Gav calls for Silent Corridors - School Behaviour Squad Assembled

[noblegiraffe]

Gavin Williamson made a speech today praising strict schools that don’t let kids piss about in lessons (you’d think this’d be fairly standard, but, y’know, Dix) and have silent corridors.

A new £10 million behaviour task force is being assembled led by Tom Bennett and will work to tackle this on a national level. Not sure how this will have any more impact than his behaviour report that appeared to make fuck-all difference though.

What would be lovely is if he could say ‘centralised detentions are a non-negotiable to be implemented immediately’. But I suspect not.

NEU are not happy, obvs.

schoolsweek.co.uk/williamson-calls-for-silent-corridors-and-banned-mobiles-to-be-the-norm/

Yes hopeandglory my DD had similar experiences.

Dd has autism and is terrified of breaking a rule and inadvertently getting a detention. It has taken a long time to persuade her she only needs to pack for one day plus things she might need. There's a tipping point at which she will carry all her books for all the subjects every day. If anyone knows of an industrial strength rucksack at a reasonable price do let me know.

Teachers are leaving the profession in droves because of poor behaviour so I really don’t think there’s an epidemic of kids being overly punished for minor rule infringements. Individual schools may have completely inflexible policies but I don’t see them being particularly supported by teachers on MN.

A YouGov poll in 2014 for Ofsted said that kids were potentially losing an hour of learning per day due to low level disruption, and I don’t think things have dramatically improved since then. Teacher retention figures certainly have got worse, with behaviour a major factor.

My dd’s school gets good results without zero tolerance discipline and behaviour is fine. Why don’t other schools copy this instead?

I think dc with sn are penalised in the zero tolerance set up. It just also isn’t a respectful way to treat young people and doesn’t model for them how to treat others respectfully

Copy what, onceuponatime - what does the school do that is successful?

Tom Bennett who is leading this behaviour group isn’t a zero tolerance fan.

He said on twitter he’d go for quiet corridors over silent ones.

And while we’re talking about kids with SEN, let’s spare a thought for the autistic kids being bashed about in noisy, rowdy corridors, or who can’t concentrate because the kids around them in lessons can’t be arsed to save their conversations till lunchtime.

Or the kids with learning needs who aren’t getting the attention they need because the teacher is too busy trying to deal with low-level disruption from kids without SEN.

Well dont generalise noble I have an autistic child who would be the main culprit for bashing about and being noisy in the corridors. And another who would love quiet, calm corridors.

No one said behaviour isn't an issue in many schools, but I obviously there are different opinions on the reasons and solutions to that, and I don't think strict behaviour policies is the only answer. Unfortunately the other answers are not as simple as a cheap and quick fix behaviour policy so our government isn't interested...

A YouGov poll in 2014 for Ofsted said that kids were potentially losing an hour of learning per day due to low level disruption

I don’t know if things have changed but I went to a strict private school and many lessons with certain teachers were disrupted by the teachers themselves correcting minor infringements like slouching or if anyone’s hair wasn’t the right colour or 101 different misdemeanours that in the grand scheme of things didn’t actually mean you couldn’t learn.

Sometimes it is the teachers themselves that waste the time

Dd went to a very laid back school.

Certain things were definite big misdemeanours that would get you expelled or suspended (like drugs or alcohol) but on the whole as long as you turned up and tried your best then there wasn’t any demerits

Behaviour was really quite good.

Yes you were expected to have equipment but if you didn’t then you either bought stuff before school or borrowed from friends.

Dd (Dyslexic, ADD with processing issues) took 22 pens into school. By first break she had lost 14.

Not all SEN children can keep track of pens and equipment. They can arrive at school with the stuff. It might not be in them by the start of the relevant lesson.

In my experience schools in leafy suburban areas with kids with highly educated and supportive parents can afford to be 'laid back' and still have good behaviour, those in more challenging areas can't. I went to a leafy middle class comp and can't remember even having to line up outside a classroom silently, we all just wandered in and it was fine. At the school I teach at now that would be carnage. We don't have silent corridors but in general we have very strict, high behaviour standards and it works brilliantly.

@Mistressiggi my instinct is that it is a calm sensible set of rules, but a strong relationship between staff and pupils - there is a big emphasis on mutual respect and pride in the school community. Eg very strong pastoral care - there is a room kids can go to during the school day if they are struggling. It says in the school handbook thing that children with sn can go there if they don’t understand homework they’ve been given or need organisational help - I don’t know what they offer in practice but I can imagine that is better than detention for losing your pen!

My teaching Bible is 'Other People's Children' by Lisa Delpit. It explores how white middle class 'laid back' education ideology is disadvantageous to students who come from cultures where adults are much more authoritative. It's fascinating and completely changed the way I teach (I teach mainly Nigerian students). Katherine Birbalsigh (Michaela founder) talks about this as well: White parents protesting her meetings to set up her school while Black parents were inside the meetings desperate for a school that wouldn't fail their kids.

Like all things in education, its a lack of any bloody common sense isnt it?

Silent corridors are a poor idea anyway, would you like to work in that environment? I wouldn't.
St Hell High, currently behaviour is shocking and there's throwing running and fighting in corridors, just how exactly would they enforce this? You would need a teacher outside every door and mid way through a corridor every second of every changeover and it would still be a battle. Sanctions would equal even more workload for staff already on their knees.

My wish list would be more like

Centralised detentions
Senior staff on patrol on a rota during lesson time with walkie talkies, presence makes a big difference
Keep left on corridors
No phones at all to be seen, or else confiscated for several days not just to the end of the day which is no deterrent
No pop allowed
A behaviour system that is one warning then remove, not five or six warnings
Kids not being brought back if naughty or removed ten minutes later
Not having half the class on passes to leave whenever they need to go to student hub, or leave five minutes early for anxiety, it's like five in a class and they all get to take a mate.
A big push on arriving on time, centralised sanctions if late to lessons

And breathe.... 😂

Sorry, paragraphs disappeared in my last post!

Behaviour is fine and really quite good aren't really ringing endorsements!

And, actauly, how do parents really know this anyway? My Ofste dreport says behaviour at my school is 'good'. Ask any of the (non SLT) teachers and you will find different. One of the major issues is the corridors.

I have visited tow silent corridor schools. I don't think it would work at my school but the atmosphere at both schools was serene. I was less bothered about the corridors than the oppressive quiet in lessons tbh. The colleague I spoke with, who sued to work at a 'leafy suburban noisy comp' said she went home every day feeling calm and unstressed as opposed to previously when she felt wound up. Wound up teachers is good for nobody.

The students who are really noisy and boisterous in corridors feed off each other.

I would settle for ones where children didn't cheerfully tell each other to fuck off while charging about.

And this is what many silent corridor type rules are in response to and I think so many parents do not realise and won't accept this and instead choose to focus on slouching and pens (slouching is often very passive aggressive though). I am so embarrassed at my school that kids will bowl about , shove and swear even when there are visitors waiting at reception.

Except in the case of my school over the last five years I'd replace the cheerfully with aggressively.

And there are lots of jobs where you would be disciplined for repeatedly forgetting things or slouching at your desk and doing no work!

WineWolfHowls for Education Secretary. Wise words, wolfie, wise words.

I'd just settle for seeing my SLT!!

Winewolfhowls feel like you could be a colleague and yes.

£10m focussing on poor behaviour! Money would be much better spent on looking at the causes of the poor behaviour. Undiagnosed special needs would be a huge cause of disruptive behaviour. Spend the money on speech therapists and Ed Psychs in schools. What about poverty as a cause of poor behaviour? Lack of aspiration? Lack of equal opportunity. If a child gets a fixed-term exclusion, they should be automatically referred to cahms. This is where the money should be spent.

@ValancyRedfern My experience backs up what you are saying. White leafy MC areas can have not so strict policies because on the whole students engage. But the worst school in terms of behaviour policy was an "outstanding" one in a white MC area. Every sanction was left to the individual teacher and nothing backed by SLT.

Unless you have seen the disengagement and complete lack of respect from some students in more diverse areas, then it is very difficult to imagine. These students on the whole have no boundaries at home so need them in school to get them to learn.

Sensationalism about a student not having a pen and being thrown in the dungeon doesn't help. Few schools have a policy this strict. As I'm sure noble has explained before, (SEN aside) it's rarely just having no pen that's the problem.

Classes sizes are simply too big. Teachers are overworked. Kids of all ages need to be able to connect to teaching staff and not feel like one of many. This is not an attack on teachers, the majority of whom, I suspect, would prefer smaller class sizes and to be able to devote more time to individual children.

Also important to take into consideration is behaviour bring influenced by events in children's lives outside school. The more stressors are home, the likely the worse the behaviour (in general).

If bad behaviour is part of a stress response, then punishing children or adding more stress by demerits etc for forgetting things, doesn't help them overall. There are schools in the USA that have adopted a "trauma-informed" approach (which is better described as a stress-informed approach) and had great results in behaviour changes. And academic outcomes.

But it's far, far easier to blame kids, including teens, for "bad behaviour" than accept they're struggling with something you/we don't understand. Or admitting the whole system could do with an overhaul. Silent/quiet corridors are far easier.

Assuming money is spent and children are referred to CAMHS, you do know they often send the issues right back to the school , don't you? In my experience CAMHS and various other support agencies come up with a range of issues they have identified (often already identified by the school : FTEs are often done to try to trigger such interventions) and then tell the school to invest money and time in solving them.

But, if -in an ideal world- CAMHS referrals were quick and CAMHS themselves were helpful, other lobbyists are trying to prevent/stop FTEs so this would not really be a helpful route through for help, ultimately.

Of course, there are myriad complex reasons why some students exhibit poor behaviour. Of course there are. I am sure (well, maybe not 100% confident) that the task force will acknowledge this. I don't know all the schools represented on the task force but there are APUs and SN schools and I can't see any Michaela type schools.

What is more interesting , politically, is that the government wants to set up behaviour lead schools : and these schools also have to have excellent Progress 8, an outstanding Ofsted report - and 45% EBacc 'success'. Hmmm.... methinks they are trying to forge a connection there!

My child goes to a new school that has strict policies. They have silent corridors, morning equipment check, and must be sat down with equipment within a certain time frame for every lesson or they get a detention. Forgetting pens is caught at equipment check and straight detention if you don’t have everything in your clear pencil case.

It’s brilliant. There are absolutely no major issues that I’ve heard of, unlike other nearby schools, because there’s no time. Interestingly all shitty things are happening on WhatsApp and outside school, which is understandable as they’re hormonal 12 year olds. so it’s not they’re not being allowed to be children, it’s just the HT has set out that school is a place of learning and respect. I don’t have a problem with strictness at all and my child is happier for it too.

Just seen this on Twitter :

Year 11s walking calmly and silently in corridors or being boisterous and swearing all the way down the corridor. One of these is controversial behaviour and it’s not the one it should be. By the way I have experienced both, just this week. I know which I prefer.

Some links if anybody is interested:
National Child Traumatic Stress Network
https://www.nctsn.org/trauma-informed-care/creating-trauma-informed-systems/schools

Trauma Informed School
https://www.traumainformedschool.us

brief text from this site (https://www.crisisprevention.com)

More than half of all young people have reported exposure to violence or abuse, and by the age of 16, more than two thirds will have experienced a potentially traumatic event. Adverse childhood experiences (ACES) can impact a child’s cognitive abilities and impede their development, which limits their academic potential.

And as the study of ACES continues, the spectrum of qualifying events has broadened. The first major studyy of ACES identified 10 common experiencess which can be traumatic for children and young adults, culminating in adverse health outcomes in adulthood.

With continued research, that core list of identified adverse experiences has grownn_ to include experiences such as bullying, the death of a loved one, deportation or migration, medical trauma, witnessing community violence or any type of violence outside of the home, and discrimination due to race, gender, sexual orientation, birthplace, ability, or region/ethnicity.

These findings make clear that any discussion of trauma-informedd_ schools must start not only with identifying adverse events that can limit a child’s ability to learn, grow, and thrive—but with the recognition that these events are not confined to one economic, social, or ethnic layer of our society.

Briefly what trauma is for kids: (it's followed by more info in the roles school can play given that teachers are not - nor should be - mental health practitioners: childsavers.org/why-do-we-need-trauma-informed-schools/)
"Often times we think of childhood trauma and chronic toxic stress coming through abuse, neglect, a physically or emotionally absent caregiver, domestic violence, or community violence. However, it can also come from the loss of a parent, school or community bullying, poverty, medical conditions, or even the pressure to achieve and meet expectations. Trauma is not just defined by the event, but also by one’s experience of it. Moreover, trauma is any experience that causes ongoing anxiety, stress, or fear that overwhelms the individual’s ability to cope."