 13/6
DAY OFF: 14/6
Book 3: 1812
Book Three Part One (23 chapters): 15/6 - 7/7
Book Three Part Two (39 chapters): 8/7 - 15/8
Book Three Part Three (34 chapters): 16/8 - 18/9
DAY OFF: 19/9
Book 4: 1812-13
Book Four Part One (16 chapters): 20/9 - 5/10
Book Four Part Two (19 chapters): 6/10 - 24/10
Book Four Part Three (19 chapters): 25/10 - 12/11
Book Four Part Four (20 chapters): 13/11 - 2/12
DAY OFF: 3/12
Epilogue One 1812-20 (16 chapters): 3/12 - 19/12
Epilogue Two (12 chapters): 20/12 - 31/12

Phew!

I would suggest that we meet at the end of each section (so 17 times over the course of the year) to discuss what we've read, but with (non-spoilerish) chatter welcome at any time in between. According to my guru, Nick, each chapter is around 4 pages long, so it should be do-able.

1. Chapter "meditations"

This looks like another really interesting blog post from someone who has done it, with thoughts and meditations on each chapter: brianedenton.medium.com/a-year-of-war-and-peace-cc66540d9619#.yabefbbgz

Come and join me! This time next year we will almost have finished reading the finest novel ever written on the planet.

PS Some may feel that each day off deserves a shot of vodka or two. I couldn't possibly comment.

Hmmm... I really can't warm to Natasha and the last chapter didn't help. I know she's privileged and only 16 but she comes over much younger and is definitely spoiled. Ah well, looks like her match with Boris is definitely up in smoke - I guess the Rostovs envision better for her although with no dowry and not the best social standing, not sure how they'll manage that?

Sorry for the double post... the servers were down apparently (although they clearly weren't!)

Wonder if Boris is gutted or relieved?

Natasha will turn the head of someone who doesn't much care about her wealth or standing, I reckon... which was never going to be Boris.

The 'I don't love him but let him keep coming to visit if he wants!' response was very Natasha.

I’m having trouble warming to Natasha too, but I think it may be to do with the obviously very different attitudes to women in nineteenth century Russia. I can see she is loving and full of joie de vivre, and understandably eager to experience the pleasures - flirting, balls etc. - of a young unmarried woman. But the way she skips and runs about like a preschooler gets on my nerves, and she is very indulged. She is clearly not meant to worry about the condition of the serfs, or the costs of war, and it makes her come across as rather empty-headed.

You've summed up my feelings so well, Channel - empty-headed and so frivolous! She does seem so young for her age and indulged <- such a good description.. the way she kisses her mums hands and everyone just looks at her with such fondness... urgh!

She reminds me of girls I used to know who very much played down their intelligence and knowledge and became simpering simpletons as that was what they thought made them more attractive 🙄

I prefer the older women, with their salons and their schemes, even if they aren’t very pleasant characters.

Just checking I can still post! I fell off the thread. I must say that even though Pierre and Andrey are much more congenial characters than Natasha I do love the world of the Rostovs. Funny to think that they're almost exact contemporaries of Jane Austen's characters - these seem to belong to a much older world somehow.

Just checking in too as haven't posted for a while. I wonder how Natasha was perceived by readers at the time. I feel Tolstoy means us to be enchanted by her rather than exasperated by her. At least Vera will end up with someone who values her more than her parents do!

Chapter 14
The Rostovs hurriedly prepare to attend a grand New Year’s Eve ball, Natasha’s first. They are attending with Countess Rostov’s old friend, Marya Ignatievna Peronskyy_.

I want to go to a ball - but one without Natasha thank you very much! Talk about frustrating - they were so late. I know its probably fashionable to be late but I am such a stickler for punctuality, this whole chapter made me twitch!

Chapter 15
At the ball, Mme Peronsky identifies for the Rostovs all the important people of St. Petersburg: Pierre, Prince Andrei, Princess Marya, Boris Drubetskoy, and others.

Natasha was so annoying when they were getting ready, constantly moving to faff with other people so the poor maids couldn't do their job! Bet they had a good moan about her when they got 'downstairs' again. Hope they managed to have a (well, vodka) when the Rostovs all finally left.

I was twitching like mad too SanFranBear - I thought they were going to end up missing the start of the dancing or the food or something

I quite enjoyed spotting all the important people of St. Petersburg. I thought it was all over when Natasha tore her dress expecting the maids to perform small miracles ffs. And I was also getting twitchy 😄

Chapter 16
The dancing begins and Natasha nearly cries when no one asks her to dance to the first few songs. Pierre notices her unhappiness and asks Prince Andrei to dance with her, which he does. Although Natasha is not as glamorous as the older women at the ball, Andrei is charmed by her grace and beauty.

It's a shame Pierre didn't feel able to ask Natasha to dance - I presume he's not really a dancer whereas Andrey seems to really have it going on! He is sucked in, isn't he?

To be fair, they'd probably make a good couple as she's got more fire than Lise ever had but I wonder if he'll tire of her in the same way. I am sure there was something about how intoxicating he found the first few months of meeting Lise, how it was a love match but you'd never have known from when we joined the story. Intriguing... as presume he's considered incredibly eligible and certainly doesn't need Natasha to have a dowry!

Found this chapter very evocative and it had some lovely language as translated by Briggs:

'Helene had been, so to speak, varnished by thousands of eyes that had caressed her form'

and

'the champagne of her beauty went to his head' (As an aside, my other 99p Kindle version - Maude I think - has this as 'the wine of her charm rose to his head' - I prefer Briggs!)

Interesting to see Natasha through Andrey’s eyes: she seems less irritating and more fresh and genuine.

Chapter 17
After Natasha dances with Andrei, she has a surplus of partners and dances for the rest of the night. She and Andrei have a delightful conversation when she takes a break, and Andrei daydreams about marrying her. Meanwhile, Pierre sulks because Hélène is such a success at the ball and no one is paying attention to him. Natasha speaks with Pierre briefly about his sour mood.

I appear to have forgotten everything about this book... cannot remember if Andrey & Natasha do get married although he seems keen and must agree, Channel, she seems much less annoying. I know I couldn't live with her though and outside the glitz and glamour, her ditsy act would drive me up the wall.

I agree, musicmaiden. It's very expressive.

I enjoyed these last few chapters; the ball was fun. I was wondering how the Rostovs are going to continue to afford these extravagances with the financial strain the Count is experiencing.

I have no idea who is going to marry who, as I'm not looking anything up; just finding out as I go along.

her ditsy act would drive me up the wall... definitely!

I think you're right, @Stokey , Tolstoy intends Natasha to be more endearing than annoying in her childlikeness -- though I agree with all the comments about how annoying she is! She makes me think a bit of Dickens' childlike heroines, like Little Dorrit. Like ChannelLightVessel I prefer the older women, although I suspect that had I been reading this novel when I was younger I would have warmed more to Natasha.

I'm intrigued by how Andrei is being presented as a object of desire at the ball. I never would have suspected him of being 'one of the best dancers of his time'! He'll be jumping into a pond with his shirt on like Mr Darcy next 😄

Chapter 18
Later, Prince Andrei attends a business dinner at Speransky’s house, but no business is attended to. Instead, the men joke and chat for the whole evening. Prince Andrei is disenchanted with Speransky and disgusted with the inefficiency of government work.

Morning everyone, I am finally reading again after Covid (the brain fog has been a real thing!) and reading a few chapters a day to catch up - I'll be back in the discussion soon.

Morning, Viking, welcome back!