Hosting and warning non-vegans

[veganhost]

We are just about to move into a big enough home in a desirable area where it’ll be easy to have people stay overnight. We are looking forward to welcoming visitors, including on a ’hotel style’ basis, ie feel free to crash at ours but do what you want otherwise.

Now, since we’ve welcomed quite a few people to come and stay, not everyone is super aware of our belief and I feel that we need to warn people that we do not want any non-vegan food in our home. Some vegans don’t have any issues with this, but we do, and won’t change our minds. We are really not interested in discussing this or ’negotiating’, so to speak. I feel that we need to warn people about this so that they know before they come (and if they don’t want to come if they can’t have cow’s milk with their cereal eg, ok!).

How do we do this in the best way? I’ve thought of just mentioning it casually in an e-mail – is it then better as soon as a visit is discussed, or once dates have been set? Any suggestions on how to word this in a friendly but firm way would be much appreciated! I don’t really want to explain it, just state it, to avoid the risk of being told that we’re silly eg, but maybe a casual mention won't be noticed…

I wonder if any other vegan has personal experience of a similar situation, or if any non-vegan have a view on what they think. Any suggestions on how to best convey this in a nice but ’final’ way would be welcome!

Thanks for any thoughts 😊

@Oneofthesurvivors its the hypocrisy I dislike, I don’t think all vegans are well educated on how their plant based foods are produced. Yet they go to great lengths to follow their self prescribed rules.

It’s not really hypocrisy. No one can live a perfect life or a life causing no harm. For vegans it’s about causing the least harm and suffering to animals. People thinking they have this ‘gotcha’ moment by saying what about the bees or other similar things, really aren’t as clever as they think.

All the vegans I know know exactly how food is produced and they do their best to minimise harm.

What’s wrong with that. Why can’t they go to what ever lengths they want to live the way they want.

Their life, their choice.

Its definitely not more damaging to animals or the planet than the alternatives.

( that’s been done to death and proved on every thread on this subject )

My family are actually farmers so I feel I’m pretty educated on where my food comes from. I was vegetarian from age 6 and vegan from about age 20. I saw and heard enough. I do what I think is best/right.

I’d happily eat entirely vegan while I was with you but I’m on many many prescription meds that come in non vegan capsules and I’d be very unwell if I didn’t take them. If there was an alternative I’d be taking it! I was vegan myself for a while and had visitors who were horrified by the lack of cows milk in my fridge.

If a vegan inherits a flock of sheep, what do they do? If they keep them, and pay shearers a premium to have them sheared more gently, what to they then do with the wool? If they weren't bred, then most domestic farm animals would not exist, but what of those that do now?

The whole point about being vegan is avoiding any harm or exploitation to animals. I've no idea why this makes people so angry

I can’t really comment professionally on the inheriting scenario maybe that’s for a farmer who inherits sheep
however I’d shear them in hot weather, have the lanolin removed and use the wool for roof insulation as I’m not a great knitter.

but
if farm animals weren’t bred they would be extinct. Nothing wrong with that.

if everyone stopped eating meat then farm animals would eventually all die naturally, be buried, nice headstones I think. No more pain and suffering. Extinct.

Yes you're right probably no one should even bother trying to do anything to live ethically

Depending on what you read/who you talk to, there are different versions of a vegan world and what it means to animals. We need good quality soil to grow crops and animals help with this. It gets very complex and that’s why we have soil scientists debating the topic with farmers, conservationists and many other experts.

Doubt you would starve. Just pop to a maccers innit

Well there's more to halal and kosher food laws than just pigs - kosher in particular could cause a lot of difficulties to a non-kosher person (if wanting to cook their own food).

Your house, your rules and it’s a friendly note but no matter how much I might want to spend time with you I’d be staying in a hotel. Plant based meals I’m more than happy to eat but I’m just not a fan of any of the non dairy milks or the meat and cheese alternatives and having tasted some of them I dont feel strongly enough about the principals of veganism to want to eat them.

@excessivescreentime but the argument as to whether veganism is more ethical than other diets is a whole different issue for a other thread.

Completely normal person here, DD (10) doesn't think she's having a meal without fish/meat.
I will cater for vegetarians but vegans are just way too OTT - honey is the most natural of foodstuffs and bees are so essential to all plant growth, how on earth is it not allowed????

Religious dietary restrictions are equally bonkers, however would respect as much as I do vegetarians.

Normal person? 😀
Meat eater you mean??
Well the bees need the honey

Thank you so much to everyone who has added their thoughts! Really interesting to see the spread, and for me it's nice to see that the majority of respondents seem to think that it's a natural thing to ask. When it comes to the creative questions about what would happen in x instance, some of which appear slightly contrived, I think it's unlikely for any of them to happen, and if anything would crop up, we'd cross that bridge when we get there.

I've also been given loads of great suggested wordings. Thank you so much for taking the time to write them down! Also great ideas about how to gently inform people that pastries/biscuits etc may not be vegan - friends will be aware but not necessarily friends of friends.

Some people seem to have got the wrong idea by me writing 'like a hotel'. What I meant was that we'll be perfectly happy for people to ask us about a place to crash for a few nights if they need a place in London, without feeling the need to spend all or most of that time together, not that we'll run an unofficial guesthouse where we could supply fridges to the guest wing :-) That may also have made people think that we're moving to some kind of mansion, it's a three bed semi in zone 5..! But we're happy to share what we have, just like I/we have been put up in many places over the years, some more comfortable than others. We'll also expect guests to help out and there won't be any red carpets or bed/sofa bed/blow up bed prepared, people will have to do that themselves, just like we may well ask them to help us with some housework if we need help.

We'll probably offer a place to stay on vegan couchsurfing sites too, it'll be nice to help especially (low earning) activists.

It's also interesting to see how the idea of veganism seems to anger some people who couldn't refrain from using various invectives, some of which were quickly removed. Like others have pointed out, ethical veganism is a belief protected by law (Equality Act 2010) so it might be prudent to be a little careful about such language in formal settings. I guess that's why they are used in anonymous discussions online!

Thank you all again :-)

(Typo edited before anyone had commented further, 9.03)

Nice post OP.

This sort of discussion esp ' normal person' reminds me of when smoking was ubiquitous and considered a good thing.
It's not really ' normal' to sit down to meat and potato's and a vegetable every day any more and diets are much more mixed, but trending in the veggie/ vegan direction.

At least they'd be able to have a cup of tea though. Each to their own. It wouldn't suit me.

They don't need dairy, no humans do. The milk marketing board did a great job of convincing parents that they did though.

It's the easiest way to get calcium though.

@pinkyredrose it is one thing to not give cows milk to your child out of choice. It’s entirely different to have to change their diet for a few days when they are getting most of their calories from that milk.

Toddlers under the natural weaning age for humans need a breastmilk substitute if weaned early.

OP, I had a similar dilemma to you, and just felt I couldn't speak up. It made me so uncomfortable in my own home. I'm Muslim and only observe a halal diet. My husband is Muslim too (both born Muslims) however his family don't really observe halal. When they stayed over for the first time, even though I had cooked multiple dishes to suit everyone, his cousin went and ordered food to our own from multiple non halal takeaways. He even had my husband pay each time! It just made me so uncomfortable to pay for non halal food items on top of having this consumed in my own home.

I think what finally made me crack and speak up was when his brother made an unexpected visit to our home. He was meant to be working that day but cancelled and made a visit. He had his lunch with him and went to microwave this in my kitchen, I just had to stop him and said we don't allow haram food in our home especially in our kitchen. If your lunch isn't halal I wouldn't be comfortable with you using my microwave. His brother made faces, kind of frothing at the mouth! At my audacity to say something! He agreed to keep the lid closed and went ahead and used the microwave much to my dislike.

My husband has agreed his family won't be allowed to bring non halal food items in our home again. It just makes things so uncomfortable as they themselves are Muslims so the conversation was awkward to say the least!