Anyone have 2-3 stone to lose but DOES NOT use injectables

[dreamstates]

Anyone want a support thread to drop 2-3 stone but finding the ozempic/wegovy etc threads overwhelming on here. They aren't useful to me and there are so many threads on here about the damn stuff.

A previous thread I saw basically said diet and exercise without the injectables would fail for most. I don't want to touch the stuff for a variety of reasons but mainly the hideous side effects and pile on weight when you stop. Not to mention cost.

I'm looking to do it the "old fashioned" way... 1200-1500 calories on my fitness pal and exercise increasing. No particular time limit.

SW: 12 stone 2
I'm really short too so ideally I need to be 10 stone something max

I'm 40 and deffo in perimenopause

@OneDayIWillLearn I’m glad you asked that question because I’ve looked at the thread again now….

And some posters it doesn’t look too bad. I think I must’ve felt particularly despairing when I looked at it the first time, or the posters existing on salad made me feel really despondent.

actually I’m not aiming to be that thin again anyway.

@EmeraldRoulette haha I think it is maybe the effect of reading so many posts together so it seems like, oh my god I’m going to have to do ALL of them!!! And yes also some people are ridiculously restrictive or seem to just not particularly like food and being slim would never be that important to me.

the trends I notice are

• lots of people have found something which works for them, for whatever reason, and what that is differs a lot
• lots of people don’t snack
• lots of people who are regularly active or exercising
• people drinking little or no alcohol
• People get used to eating less/ smaller portions over time and then want to eat less
• quite a lot seem to eat two meals a day (though others eat three)

I could do some of those things long term I think but not all. But it reinforces to me I guess that I need to find a way of eating which works specifically for me and my body.

Don't think of it as a diet. Think of it as a way of life. I learnt this from my own over eating a few weeks ago. I felt bad with all the hard work I had put in before that, I would have probably seen better results by now.
I don't measure anything but avoid over eating. Try stick to tasty but good for you food. I've fasted as well and I didn't feel like I missed out on anything on days out. I still had loads of fun. But I know that if I indulge now then I will not feel good after.

I'm saying to myself that once I get to the almost finish line then I can have a meal out or whatever. I've eaten so much in life already, what's a small amount of time of not eating so much?

But this comes down to us as individuals, where we are at in our journey etc.

Say for example you've eaten well, but have an odd treat that says in the calorie amount then you won't regret it so much.

If I attend a party, just stick to a small amount of food. Instead of two burgers, one. No chips etc etc.

When we're at our goal weight, we can have some fun and then it will only be a few pounds to lose rather than several stones.

That is awesome! Thank you for being an example for us. It's so encouraging and well done for losing that much. Keep going and you'll be at your goal weight soon.

Thank you @babba2014 I'm way off where I need to be but will keep going. The difference has been immense. I use nutracheck to count calories and think it's really good x

@SorchaB there are lots of online calculators - you will just need to enter your sex, weight, height, level of activity and they will make recommendations. On a quick google I found this one that seems reasonable Calculator but I use MyFitnessPal which is an app that does recommendations and also allows food diary tracking and calorie counting.

@OneDayIWillLearn that is so great and inspiring about feeling better and getting nice feedback. We're not even doing a holiday this year so (unfortunately/fortunately) I have no special events to be wary of. In the past I've just given up for the day/week/fortnight and then struggled to get back on track so I have no wisdom.

That list of trends you posted is really interesting - I am trying some of them right now but mostly I hope I can get used to eating less and not feeling bored or like I'm missing out.

@Mummytodo well done on your loss so far - that is fantastic!

I am still here - a week today although my official WI is tomorrow. I've had a few wobbles but I feel like I have no choice but to stick with it this time. On Sunday night I was really craving my G&T but it's completely because work/life in general is not great right now (i.e. not a good enough reason). I did snack over the weekend and re-gained 0.6 lbs which did not shift this morning so I am a bit grumpy that even the slightest de-rail hits me so quickly. I'm planning another 1200 cal day today to try to get my average calories for the week back down.

I do feel hungry sometimes but it means I really look forward to dinner, which in the past I dreaded because I was so stuffed from rubbish earlier in the day. I'm also trying to go for a walk every second day (I have bad OA in my knees so every activity hurts - but also a reason to keep at this).

Getting quite disheartened here. It's been a few weeks of sticking to calories and doing some exercise pretty much every day and the scales haven't moved.

I've had the occasional unhealthy thing in that time - chips once, birthday cake once, cheese and crackers once, pizza once, but not crazy amounts and all within calories once exercise is included. Overall I should be well below the calorie limit.

I'm doing the exercise for mental health, strength etc not just weight loss but I'm feeling very disappointed that I'm still basically the same weight, and don't really understand.

@Blacknailer I don’t comment much but read the thread this is a common thing that can happen, this is why a lot of people will advise to not eat back your exercise calories. My fitness pal, smart watches etc over estimate calories burnt through exercise and so what can happen is that you unintentionally end up in no calorie deficit at all. Bodies do not really burn a lot of calories through exercise it’s much easier to consume than it is to burn. Just stick to the allowance for each day and disregard the exercise cals and see if this helps. I would say that if in a few weeks of weight loss, eating cakes, pizza, chips etc is really hard to estimate their true calories - the labels on packaging vary so you could also accidentally eat more calories than you assume you have. I am not saying don’t eat them at all ever again but these are the items that usually creep up on us over time. I don’t tend to eat them often not because I think they are bad but they aren’t a part of my lifestyle anymore and the more time passes the less I think about them or miss them and when I am in active weight loss I feel like they are a waste of my calories, I can eat a lot more of something less high cal.

Thank you for the message but I don't know - I'm not recording all the exercise eg I'll record a 60min class as 45min. And then I'm not eating all those calories I'm recording.

I'm quite short so if I eat none of the exercise calories it's all pretty unsustainable, as is (in my view) never ever eating less healthy food. I mean do you just eat no cake if you're at a family birthday and your brother made it? Eat nothing if you end up at a restaurant with people and pizza is the only option on the menu? You can eat a small portion but probably not none.

Yes I don’t advocate not eating enough calories, work out your TDEE and go from there, with your activity in mind. It’s a hard balance I appreciate and it can take some time to find out where your weight loss sweet spot lies in terms of calories and exercise. I just mean generally as a rule don’t rely on the recordings as accurate enough, this is the issue. There have been lots of studies about the fitness trackers and estimated cal from exercise and they are shown to all be off track and inconsistent mostly so it’s not a reliable data source. I go to a Pilates class and Apple Watch tells me I have burnt 150 calories I am pretty sure I haven’t though, my heart rate wasn’t very high so it’s unlikely

Neither are restaurant calories on menus and even food packaging to some extent. It’s like a science with so many variables! I just meant for instance ok, if you eat chips in a cafe or a cake someone else made or cut up, you don’t really know how many calories are in it, it’s a guess, so that week you might accidentally tip yourself into no deficit. The most reliable way to track is unfortunately weighing food you make yourself.

Some people like other ways of doing this as cal counting can be very hard work, I see a lot of people like fasting or 5:2, these might be sustainable. I zig zag across the week, taking my whole calorie allowance treating it like a bank account and allocating myself different calories over the week, so if I have had a 1700 calorie day, the next day might be 1300 or even 1000 but over the week they all add up to my allowance (which is about 1400 a day x 7). This can make it more manageable and give wiggle room for days out.

Eating out is a hard one, I’ve been losing weight for about 16 months now and I tend to only eat at places that offer a wide variety of food so I have options. A thin stone baked pizza express pizza is different to a thick loaded dominos pizza in terms of calories. I don’t see good vs bad food or that one is healthy and the other isn’t healthy I just see it that I have X to spend on calories so get the best value I can for my allowance. Exercise is my bonus allowance giving me a bigger deficit.

if it helps you don’t need to create a 500 a day calorie deficit even 300 a day is enough to work with just it will be a little slower loss. Keep going, getting good sleep and keep hydrated hopefully weight loss will come soon

@Blacknailer ah that sounds really frustrating. Sounds like you have done well to stick with the new habits though especially if you haven’t had the motivation of the scales moving. And if you’re anything like me, things like a meal out or a birthday party are times I usually stuff myself and gain weight so the scales staying put is probably better than the alternative! Can you try and think of it as a really good foundation that you’ve laid over the last three weeks and now you can build on it?

Is calorie counting a tried and tested method for you? I only ask because I have tried it a few times over the years and I hate it and don’t find it leads to me losing weight and I can’t stick to it. Intermittent fasting works well for me for avoiding weight gain and weight watchers is sadly the only way I have consistently found that I can actually lose weight. So maybe think about going back to another method if it’s worked for you before? Or trying a new alternative if this isn’t working on this occasion?

lastly re exercise, I do find it supports my weight loss (and definitely helps prevents gains when I’m in less ‘on track’ periods of my life) but I’ve observed that it’s light/ moderate exercise that’s best for me for actually helping with loss e.g. walking, cycling. I really enjoy running but for some reason it seems to keep the scales stuck! I trained for and ran the London marathon two years ago, and was running 15 or 20 miles a week, and didn’t lose a pound (in fact I think I put on a couple!!) the whole training period. Ditto things like HiiT. Not saying they aren’t good for you though and I’m sure other people have different experiences but for me sadly not.

@OneDayIWillLearn agree it doesn’t work for everyone - I like numbers and spreadsheets and this is how my brain works so I don’t find it too hard but it’s not one size fits all. Exercise is amazing for flexibility, mobility and mental health and cardio health but it’s not a good weight loss tool unless you are trying to maintain a lower weight nearer your goal - that’s when it comes into its own as an additional bonus but it can cause you to hold onto water which inflates the scale etc etc so you need to look at overall trends not daily or even weekly averages. A month is a good measure of time for weight loss, using a tape measure and a scale, not just one or the other because you might even be losing inches just not see it yet on a scale. The general rule is 80% diet 20% exercise but then there is the definition of what is ‘exercise’ as walking 10k steps in a day moderately probably isn’t exercise it’s activity

I exercise for mental health and strength too and it really helps.
With the numbers, either your muscles are stronger and heavier or/and unfortunately more unhealthy type of food just sticks to our bodies. I've been listening to a lot of podcasts from people who lost weight of recent and they all say they just had to be strict until they got to their goal, then they would have only a bit with loads of salad.

This is why I'm just trying to stick to avoiding all the takeaway or even if it's frozen to oven because I want to head straight on for goal weight and then think about controlling it when hopefully we reach the end goal. I've given up too many times in the past.

My family all bad pizza today and they said they'd keep some for me for dinner. I just said no. We can eat when I reach my goal. I think I'm so determined as I don't feel like I have a cheerleader and finally I've found the headspace to try and be my own.

Let's do this.

It's my weigh in day today and I'm happy with heading towards my weight goal although there's still a long way away.

I have been doing 30 minutes exercises, trying to walk, I'm not fast paced as mt children are with me, and just eating better.

The best thing is the aches and pains in my body feel like they're going. I do feel sad I let myself go but now we are in the thick of it and this lifestyle seems good. Will celebrate at the end not now. Yes summer is here but no to ice cream and milkshakes. I'm just going to have to test my perseverance.

I really want to be my old self although older and it's either now or forget about it.

You don't have to do anything heavy to lose weight. Just be active and eat well. Cut out sugar and fried food. I do have carbs but I don't know how to have a meal without it as I love bread. Just don't over eat.

@Blacknailer you have lost weight though right? I thought you were doing quite well.

@OneDayIWillLearn I am in awe that you ran the marathon.

@babba2014 pretty much, yeah, being strict and avoiding it just seems to produce better results than trying to combine it into normal life so soon, because it’s hard to do that at the start. You can have nice things, you can make frozen yoghurt, you can make a great low cal pizza, it’s not the same but life is just different. The first time I had a slice of dominos pizza in about 9 months in, it struck me that it all just tasted of nothing in particular. All the flavours just merge into one blob of indistinguishable flavours and the main flavour was grease and it was stodgy and I missed the flavour from a meal that has loads of clear distinguishable flavours and elements to it. A lot of chocolate, especially cheaper stuff just tastes sweet it doesn’t have any other flavour

Oh wow so maybe I won't enjoy a pizza after all. I'm not even missing it that's the truth.
You're right about chocolate. Most of it just tastes no good so I don't eat it but the ones I like, I can end up eating loads of.
I think I'm at the mindset now to just eat well and whilst I wouldn't have imagined I could do it a few months ago, I'm not missing anything now. It really is true about sugar being an addiction.

@babba2014 I practice mindful eating and one of the ways is to ask yourself what something tastes like and try to pick out flavours. Now I do this all the time it’s actually fun (yeah I am sad) but it was a shock for the pizza blob. I told DP he thought I was mad but I said I can’t taste one thing over the other the whole slice is just the same generic taste and texture?

But if you ate like a fresh salmon salad you would get so many different individual tastes and textures it’s actually way more mentally stimulating. You don’t just eat with your mouth its eyes, taste, smell, mind etc so next time you are missing something you used to eat, and you eat something you think is boring just try to eat every mouthful mindfully and think of a positive thing about it.

With chocolate that’s why people end up buying like expensive really good stuff then having small bits of it as their treat, rather than eating loads of the cheaper stuff as it doesn’t even taste that great

That's really interesting. Not sad at all. I'm going to try it. We use a lot of spices in our food so when cooking you can smell it all but I don't concentrate when eating.

Thanks all.

Agree with a lot of what's said. I think the frustration comes from eating well under what MFP is saying and still not seeing an impact.

Calorie counting is basically the only thing I've done successfully in the past, so it has worked before. Otherwise if I'm not logging everything I eat from emotion/boredom as well as hunger. I find the exercise does help me not eat rubbish too. I've found in the past that building some muscle then seems to help burn the calories faster... Eventually.

I did sort of lose some weight in that it went up by a few lbs for a few days and then down by about 6lbs but has then gone back up again by about 3lb so ends up back at the start... Not sure what's going on there as I can't possibly have eaten enough to actually put weight on.

Yes I maybe need to be even more disciplined but am cautious of it being completely unsustainable if I feel very deprived of food, or if it's not possible to socialise. I don't want to lose more weight and then put it all back on and more!

All movement is exercise.

Well no not really @MadameMassiveSalad in terms of NEET and calories and physical fitness. There are different heart rate zones and if you plod 10k steps at 90bpm, it’s not exercise its activity. Activity is good but physical exercise technically it’s not if it is not intense enough.

Even the standard NHS advice is that you need to feel your heart rate increase, be slightly breathless (but can still hold a convo) to count as exercise. Your muscles require certain conditions to grow and get stronger, your cardiovascular system too, so activity such as walking make you out of breath the first few times you do it but your body rapidly gets used to it as it gets fitter, and you have to walk faster to produce a higher heart rate the more you do it.

www.nhs.uk/live-well/exercise/physical-activity-guidelines-for-adults-aged-19-to-64/

@Blacknailer I agree a 3lb gain could not possibly be real fat gain. That would mean overeating by 10,000 calories above what you need. Much more likely to be something like water retention - a litre of water weighs a kg (roughly a pint to a pound) so it really doesn’t take your body holding onto that much more to make a difference on the scales. Muscles holding onto fluid after exercise, time of the month, drinking alcohol/ eating processed food, eating carbs….they all make me hold onto extra fluid but a day or two later it’s gone. Maybe be patient!! Or get a new set of scales?!

good news if you're using a method which has worked for you before. Are you doing anything differently this time to when you did it before and it worked? Eating different types of food/ different timings or anything? Maybe you could think back and do a bit of detective work….

@EmeraldRoulette thanks!! I never thought I’d be able to do it but just followed a training program step by step and over time it became possible (though I am miles off being fit enough to do one now….but maybe one day I’ll do it again)

@dreamstates thanks for starting this thread! I am trying to lose 20kg which is about 3st2lbs. I started calorie counting using the Lifesum app three weeks ago which I've found super helpful and so far have lost 5kgs which is encouraging although obviously still a long way to go. It's so lovely to see everyone supporting each other on here and making such helpful suggestions.

Hey guys! I was missing my old WW meetings today and wondering if anyone would be up for a bit of reflective chat?? I always find it really helpful to hear how other people are doing and know I’m not alone!

here’s an idea for a couple of questions…

• what’s your strongest motivating thought or focus at the moment?
• what’s your biggest challenge or thing that’s pulling you off track at the moment?

@dreamstates @EmeraldRoulette @Menora @babba2014 @MadameMassiveSalad @Atlantic252 @Blacknailer @HappySquid and anyone else!!