Page 6 | Uncomfortable about husband and friend spending the weekend together

exhaustDAD · Today 09:17

Teamrabbit · Today 09:10

Although you didn’t @ me exhaustedDAD I’ll happily explain as it seems to have touched a nerve for you.

Instinct is actually a very old biological response to danger that kept us from being eaten by lions and bears and other scary animals back when we were living in caves. Exciting!

As evolution moved on and society changed those instincts could relax a little (phew)

Nevertheless our ancient and very old alarm system operates in a modern work now - sometimes being able to detect danger by subtle changes, previous experience, face expressions, tone of voice - in fact there is many many triggers that can cause that uneasy feeling you get in your body when you feel something is quite not right. Our brains process information much quicker than our conscious does.

It could be just knowing your DH is lying when you don’t have any proof - this is usually down to tiny micro expressions and tiny changes in his tone that your brain picks up.

Having a creepy feeling about the guy at the M&S check out that makes me want to hurry past him

Not walking down a street at night as it just feels unsafe - even when no one is there.

Knowing there is a problem with your teenager even when they say they are ‘fine’

You’re brain, nervous system and stomach are all connected - that’s where the term ‘Gut Feeling’ comes from.

So it’s not ‘mystical’ or a ‘woman’s super power’ it’s just biology. Our brain processing thousands of pieces of information BEFORE out consciousness has caught up.

Maybe we are just better at it than men.

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Thank you - that is my interpretation of instinct, too. But the thing is,people causally label anything as intuition. You walking past quickly because you think a guy looks creepy, you will never ever know if that was well-founded or not. (It's still the right thing to do, mind you, I agree, you just don't know). Many-many women would steer clear of me out and about on the street when it's getting late, and I don't blame them - they don't know me. They don't know that I would never hurt them, or do anything.

gannett · Today 09:17

Aliceintheattic · Yesterday 12:51

I was having trouble putting it into words, but yes, I felt like a gooseberry.

It wasn't concious, deliberate flirting. If that was it, the situation would be different. It was more that I had to butt into the conversation too many times.

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This is such a nothingburger. They're not even flirting, they were just having a conversation you couldn't contribute to. That's a very normal situation. I've felt like that when DH is talking to one of our friends about something I don't know much about. He's definitely felt it in the reverse situation, probably a lot more. The people having the enthusiastic conversation should make an effort to include everyone, but sometimes that's hard if a third person really doesn't have much to say. In any case, it's fair to say you felt like a gooseberry and he needs to make an effort to include you - DH has said this to me and he was right. But if he'd told me to rein my friendship in with that other person (which he never has) I'd have told him to get over himself.

Mumtobabyhavoc · Today 09:18

exhaustDAD · Today 09:11

Exactly! It is passed down in our genes, based on things that are dangerous to us, like certain coloured animals being poisonous, based on patterns our ancestors embedded in them. But there is a fine line - We can't just call it instinct because it fits our narrative, because in this case, OP could easily just have a feeling. And that is just that - a feeling.
People casually calling it instinct when the bad thing they had a feeling about comes to pass, and then retrospectively promote it to knowing it instinctively. And there are myriads of other examples when the feeling come and went and no bad thing happened. Somehow that wasn't instinct.

Realistically, it would also be a bit jarring and nonsensical to imagine that the husband so openly puts it in view that he has plans with the friend, right there in the presence of OP. That makes no sense, either. And of course he changed how he behaved - it was brought to his attention that something makes his wife uncomfortable, of course he needs to address it somehow.

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"Realistically, it would also be a bit jarring and nonsensical to imagine that the husband so openly puts it in view that he has plans with the friend, right there in the presence of OP."

Are you new to MN? 🤔🤦‍♀️
People do this all. the. time. thinking they're not obvious. 🙄

gannett · Today 09:19

I have to say - as a mixed-race woman - a lot of the time when people bang on about gut instinct, the behaviour they're actually describing seems a lot like common or garden prejudice based on socially constructed stereotypes. Crossing the road when you see a Black man in a hoodie, for instance.

gannett · Today 09:19

I have to say - as a mixed-race woman - a lot of the time when people bang on about gut instinct, the behaviour they're actually describing seems a lot like common or garden prejudice based on socially constructed stereotypes. Crossing the road when you see a Black man in a hoodie, for instance.

FoldItIn · Today 09:20

Another one who doesn't understand why you would put yourself in this situation.
You spoke to your DH about how uncomfortable it made you, which is actually a really healthy thing to do! Both he and your friend then adjusted their behaviour and you decided to continue to be friends and place yourselves in situations like the upcoming weekend.
You either continue to be friends and things like this crop up or you step back from the friendship/activity.
I wouldn't be happy about the weekend either but I think, if I had got to the point where I had to discuss my DH's behaviour around another woman, I would have probably stepped back from the friendship.
I understand that attraction is natural and what not but I wouldn't want to be witness to it or have to worry about it becoming a problem. You chose otherwise @Aliceintheattic

exhaustDAD · Today 09:21

SharkyBait · Today 09:13

50-50…so why are you dismissing OP’s gut feeling that something is amiss? Every post of yours on here is you telling her she’s insecure and it’s in her head. The reality is that there is a good chance it wasn’t in her head at all. Intuition exists for a reason and it is often correct.

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PPs above very nicely listed what instinct actually is. LAbelling something as instinct will not automatically make it that, though.

I am saying that treating it like something IS going on is false based on some uncomfortable feelings. That is not instinct, and that IS in her mind. Because there was nothing happening and nobody did anything (again, her words, not mine)

Her 50-50 is the same as yours and mine. We could be cheated on when we are at work or something, or not. Purely based on the numbers, it could happen. And that's where reality comes in. First of all, you trust your spouse, hopefully, and second, without anything happening or any proof you don't create a problem - talking about it is the right thing to do, openly, honestly. And that should be it really. Not encouraging nonsense like running there unexpectedly to catch the potentially unfaithful husband.

2O26 · Today 09:24

I read a book called "The Gift of Fear" about trusting your intuition.
The Gift of Fear: Survival Signals That Protect Us from ...
It has real life stories about warning signs and trusting intuition.

gannett · Today 09:27

FoldItIn · Today 09:20

Another one who doesn't understand why you would put yourself in this situation.
You spoke to your DH about how uncomfortable it made you, which is actually a really healthy thing to do! Both he and your friend then adjusted their behaviour and you decided to continue to be friends and place yourselves in situations like the upcoming weekend.
You either continue to be friends and things like this crop up or you step back from the friendship/activity.
I wouldn't be happy about the weekend either but I think, if I had got to the point where I had to discuss my DH's behaviour around another woman, I would have probably stepped back from the friendship.
I understand that attraction is natural and what not but I wouldn't want to be witness to it or have to worry about it becoming a problem. You chose otherwise @Aliceintheattic

I'm not sure what she actually spoke to them about though.

"You two are leaving me out of conversations, please be more mindful not to get carried away and unintentionally exclude me" is a fair thing to say and they should adjust their behaviour.

That's a far cry from "I think you two fancy each other and you should hang out with each other less" (which is much less reasonable given the lack of evidence).

exhaustDAD · Today 09:27

Can I kindly ask all of you who are so determined about OP's husband being dodgy based on her own feelings:

What would you say if your husband said that he is uncomfortable with you going out/see friends/whatever place because there will be attractive men there? With the support of his friends, who also say you shouldn't go. His gut feeling is that something might happen. Does it make it true? Or would you not be happy as you did nothing wrong?

Notonthestairs · Today 09:29

Hhhhmmm.
So posters deriding the Op's concerns are also posters whose partners have had to point out that they've been sidelined. Doesn't indicate the most self aware personalities. I don't think my husband has ever had to ask me to include him in a conversation.

Op - talk to your husband. He respected your feelings before. Give him the chance to reassure you. It's possible he is aware that you might feel odd about it and will welcome the opportunity to reiterate what he has said in the past.

exhaustDAD · Today 09:29

gannett · Today 09:27

I'm not sure what she actually spoke to them about though.

"You two are leaving me out of conversations, please be more mindful not to get carried away and unintentionally exclude me" is a fair thing to say and they should adjust their behaviour.

That's a far cry from "I think you two fancy each other and you should hang out with each other less" (which is much less reasonable given the lack of evidence).

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Exactly this.

PurplebudsWhitebuds · Today 09:30

RoachFish · Today 08:40

It's their kids hobby. Her H hasn't gone out of his way to organise a weekend together with OPs friend, their kids are both going to be there and it could have just as easily been OP who was going but this time she has other plans. Should OPs kids have to stop doing their hobby because their mum has a hunch that their dad might like another parent who takes her kid there a bit too much?

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Describing what was happening between OP's H and this woman last year as a hunch
is very much dismissing and minimising it. They must have acknowledged that they were overstepping boundaries otherwise their behaviour wouldn't have changed when OP made it clear she was unhappy about it

I don't know what this activity is their children are attending. But if it was clear OP wasn't able to attend then at that stage it could have been decided that her children couldn't go and her H could have made plans to do something else with them - something else they enjoyed . It's not set in stone that children always attend every event to do with an activity they enjoy.

Notonthestairs · Today 09:31

exhaustDAD · Today 09:27

Can I kindly ask all of you who are so determined about OP's husband being dodgy based on her own feelings:

What would you say if your husband said that he is uncomfortable with you going out/see friends/whatever place because there will be attractive men there? With the support of his friends, who also say you shouldn't go. His gut feeling is that something might happen. Does it make it true? Or would you not be happy as you did nothing wrong?

This was a specific person and how they interacted with the Op's husband - as witnessed by the Op.
Not random concerns about someone going out for the night.

Teamrabbit · Today 09:36

exhaustDAD · Today 09:11

Exactly! It is passed down in our genes, based on things that are dangerous to us, like certain coloured animals being poisonous, based on patterns our ancestors embedded in them. But there is a fine line - We can't just call it instinct because it fits our narrative, because in this case, OP could easily just have a feeling. And that is just that - a feeling.
People casually calling it instinct when the bad thing they had a feeling about comes to pass, and then retrospectively promote it to knowing it instinctively. And there are myriads of other examples when the feeling come and went and no bad thing happened. Somehow that wasn't instinct.

Realistically, it would also be a bit jarring and nonsensical to imagine that the husband so openly puts it in view that he has plans with the friend, right there in the presence of OP. That makes no sense, either. And of course he changed how he behaved - it was brought to his attention that something makes his wife uncomfortable, of course he needs to address it somehow.

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Lol - you think it’s unbelievable that people have affairs in plain sight?

Maybe their DH (or DW) laugh and call it nonsensical and pour scorn when their partner questions things and blame it on nerves and insecurity. Slowly sending them round the twist and shredding any capability of making a judgement

I’m nearly 50 and I’ve known plenty of spouses get caught shagging their partners ‘best friends’

Any who - thanks for a blokes perspective but it’s pretty standard 😂

Teamrabbit · Today 09:37

Notonthestairs · Today 09:31

This was a specific person and how they interacted with the Op's husband - as witnessed by the Op.
Not random concerns about someone going out for the night.

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Yeah this one is a bit of a gas lighter (my instincts tell me 😁)

FoldItIn · Today 09:38

gannett · Today 09:27

I'm not sure what she actually spoke to them about though.

"You two are leaving me out of conversations, please be more mindful not to get carried away and unintentionally exclude me" is a fair thing to say and they should adjust their behaviour.

That's a far cry from "I think you two fancy each other and you should hang out with each other less" (which is much less reasonable given the lack of evidence).

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The OP sounds reasonable enough so I would hope it would be more along the lines of your first option? Hopefully she will clarify.
She did the right thing bringing it up though. Very straightforward and everyone knows where they stand. Far more healthy than stewing on it. We are allowed to say so if something makes us uncomfortable.

SharkyBait · Today 09:44

exhaustDAD · Today 09:21

PPs above very nicely listed what instinct actually is. LAbelling something as instinct will not automatically make it that, though.

I am saying that treating it like something IS going on is false based on some uncomfortable feelings. That is not instinct, and that IS in her mind. Because there was nothing happening and nobody did anything (again, her words, not mine)

Her 50-50 is the same as yours and mine. We could be cheated on when we are at work or something, or not. Purely based on the numbers, it could happen. And that's where reality comes in. First of all, you trust your spouse, hopefully, and second, without anything happening or any proof you don't create a problem - talking about it is the right thing to do, openly, honestly. And that should be it really. Not encouraging nonsense like running there unexpectedly to catch the potentially unfaithful husband.

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Let’s try again…I am asking you why you have been so consistently dismissive of the situation and patronising everyone who has brought up “instinct” or “gut feeling”? There might be something between the dh and the friend or there might not be, none of us can say, but you have told OP that nothing is happening and she is insecure, lacking self-worth, that her uncomfortable feelings are nonsense, that gut feelings are “silly woodoo-magic nonsense” and “witchcraft level nonsense”. You have dismissed any sense of intuition as not worthy of consideration and been rude and patronising in the process.

climbintheback · Today 09:52

It happened to me - a New Years kiss that is too enthusiastic, seating arrangements in a restaurant or car journey contrived and obvious, glad when we moved away actually.

exhaustDAD · Today 09:58

SharkyBait · Today 09:44

Let’s try again…I am asking you why you have been so consistently dismissive of the situation and patronising everyone who has brought up “instinct” or “gut feeling”? There might be something between the dh and the friend or there might not be, none of us can say, but you have told OP that nothing is happening and she is insecure, lacking self-worth, that her uncomfortable feelings are nonsense, that gut feelings are “silly woodoo-magic nonsense” and “witchcraft level nonsense”. You have dismissed any sense of intuition as not worthy of consideration and been rude and patronising in the process.

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Because it is not facts. To make it worse, OP herself said "NOTHING HAPPENED" and "NOBODY DID ANYTHING". And those are the facts. The first-hand experience of the person it happened to, the person the story is about. Not your or my guesswork, or our own experiences. OP herself surely knows it is on the border of nothing, otherwise she would have lead with the details, if there was something truly going on, something with actual merit, it would be front and center - but that is just my gut feeling, you know. It is jut feeling uncomfortable about something - and by the sound of it, they do communicate, it is not impossible to solve, without going on witchhunts.

No matter how lowly anyone will make me sound for not joining hands and urging actions based on hunches, one thing is for sure: NOTHING happened, and treating would-be ideas as facts is not normal or healthy.

KittyCorncrake · Today 09:59

exhaustDAD · Today 08:26

With all due respect - I stopped reading after the first sentence. (Eventually did read for curiosity, regardless).
People like you need to get it through your head that your unfortunate personal experience will not form a general rule that is true for everyone in the world.
You are only the center of your own world, not anyone else's. Here, let me give you an example. Well, your friend’s ex husband and another friend were too comfortable and sure enough there was an affair. You didn't feel comfortable with an old boss, and behold, convicted for fraud. Congratulations, you have a special gift that you just see these in the starts. If I may quote your lines back at you - what bullshit. I am very comfortable and have good fun in the presence of my wife's friends (her childhood friends, as well as close work friends), they are very cool people, and 1-2 of them are even attractive - I KNOW, the horror. And you know what? Not ever would I consider cheating on my wife with them, not once would I be tempted, not fighting it off. I know plenty of managers and bosses myself - an old boss of mine I alway had a bad feeling about, and it was nothing, he was just not a people person, but did everything by the books.

See the problem by being so callous about your own experiences? They are yours, and there will be countless others who experienced something else. So, please, take those mighty intuition skills that never lie and use it for good - Go, win the lottery or some game show. How awesome must it be that you never once get it wrong - Jesus, I can't even finish with that joke, that's so embarrassingly flippant to consider. "My intuitions are NEVER wrong". Wow. To be this full of ourself and believe your own feelings to just 100% be unquestionable. That is rather special. In short: I am saying these feelings are purely feelings that are not based on facts, for everyone, me, OP, and even for you.

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Of only MN could implement a facility to be able to block posters…
(I don’t mean @CamillaMcCauley - she is spot on)

PinotandPray · Today 10:00

Aliceintheattic · Yesterday 07:53

Name change for obvious reasons.

So, I've been married for nearly 20 years. Two young teens.
Husband and I have very long term friends who are a couple. Really, I made a friend, and we dragged our husbands along. We've done a lot together.

About a year ago, the vibe between my husband and my friend got a bit too enthusiastic. Nothing concrete, but I really felt invisible.

I had to get pretty direct, and it stopped.

Out kids are both into the same activity, and there's a event on this weekend. I have to visit a relative, so I'm not going. My husband and my friend are each taking the kids. They aren't travelling, but will be spending a big part of the weekend together. I'm not super comfortable with this, but really not sure how to approach it.

Why isn’t her DH taking the children instead OP? That’s what seems more appropriate!

SharkyBait · Today 10:00

exhaustDAD · Today 09:58

Because it is not facts. To make it worse, OP herself said "NOTHING HAPPENED" and "NOBODY DID ANYTHING". And those are the facts. The first-hand experience of the person it happened to, the person the story is about. Not your or my guesswork, or our own experiences. OP herself surely knows it is on the border of nothing, otherwise she would have lead with the details, if there was something truly going on, something with actual merit, it would be front and center - but that is just my gut feeling, you know. It is jut feeling uncomfortable about something - and by the sound of it, they do communicate, it is not impossible to solve, without going on witchhunts.

No matter how lowly anyone will make me sound for not joining hands and urging actions based on hunches, one thing is for sure: NOTHING happened, and treating would-be ideas as facts is not normal or healthy.

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And your assertion that OP is insecure and lacking self-worth aren’t facts either.

tamade · Today 10:01

exhaustDAD · Yesterday 23:48

Thank you for clarifying. So, as it turns out it is just you not trusting them, your insecurity, they have done nothing, as you've put it.

All of you jumping the shark - this is why it is worth finding out all the details before being super judgemental immediately.

Jumping the shark doesn't mean what you think it does.
And having read OP's updates the situation is a little more nuanced than your blunt and quite aggressive summary mansplanation

exhaustDAD · Today 10:01

KittyCorncrake · Today 09:59

Of only MN could implement a facility to be able to block posters…
(I don’t mean @CamillaMcCauley - she is spot on)

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Wouldn't mind that myself. Blocking people who are so into their own hype to believe that their gut feelings are unquestionable truth, for example.

Yeah, she's spot on. Thinking her "insticnts" to ALWAYS, 100% be right. Believe she can't be wrong - she is spot on. Do you not hear how ridiculous that is?