11 year old pescatarian wants to go vegan

[Chingchok]

Hi all

Having decided to stop eating meat at age 9, my son now wants to stop eating fish and dairy. He has never been able to eat eggs because of allergy, but now he has switched to oat or almond milk, and doesn’t want to eat fish anymore.

We support him, however I feel really torn and anxious about his nutrition. He already has an iron deficiency (he was always on the edge of it before stopping meat), vit D deficiency and he has suspected ADHD. I’ve tried vegan fish oils (Nothing Fishy) which are almost impossible to get him to take. He takes an iron supplement and vitamin D but I also worry about b12, EFAs…

A lot of vegan ready-made foods are relatively processed, and we are both allergic to several preservatives, so I make almost everything myself. Nut cheese, chickpea tofu, miso, a wide varieties of lentils, beans, nut butters and seed dips and oils. We almost completely stopped eating meat when he did, and so I already cooked 90 per cent vegetarian foods at home. When he has to eat out, ie on a school trip, fish has often been the only option available to him.

Oh and his school is nut-free. So no almond milk, cashew nut cheese.

I would really welcome concrete advice on how to make this switch, how to make sure he gets enough of specific nutrients, how not to spend my entire life in the kitchen…

Thank you in advance for sharing your experiences!

Quite simply
I’d say no

You have done so much already to accomodate
You are a family
Presumably on some kind of budget

Say that dairy is non negotiable.
Fish - you will agree to replace two meals a week that would have been fish with a vegan alternative. But that’s it

What’s his reasoning

Taking iron and Vit d supplements? At his age? Not a good sign. He should be getting all this from a full and varied diet at that age

When you say “he has suspected adhd”

Are you pursuing a professional view on this?

Because that should be the priority rather than him stamping his feet and wanting oat milk

You're the parent. What do you think is best for him?

Why did you allow a 9yo to dictate your whole families diet? He’s literally making himself sick with an extreme diet at such a young age. If he wants to pursue this then it can be something he does as an adult with his own time and money, and he is responsible for his own health. Right now YOU are responsible for his health, and at his age he needs the nutrients that come with fish/dairy.

Well you can hardly make him eat it.
It's perfectly possible to do this safely.
Could you discuss with a dietician/gp?
School dinners are irrelevant. It's one meal, and my meat eating child doesn't have any fish, or dairy (or meat) in his pack lunch.

Also what preservatives are you/he allergic to?

@Winniemarysarah

Why did you allow a 9yo to dictate your whole families diet? He’s literally making himself sick with an extreme diet at such a young age. If he wants to pursue this then it can be something he does as an adult with his own time and money, and he is responsible for his own health. Right now YOU are responsible for his health, and at his age he needs the nutrients that come with fish/dairy.

This my daughter was swayed by a similar friend at aged 12 and I supported her - it was ridiculous I should of just agreed to do meat free once a week or something. After 12 months she came back to eating meat but I really should of just said ‘no. She’s very tall and very very thin and pale - I became very anaemic and end up with iron injections despite a multivitamin and iron supplements

Do you have an idea why he was low in iron etc. pre-giving up meat?

Usually my view has been that it doesn't matter about balanced meals it matters about a balanced diet, so for packed lunches/school trips he can take whatever works and stock up on other food groups at breakfast/tea.

But things like houmous, lentil pate, soya yogurts, falafels etc can all be in packed lunches.

I guess all you can do is batch cook and do basic meals that you can add meat to and he can have vegan protein on the side? I personally wouldn't worry about amazing meals so much as getting the right component parts. My vegetarian kids often took e.g. chick peas in a tub on the side, to add protein.

At his age it is partly his responsibility, so get him learning about what he needs and engaging with it too. Buy him a book on vegan nutrition.

@Winniemarysarah

Why did you allow a 9yo to dictate your whole families diet? He’s literally making himself sick with an extreme diet at such a young age. If he wants to pursue this then it can be something he does as an adult with his own time and money, and he is responsible for his own health. Right now YOU are responsible for his health, and at his age he needs the nutrients that come with fish/dairy.

This is an ignorant viewpoint, not eating meat is not an extreme diet, and eating meat does not ensure a good diet is eaten.

@Winniemarysarah

Why did you allow a 9yo to dictate your whole families diet? He’s literally making himself sick with an extreme diet at such a young age. If he wants to pursue this then it can be something he does as an adult with his own time and money, and he is responsible for his own health. Right now YOU are responsible for his health, and at his age he needs the nutrients that come with fish/dairy.

This. You are in charge. You must do what you think is right for him. And frankly, the fact he is already deficient in vit d and iron should make this a no brainier. Why are you pandering to him?

Trying to force kids to eat things they don't want has never worked well.

Better to engage with them on the nutrition aspects, with the right knowledge.

Dd was like this. Honestly the whole family's meals sort of slowly shifted (although the dairy thing was short lived). We eat a lot of beans, lentils and other pulses. Luckily everyone will eat quorn, we like a nut roast (although I think ours contains eggs), I have really gone off cooking meat, although I do eat fish when out. Favourite meals include:
3 bean chilli wraps with rice, guacamole, salad egg
Veggi lasange (you would need to find a white sauce substitute)
Pizza (ditto)
Curry, particularly Dahl
Bean burgers and chips
Stir fry with cashew nuts
Nut roast with all the trimmings
Various pasta dishes
Various risottos
Thai green curry with Tofu
Soups with beans/lentils in.

Everyone in this house takes a multi vitamin containing iron and vitamin D from September to May. That is not negotiable.

You have to parent him properly. My kid would eat sweets all day if I’d let them, that’s not good for them either.

You prepare him nutritionally appropriate meals for his age that everyone can eat, because you are not a short order cook, because you pay for the food and he is not royalty. If he doesn’t eat it you make him go to bed early, or remove some privileges.

I don’t force my kids to eat things they genuinely don’t like the taste of, but hate something I’ve discovered after they’ve tried it a few times and it’s a genuine dislike of the food.

@Winniemarysarah

Why did you allow a 9yo to dictate your whole families diet? He’s literally making himself sick with an extreme diet at such a young age. If he wants to pursue this then it can be something he does as an adult with his own time and money, and he is responsible for his own health. Right now YOU are responsible for his health, and at his age he needs the nutrients that come with fish/dairy.

Pescatarian isn't an extreme diet

Even the RSPCA said years ago the fish feel as much pain as mammals, and God knows they're not too fussy. Just saying. I was told off for being veggie when pregnant because my iron was low, and one thing I found useful was finding out that vitamin C makes iron absorption easier, also celeriac is rich in iron. Found these things out from my own research btw, the doctor wasn't helpful at all.

You've just announced he has a number of essential elements deficiency related to his poor diet and now you are supporting him to embark on the even more restrictive diet right at the most intense growing stage. Are you quite sure it is the right choice?

Well done for supporting him - there are so many health benefits to a plant-based diet, especially for a child. Lots of people who think veganism is drastic don't realise that red meat and processed meat are confirmed carcinogens or that dairy cows are pumped full of antibiotics.

The main issues with going from pescatarian to vegan will be omega 3 and B12. Supplements will help, but I also have image charts stuck inside my kitchen cupboard doors with good sources of each. (e.g. Chia Seeds are good for omega-3). You might find that he eats a lot of the good sources already. You could do the same for Vitamin D and Iron, and don't forget you need Vitamin C with Iron for absorbancy. I had low Iron levels for years (even when I used to eat meat), and it was only when I sorted out my Vit C intake that my Iron levels improved.

And ignore people who say children shouldn't take supplements. Vitamin D supplements are recommended for everyone in winter months.

You cannot force an eleven year old to eat meat or diary. Personally I think eating meat will become like smoking less and less socially acceptable. Perhaps you could find some compromise on the dairy, those nut milks are nutritionally void.

@Fucket "if he doesn't eat it he goes to bed early" is crazy.
You are setting children up for eating disorders if you make them eat food.
The idea of having to eat something against my will makes me gag. Why would you do that to a child.
OPs son has taken a valid ethical position and she needs to find ways to support him, healthily (it's perfectly possible). As a vegan I mostly eat vegetables.

The main issues with going from pescatarian to vegan will be omega 3 and B12. Supplements will help, but I also have image charts stuck inside my kitchen cupboard doors with good sources of each. (e.g. Chia Seeds are good for omega-3). You might find that he eats a lot of the good sources already

I'd be really interested in this do you have a link ?

[quote trumpisagit]@Fucket "if he doesn't eat it he goes to bed early" is crazy.
You are setting children up for eating disorders if you make them eat food.
The idea of having to eat something against my will makes me gag. Why would you do that to a child.
OPs son has taken a valid ethical position and she needs to find ways to support him, healthily (it's perfectly possible). As a vegan I mostly eat vegetables. [/quote]
She absolutely doesn't need to find ways to support him. She needs to ensure his diet makes him healthy. Currently it doesn't.

Taking iron and Vit d supplements? At his age? Not a good sign. He should be getting all this from a full and varied diet at that age

@Oftenithinkaboutit
The vast majority of people in the UK are vitamin d deficient because it's a vitamin that is produced primarily is exposure to sunlight and we don't get the right wavelength of UV for much of the year. The NHS recommends supplementation for all people in the UK. So your expectations seem rather uninformed

@Chingchok I think the best way to address it is to discuss the concerns with him - ask him to create solutions if he wants you to support this change. Tell him that he needs to demonstrate willingness eg by taking supplements that he's already avoiding, and helping to meal plan rather than simply expecting you to facilitate all his wishes. Teach him to create solutions

Look I eat meat and fish very occasionally and diary most days so not an extreme ethical vegan at all. But are you seriously advocating force feeding an 11yo animal products against his will ? I appreciate the fact he is deficient in certain minerals and needs supplements, but to insist someone eats food against their ethical beliefs is just wrong.

You are in charge. You must do what you think is right for him. And frankly, the fact he is already deficient in vit d and iron should make this a no brainier. Why are you pandering to him?

@superstripeysocks when did you last gave your vit D levels checked?

Public Health England recommends that EVERYONE supplements vitamin D

www.guidelinesinpractice.co.uk/nutrition/top-tips-vitamin-d-deficiency/454118.article