Everyone just hates fat people

[mamabeeboo]

Yes I'm fat and yes I'm taking the WLI.

I've had it out with a friend of a friend during a catch up dinner yesterday and I'm fuming.

I've lost some weight and still have a good 5 or so stone more to go before I'm anywhere near the 'normal' BMI category. So no, I'm not wasting away or disappearing, or losing weight too fast.

The mistake I made was being honest about the jabs. But I stand by it, I think it's important to get healthy, regardless of how you do it, just get there.

ANYWAY, this person has suddenly decided to feel concerned for my health, now that the loss has become noticeable. With some silent nods from others about how you should 'just eat less and move more'. No shit is that what was supposed to do?!

A big discussion about:
just have willpower
just have smaller portions
do it the normal way, you don't know what you're putting into your body
it's not healthy
just put down the fork
it's about dicipline
it's not really losing weight though, is it (huhh??)
it's more rewarding to do it the normal way so you can feel achievement

It's gotten me thinking of how so many people just hate fat people. You want us to pay for being fat, to suffer at the gym doing workouts we don't like or can't do with joint pain and back pain etc. You want us to 'just have willpower' like it's that easy. You want us to try all the diets and fail so you can feel superior with your 'discipline' and that you 'look after your body'.

You hate the fact that these WLI have levelled the playing field.

I said all this yesterday and it became very frosty. These aren't my friends, I was there for the birthday girl, but I won't sit there and take it.

I'm posting because I'd love to hear what you might have heard when talking about WLI. (Or if anyone agrees with the above 🤔)

@PalePinkPeony your posts are beautifully proving the attitudes to WLIs stem from seeing weight as a moral issue and one you are more superior for upholding better.

You talk of discipline and stuffing and crap and hardship to justify what is, at its heart, your sense of injustice that you have to suffer to stay thin whereas all these outrageous fatty fat fats are cheating! How can being thin be prized if everyone can do it without the great virtue of discipline.

And don’t give me the health argument because it’s clearly not what you care about or what you have any basic understanding of beyond - fatties are fat because they stuff themselves with carbs and sugar whilst you lick lettuce.

You are seething that people you like to judge are finding ways to look like you without any of the associated virtue. There’s no jab for that issue, sadly.

Brainwashed into what? Wanting to eat sugary foods but saying no for the benefit of health? We as humans have evolved to grab as much sugary food as we can when we see it. From hunter gatherer part of our brains that hasn’t changed as quickly as our environment has. Of course it’s going to be a struggle for most to say no?!

I don't believe you. Again, the judgement is ripping out your posts.

After two difficult weeks the food noise dies down. And a whole host of positive feelings and energy arise.

This is your experience. It's not mine, and it's not the experience of many women here who have tried every kind of elimination or restriction going. You're not the only person to have tried it, you were merely fortunate enough that you found something that works for you. The superior attitude comes from assuming your experiences are or can be everyone's.

Yep. Buzzwords everywhere as if we haven't heard it all before. Why the hell should we have any kind of conversation with people who are convinced they're saying something original that we've never heard of thought of before? Demanding we listen while having no intention of returning the favour because there's an opinion to get out.

My goodness. I’ve said I don’t feel any superiority and no, I’m not thin. I don’t view people’s worth or judge based on how fat or thin they are for gods sake.
If you want to take my concerns / arguments and deem me as lying then nothing I’m going to say will make you think otherwise. No point
Some people are opposed to these jabs. OP asked why. When those opposed give their reasons we are called liars or just shouted at for apparently ‘feeling superior’ is the only possible reason to be opposed.
Sticking fingers in the early and singing ‘you want to feel superior’ doesn’t make the opposition go away.

wrong thread!

@PalePinkPeony If you read any of the WLI threads on here, you'll see that most people are doing exactly that - using the journey to wean off UPFs, hugely reduce sugary foods, hugely increase protein intake, eating the rainbow of fruit and veg. Yes, some aren't, and they will probably regain. But most people are seeing this as an investment into their health, and making the most of it. And you get the double whammy as they lose weight - they're able to exercise more, which has huge health benefits.

I find it interesting that people sit in moral judgement on WLIs, but rarely say the same about things like Botox or fillers. Which are the same IMO. Not that I have either, don't need to, but I certainly don't judge people who do. Using injectables to stay youthful is apparently fine. Even though a lot of the skin damage is sun damage that people are trying to cover up. Using them to get slim is apparently not. Go figure.

Bingo! ‘We’ve heard it all before’
well dont bother coming on the post then.

The friend of a friend sounds dim with poor social skills OP. Avoid!

@PalePinkPeony you're opposed to WLI - do you mean for anyone, or for you? If it's for you then great, you don't have to take them and no one will force you to try them. If it's in general, why on earth are you opposed to a prescription medication for a condition that you don't have, that you don't need and won't be taking?

Why do you bother coming to a post like this? I can't begin to imagine going into a thread about how people judge smokers/ ex smokers and filling it with all of my moral judgements about smokers. Or going onto a post about people with depression and telling them all they just need more discipline to smile more.
What makes a person come onto a thread about the judgement fat and obese people feel and chuck a load more judgement at them?

If that’s the case about UPF’s and it’s found that after a number of years it really has made a difference to the diet long term then I think that would be amazing. It would benifit everybody because consumer habits would change, companies would start to change foods made to be healthier and less processed all round. People might bring in unprocessed food to share round when it’s their birthday in the office, kids party might see platters of unprocessed foods rather than heaps of crap. And that truly would be amazing.
Maybe I’ve just more cynical as I’ve aged.
No I don’t agree with injectables really either - slightly different reasons though although there is an overlap.

No, brainwashed into thinking it is a moral issue. It isn't.

Because the OP asked if people think negatively about the WIL or if people think it’s cheating. Literally what this post was asking.
It’s not a WLI support post.
If people asked - do people think of smoking negatively then yes, I’m sure there would be many negative replies to smokers

The question would not be about smoking, it would be about do people view new medication like Varenicline to help people stop smoking as cheating, and that it shouldn't be used to stop smoking as the only way to do that correctly is cold turkey.

Are you not opposed to anything that doesn’t directly affect you? Trump isn’t living in your house I presume but you can still be opposed to him. We live in a society where things indirectly affect us and everyone is allowed their opinion.

And that's why you've made repeated comments about our moral failings? Were your comments intended to help us see the light somehow that we are moral failures and should just Be Better?

can you imagine thread like that? 'We have this new medication available that will help people to stop smoking. But I don't agree with it, it's cheating if it's easier for some, and I had to do it the hard way. If they weren't so weak and lazy, they could do it too!"
And I could go and post on the thread that I'm clearly a person with superior character and willpower - I have never smoked! Just be like me.

@PalePinkPeony Prescription medication is not comparable to a political opinion. I am not opposed to any prescription medication, used correctly for people who meet the criteria, if they and their chosen HCP agree it's the best course of action for them. Why on earth would anyone oppose that? I might think that I wouldn't make that decision, or that there might be a different option that I think might be better for me, or for the other person, but that doesn't mean I oppose the medication. And I would recognise that those are my personal judgements, and not relevant to another person's life and decision making.

For those citing 'willpower' as what obese people should be doing instead of taking WLIs, please read and educate yourselves on what obesity actually is.

This from the Cleveland Clinic explains clearly what Class 3 obesity (BMI 40+) is, what causes it, and how to treat it - including WLIs. https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/diseases/21989-class-iii-obesity-formerly-known-as-morbid-obesity

And if you can't be bothered to read it, then please take on board this one section from the page:

Class III obesity rarely results from a lack of willpower to lose weight or a lack of “control” over the amount of food you eat.
Contributing factors to obesity include:

• Genetics. There are at least 15 obesity-related genes. Certain genetic syndromes can cause obesity, as well, like Cohen syndrome, Down syndrome and Prader-Willi syndrome.
• Hormonal imbalances. Hormone-related conditions that can lead to weight gain include Cushing syndrome, hypothyroidism and polycystic ovary syndrome (PCOS).
• Certain medications. Antidepressants, antipsychotic medications, antiseizure medications, corticosteroids and other medications can lead to weight gain.
• Cultural factors. Prevalent advertising for calorie-dense foods and increased portion sizes can contribute to developing obesity.
• Environmental factors. Exposure to chemicals known as obesogens can change your hormones and increase adipose tissue in your body.
• Financial factors. Easier financial and/or geographical access to fast foods compared to more nutritious, whole foods can lead to weight gain.
• Geographical factors. Having limited access to parks or other places to exercise can lead to obesity. Having few safe or easy ways to walk in your neighborhood can, as well.

This is what many people taking WLIs have been battling with. It's more than a little different from just being a bit overweight after a few too many pieces of cake and a bit too much sitting on one's arse. Meaning it needs a different approach to tackle it.

Maybe some slim people find this challenging, because really what it's saying is that obesity can (and does) happen to anyone, because life happens, and you can't control all of these factors. So when it does happen to you, and there's a medication that can help you become healthy again, of course it makes sense to do so.

Well that's not a good comparison is it? Because Trump is impacting the whole world with his politics and WLI are not impacting anyone other than to reduce the burden on the NHS which everyone has been on and on about for years. This is a win win surely? It's not costing the NHS money as most people are going privately for prescriptions AND reducing obesity related conditions.

The only right answer is to eat unprocessed foods or lightly processed. Very little UPF. Very little white starchy carbs, very little alcohol and only a small amount of dairy. No need to feel hungry. You can have lots of unprocessed foods.
After two difficult weeks the food noise dies down. And a whole host of positive feelings and energy arise.

Yeah see that doesn’t happen for everyone. Some people have bodies and metabolisms that fight them every step of the way to get or remain fat. Ask doctors who specialise in obesity. The mistake thin people make is to assume that their level of hunger is the same as an obese person’s and that the difference is willpower/discipline- it is not. They also assume that fat people all eat junk and nothing but.

Well in a way it’s true? If you smoked, why did you start? You would have known it’s a shit thing to do for your health, and even if you didn’t, you would have known in the years you were smoking that you need to stop.
I smoked and yes, was weak for starting and weak for carrying on for the years I did.
But guess what, at a certain point I thought no, for gods sake stop as it’s damaging my health and I went through two weeks of cold turkey which was hell. But never touched one since.
Smoking directly harms others not just yourself and is also far more harmful than obesity, so can’t be compared to being overweight anyway so is a shit comparison. But just to take the bait and compare - you take the drug but still smoke daily. the stoppping smoking drug when ceased being taken gives you exactly the same cravings of smoking that you had before you started taking it. Oh and also the drug gives you multiple side effects short and long term, that may possibly outweigh the risks of smoking.

For the majority of people this would work if stuck to. Not everyone no, but for the vast majority. It’s just basic science and denying that doesn’t really help.

As a slim person I still can’t stuff my face with shit and still have to go the gym to maintain weight and fitness.
Regardless of how you lose weight you still need to exercise, I for one am glad about these injections as for one it won’t cost the nhs as much for obesity issues, I’m all for it and you know what when i do see people in the gym who are on a mission to lose weight get healthy I think good in them, why would a slim person worry about it being a level playing field ? Bizarre
I do get that some slim people think they know it all, but trust me they will have to be doing something to maintain their weight, if not right now definitely once they start getting older.
i say good luck to anyone trying this and hopefully it works well, ive no bad vibes at all.