Death linked to Mounjaro

[suki1964]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cz6jg6nw2zeo

I am in no way knocking anyone who is using these drugs, seriously if I could use them I would. However Im throwing this up here because these drugs have only been tested and deemed safe on a small study - those who's BMI is above 30.

The article posted by a PP makes an interesting comment - that we actually know more about the safety of these meds than other “new” medications because they’ve been in use for a while for diabetics.

A close relative of mine has recently decided to go down this route. They have had a lifelong battle with obesity since their early 20s. I have seen their struggle, and while I would not claim to understand what drives them to the behaviour of overeating, the case remains for them, that this issue can not be managed by themselves without help, and they are not making progress in the desired direction. So there it is. An expense that they could do without, no doubt, but we shall see. I do think that the food industry, and Government have done a number on people, but that is another thread.

I work in public health and we recently looked at cases of emergency admissions for pancreatitis in our local area (because there had been discussion about ED staff noticing an increase nationally)

What we found is that there has been an increase (24%) in admissions over the past year. However, when we excluded cases linked to cancer of the pancreas or gallbladder/digestive system, and cases caused by excessive alcohol use, that increase was no longer observed. It's also very interesting that cases seem to spike around January - I guess linked to excesses over Christmas and people dieting come January?

Personally I do worry about people lying about their weight to get the WLI. If I were at the DoH, I'd suggest only physical pharmacies could prescribe, and they would have to observe the patient weighing themselves in the pharmacy consultation room to ensure they met the criteria. I'd also ensure that details were sent to the patients GP. It 100% should be recorded in case of other drug contraindications etc.
I'd also like to see routine blood tests performed - but as usual, it comes down to money. I have to beg to get annual blood done at my GP for drugs I currently take as it is.

As additional point which other posters have alluded to

Save being 'absolutely shocked' for the fact that this country is rammed full of non- medical prescribers

Back in the day, and I mean heading for 20 years ago, a doctor was needed to prescribe medication. Over the years, healthcare workers who have not studied and trained in medicine have taken up prescribing. This includes pharmacists, nurse practitioners etc

Of course this has lowered standards as people who do not practice medicine prescribe medication in this country.

The move to have pharmacists treat various presentations, when they have not trained in medicine, is a great concern but has been pushed by the last government. The move to non-medical prescribers actually date back to the previous labour government, so all of them have pushed what is dumbed down healthcare and reduce actual doctor-delivered healthcare which is the gold standard.

The government would have to actually employ all the doctors who are heading abroad in order to return to actual medicine being practised in this country. But the last one chose not to, and who knows what this government will do.

I don’t think it needs to be more regulated tbh. Anorexics have abused laxatives and other meds for decades. If someone wants to obtain it wrongfully that’s on them.
Again I have serious doubts that this woman died from two low doses even a week apart ( as a nurse not sure why she did that). She likely already had an issue with her pancreas and the mounjaro is a coincidence. Mounjaro is a hot topic of interest at the moment so the press have leaked on it. Most people have little to no side effects on it apart from the lack of interest in food

*leaped

@Pyjamatimenow you're supposed to take Mounjaro weekly, and take 2.5mg for 4 weeks, so she was following the instructions.

Sorry in my head I’d read weekly as daily

I didn't say it was more of a danger than all the other things you mention. I think it is just another source of danger, similar to the others that you mention (although potentially more risky). And , yes, of course I am concerned about laxative abuse and other dangerous features of disordered eating and disordered dieting. It is precisely because these things are worrying that it is also worrying that people with eating disorders now have this additional seductive tool at their disposal. Why would you imagine that I would be remotely concerned about WLI if I wasn't concerned about these issues generally? And why do you focus on teenagers? Women of all ages are very vulnerable to disordered eating and disordered dieting.

For all of the subtle and complex benefits WLI have for those who are prescribed them appropriately, it is also a straightforward appetite suppressant and therefore it is inevitable that it will be abused by people with eating disorders and disordered eating - just as laxatives are, just as amphetamines were when they were prescribed for weight loss.

Oh, and the only reason I haven't posted about the dangers of laxative abuse and similar is that you don't get thread after thread on MN singing their praises. If I did see such threads, of course I would jump in with concerns.

That's because there are not hundreds of thousands of people suffering with a long standing condition for which laxatives are a new treatment

Naturally there are many people who have obesity and are delighted with a treatment - finally! They are singing its praises, on the WLI part of the forum. They are rightly DELIGHTED

Please step on by and don't bother reading, if you are that annoyed at multiple people regaining their health

HAPPY JABBING!

Ah so because Mounjaro is relatively new therefore people are still talking constantly about it (on a board meant for it), you'd jump on the wagon to "express concerns". However once it lasts as long as laxatives or Covid jabs and everyone has moved on from the mass hysteria and doom-mongering, you'd no longer feel the need to express concerns. Trendy.

You're also admittedly happy to be some sort of party-pooper who 'jumps in with concerns' in threads where people are talking about how it's positively affected them. No other time, just on threads "singing it's praises"/talking positively about it. That's not a very 'concerny' attitude. More of a 'rain on people's parade' attitude. If you're really concerned about anything, you shouldn't wait to ruin a positive thread about it.

Couldn’t have said it better - I do find it really sad that the hundreds of posts from people virtually crying with relief at having FINALLY found something which helps them lose weight, stops the decades of shame they’ve felt, and regain their health and the full life they’ve always been entitled to… just falls flat when certain people read them - that no matter what, those people will still shake their head with a “won’t someone think of the poor children” type mentality.

I think a lot of this is the same posters, they are haunting the weight loss injection sub forum and repeatedly posting about their “concerns” with different names on different threads.

Yeah it won't be a surprise. Some of them keep repeating the same tosh as usual. Whoa, they must be a cult! 😳

My doctor won't let me order a life saving repeat prescription for more than six months before having a full screen blood test is done.
So it's completely reasonable to expect the same from a drug that can be obtained on the internet.

I do sympathise why people take these drugs , but the defensiveness of many on this thread is off the scale.

It's a drug and like many other drugs should be overseen by a doctor.

I have to jump through hoops to get my life saving medication.

But the government has taken away a lot of doctor delivered healthcare in this country

There's far more concerning goings on than this, which are brushed under the carpet

Physician associates doing procedures when they have no medical training- deaths have DIRECTLY resulted yet no one stops it. It's ongoing

Lots of non medical prescribers

Why focus on WLI- there's loads to be concerned about in this country!!

Can people please point out the "defensiveness" that they keep trotting out? Has any poster said there shouldn't rightly be proper regulations with WLI or are people rightly countering ignorant arguments with their own facts? Is it a case of "Agree with me or you're being defensive"?

So in that case no one should take medication that has resulted in a death?

But why do you care so much frogget on what we may or may not see?
You clearly see that which you wish to see, why do you care so desperately about what we may or may not see?

I wasn’t talking just about you.

you said people seem to have a victim mentality. I was explaining people are reacting to judgement. Not compassionate concern. Not you in particular. But the thread you commented on is full of judgement.

I was pointing out where it was pure judgement with no compassionate concern anywhere to be seen. Another poster brought up the concern she has for her daughters.

If you haven’t read the thread why would you form an opinion about what’s happening on the thread. How would you know if it’s compassionate concern or judgement? Or if people have a victim mentality? Seems you just read a few posts, in isolation and let your bias take over. Then posted an uninformed opinion.

You are just as concerned about laxative over use? Ok how often to do you go onto a thread where someone is discussing the use of laxatives telling people ‘don’t use that you could just do’. Or ‘using laxatives is damaging to women’. Or ‘too many people use laxatives as an easy way out’ or ‘I am concerned about the impact on my daughters because people use laxatives’.

When do you or anyone else do that? That’s what happened on this thread. If there was a report on someone dying, possibly (in part) due to laxative use, would you be going on threads or creating threads about how people shouldn’t be using them. Even when doing so appropriately. Or that they shouldn’t be using them because other people may take them inappropriately?

Would you be telling people who have and do use them appropriately they should be grateful for the compassionate concern of people posting things like above?

Again, it’s not all about you. I was talking about the entire thread. Since you referenced a group of people, I didn’t realise I was meant to keep my post to just you. I was also referencing the group of people you think are showing compassionate concern. They aren’t.

It is prescribed via GP only - you can only get a prescription from a registered medical doctor. In most cases, it's a private doctor.

Yes that's what @Froggerz thinks:

We should just do away with medicine generally-
EVERY medical intervention has resulted in an adverse reaction for someone, and many, many deaths have occured; obviously while we're at it, all surgery must stop

Just ridiculous arguments from people who knows nothing, but RESENT lots of patients regaining their health with WLI

The most interesting part of Frogget is that she is so keen that eat less and move more is the right answer but then openly admits that despite moving more and eating less herself she is not able to sustain a healthy weight and lose her own excess weight. 🤷‍♀️

Well no. Because laxatives aren’t new and people generally are comfortable with using them. They don’t often need advice. On using laxatives.

Because they are not new. And the media doesn’t report on it on a weekly basis.

Those that are abusing laxatives wouldn’t be posting about it. Even on an anonymous forum. And most people don’t want to talk about their bowel movements.

And yet, they are being abused in large numbers. So are you saying you would be happier if people just didn’t post about it. Then you wouldn’t be concerned. Not even post in the section dedicated to it? We all just have to hide away? Then it would be fine? People abusing it wouldn’t be a problem, if everyone using it properly disappeared?