Talks about reconciliation 2

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I've never started a thread here before, but I thought some people might be interested in this take on the story by a PR podcast I listened to yesterday (started listening to this podcast as I know very little about PR!).

It would be good to know if any of the resident PR people agree.

When It Hits The Fan: A Right Royal Whodunnit

I agree. Not weak, and not guilty either. Considering all the lies Harry has told, forgiving him and accepting him back makes him looks as if he has some justification in what he did.

@GiveMeSpanakopita you called it a few weeks ago, couldn’t see it but you clearly could. I’m in awe of your knowledge!

agree with @RandyRedHumpback why the fuck should Catherine be kind, after everything the pair and their supporters have unleashed on her.

Loathsome pair. And I’m not even a royalist.

I have followed this fued closely as we have had a deep rupture in our own family that started at exactly the same time. I have done loads of research on estranged families and reconcilliation and there is a pattern of rapprochement at 7 years - which would be now - as I suspect that there was distance certainly between the sons and wives from the time around the wedding way before their departure.

I wonder if psychologically and physiologically our minds and bodies are just done with it?

I have wanted a reconcilliation amongst my siblings for a long time but covid kept the distance - both at the time and then how people/society chnaged afterwards. The intensity wains from deep hurt, bitterness, anger, wanting an apology, to requiring an acknowlegment to realising none of these will ever happen and just letting go to a desire of just wanting to be confident that we can be civil when required to be when in the same social space. Probably like the stages of grief where acceptance is the end point - with me its indifference - and thats a freeing place. There are no parents involved in our issue so I think that makes it simpler. There was also a toxic partner who wreaked havoc who is now not on the scene. So simpler again. The drama has dissipated and all of our lives have filled up independently in those 7 years. There will never be the closeness (trust shattered) again but to be able to have a very short and boundaried and calm conversation necessary at a family funeral rather than heart-pounding anxiety that you will be attacked and humiliated is a huge relief.

There is even a PR element as extended family and friends just want to see peace. It is also interesting that there were fractures within the fracture in our family similar as I suspect there are within the RF - and everyone has to respect that everyone is exactly where they need to be which will be different. Its delicate, subtle and nuanced and came froma place of deep childhood trauma and then another family trauma which exposed the foundational vulnerability of the family which I see paralleled in the RF. The past was another country - the now and future is a totally different and 'new' dynamic fragile and cautious.

We had a family illness (now resolved) which changed the dynamic but I see the RF are still far to deep in this and the fued only made this worse for PW (PC/ss/M&H) - and it must have been galling for PW seeing PH swing into action with his DF whilst sending a backhanded wholely inadequate SM post to PC, who's impact of cancer is hugely worse as a mother of very young DC. So I can see PC looking for a civilised connection with his DS and DGC at what I am guessing is end of life (he looks increasingly shocking) and PW being a very long way off.

I have zero sympathy for PH - he has behaved appallingly - worst IMHO was OW interview when his grandfather was in hospital on end of life care in the final weeks of his life. I also judge 'saint' OW harshly here. I havent mentioned MM. She's a toxic wrong'un with a long history of leaving deep emotional injury in her wake - and it was PH responsibility to protect his family from her rather than being her flying monkey and doing all the dirty work for her.

Maybe Charles is thinking ahead and offering an olive branch so that when he does die, Harry can’t play the perpetual victim ‘ I wasn’t allowed to see my dieing Father’ card, like he did with the late Queen?
if that’s the case William doesn’t need to be involved as I am sure the public would completely understand why he doesn’t want anything to do with his brother.

I can’t see that any kind of rapprochement is going to end well, KCIII and Harry have very different objectives.

I would also hope that no one within the RF expects Catherine to ‘get to work’ on William. Her brother in law has behaved despicably towards her, neither Catherine of William owe Harry (or his wife) anything at all and what ever comes Harry’s way further down the road will not garner any sympathy from me.

I’m sceptical. It’s just not normal for any experienced PR professionals worth their salt and aware of the huge press speculation and interest in this subject, to agree to hold an exceptionally private meeting out on a balcony where they can be seen in public.

The Palace has access to any number of private rooms in any number of buildings around Whitehall where both sides could slip in and out unnoticed by the press. And if that was seen as too “enemy camp”, a solicitor’s office with some private back stairs would be more usual.

I reckon that both sides agreed to it, to get the message across that talks were happening, without having to be explicit about it, and to remove time pressures and stop press speculation about Charles and Harry meeting up.

I don’t buy that M & H had more to gain from leaking this. Harry was the last to call for reconciliation, and he did that very openly, putting the ball in Charles’s court. I think this is about the palace buying time.

I think so too

A few comments:

Charlotte Gifford appears to be really disliked by viewers of Palace Confidential for her pro- Harry stance. Even I find her vapid and annoying. Maureen Callahan, who also works for the DM, is blatantly anti- Harry on "The Nerve" and appears to be doing well.

It's interesting that @GiveMeSpanakopita mentioned "The Godfather". Harry's been compared to Fredo for years now on reddit. This is not a compliment to him.

So we should all hold hands and sing Kumbaya and forget about Sentebale, African Parks, and the dodgy financials of Archewell, and the Sussex Squad? Travalyst also bears more scrutiny. Someone on MN posted that Mark Toth article a few days ago just when I was thinking about it.

Many PR campaigns don't work. Bud Light, Coke, etc. have found this out to their detriment. Ditto Kamala Harris. I argued with my family for months saying that she was going to lose and that the Democrats were handling everything incorrectly. I thought we should have run her proposed VP for president, someone else for VP, and no Harris. In the end, they admitted that I was right.

If it were me, I'd ship H off to beachfront property in Portugal and keep him there. He leaves, the allowance ends.

This is spot on.

Might I add that I view the SS as a terrorist group, and I'm an American.

Charlotte Gifford appears to be really disliked by viewers of Palace Confidential for her pro- Harry stance. Even I find her vapid and annoying. Maureen Callahan, who also works for the DM, is blatantly anti- Harry on "The Nerve" and appears to be doing well.

But this polarisation is exactly set up to generate clicks. The DM have zero idealogical stance on the monarchy or the individual players. They just needs eyeballs. This is a commercial decision. Same as the Beckham 'fued' - they will be contrary and post annoying headlines just to enrage people which keeps them hooked.

He even wore the SAME OUTFIT as Diana did! Did you clock that? Compare the two photos side by side. Harry has the same colour and cut of shirt, trousers and flak jacket (a flak jacket is of zero use when walking across a mined field ofc. If you step on a mine, you'll still end up in approximately 37 disparately strewn pieces over a square mile, flak jack or no flak jack. But Diana wanted to wear one for the optics, and so Harry did too). He has even been captured in the same pose!

It was spectacularly ill-judged. Fine, walk across a mine field. But copying your late mother so closely? I mean, there's Oedipal Complex, and then there's Oedipal Complex on a scale that would make Freud run screaming from his office in horror.

I wonder how Sussex supporters will view the rapprochement, will they be for it or against?

They have hitched their colours to the mast very clearly. If it fails they will go for the Waleses even more.

I suspect that depends on whether Meghan is included or acknowledged. If she's not, they will turn on Harry in a heartbeat.

Tbf I wouldn’t really care if they did. Let him have some of the same treatment, he created the beast.

I agree. BRF are throwing H&M a bone. There are teams of strategists with an agenda to protect the 1000 year old institution - H&M wont 'win' - but if they think they have - it - as PP said buys some time, gets PH off PC back and the ball back in H&M court.

I was just reflecting on the 'fab four' walkabout in Windsor after QE2 funeral and only now concluded that this was ill advised. H&M did not 'deserve' this honor or profile since they had brought such pain to QE2 in the days and weeks of PP death (OW interview), the multiple interviews after close to QE2 death (eg The Cut) and at the time the NF docuseries and Spare were hanging over the RF heads (inclusing QE2) - as well as violating her privacy with Lilibet name.

I see that RF were trying to show unity but I saw MM exploit that with her usual MO of 'victim' where she wore zero make-up and was doing the skittish, clinging, scared, ickle girl performance, enough to rile Kate who fell inot MM trap by looking furious. MM's highly manipulative and you have to drop the rope with narcs because they are wired to exploit every situation and often 'win' in the moment.

I find it shocking to consider the Sussex Squad a terrorist organisation alongside Hamas and Hezbollah?

Before I get accused otherwise, I think there is a lot wrong with the Sussex Squad, I feel I need a shower after reading some of the stuff they write. But really, they are not terrorists.

If the problem was a PR one, I would agree with you @GiveMeSpanakopita .

But, IMHO, the fundamental problem with H is a national security issue.

Put yourself in the position of the Head of the CIA. You have Omid Scobie claiming that the "royal racists" letter came from KC3's desk. Thus telling the world that KC3's desk is not secure and individuals can swipe materials off the desk.

As the Head of the CIA you are aware of all the intelligence information that crosses KC3's desk that is vital for USA national security. NATO and US forces based on UK soil. NORAD (North American Air Defense, most famous for Santa tracker, but ensuring that Canadian and US airspace is secure.) Five Eyes. (US intelligence sharing data with 4 of KC3's realms UK, Canada, Australia and New Zealand)

So as Head of the CIA you cannot roll your eyes and say that the info is from H&M, you have to pull agents from other important tasks to ensure that KC3's office is secure.

And the root cause of disruptions to vital national security functions is H's reckless behavior. Multiply the problem H created, via his proxy Omid, across all the various intelligence agencies across all sovereign nations as each nation wants to ensure any security and diplomatic information that crosses KC3's desk is secure.

IMHO, there is no PR solution to a national security problem. It is like giving a diabetes patient botox. Botox won't address the underlying issue, which if uncontrolled will result in even more severe issues for said diabetes patient.

IIRC the walkabout happened as a joint one as the Sussexes were going to do one anyway.

Definitely. I made this point a couple of days ago. Diana’s era was as far away from, say, people in their 20s now as the 2nd World War was when I was that age. Younger people neither know nor care about her.

Apart from the reasonable nod to the 30th anniversary of her death in 2 years’ time, Harry really needs to keep his memorialising private. William doesn’t make such a fuss and I’m sure that’s partly why H does.

It's worth remembering how fiercely protective Camilla is of Charles. She will be closely monitoring any change to the status quo and will be rightly wary of Harry and his motives.

I hadn't heard that before - where did that info come from? Sounds like the tail wagging the dog in that case?

Could have been conjecture but I definitely read it somewhere, someone with a better memory may be able to help.

Harry's motives are shallow and one dimensional IMHO.

$$$$$$$ to keep his wife 'fulfilled' and in his distorted / traumatised / groomed mind 'safe'. He now knows he needs long term cash from another revenue stream given they have blown the exceptional opportunities with NF, Spotify etc.

I suspect MM has done the 'math' and has sent him off to reinstate their waining royal adjacency which is required to flog expensive UPFs online.

He doesnt care for his DF - he wasnt there for KC3 when his father and then his mother were fragile at end of life - he close this time to put the boot in to make $$$$$ for his toxic wife. There is no way this sitaution would have arose if he had married anyone else. I am also reflecting on the swagger of PH rocking up to the funeral of PP - when he had launched the OW interview and the racist allegations 4 weeks before PP death when he was in hospital on end of life care.

I cant read the name Meredith without thinking of the film Disclosure, Meredith played by Demi Moore, a self seeking liar, happy to throw everyone under the bus and prepared to go to any lengths to get her own way in business. Eventually backfired on her but not before destroying those in her wake.

I partly agree with @GiveMeSpanakopita in that a "reconciliation" will be a PR one, possibly not a real one.

IMO it will be more - carefully worded press releases that Harry met with his father in Balmoral/Sandringham/Highgrove (possibly) with the children. They have started to talk on a more regular basis. Meghan may be there but I'm doubtful.

Just enough for the public to be aware of a rebuilding of a relationship. KC3 may appear briefly at IG, or do a video message to the competitors. Sophie & Edward may appear.

I'm doubtful W&C will be involved.

Harry IMO will never appear on the BP balcony again, but may appear at more private family events in the way Andrew currently does.

He will never be a working Royal again.

I can't ever see a walkabout again with the brothers and their wives as we did after QEs death. But the situation was different - it was after Oprah but before NF and Spare, so the depths of the betrayals and lies hadn't been fully realised. Plus the fact that when this next situation arises - William will be King and Catherine Queen. The Crown always comes first, did Charles do a walkabout with his siblings after his mother died??

I don't know whether Meghan will attend Charles' funeral - I'd like to think she'd show him that respect - he walked her down the aisle FFS! She'd never attend William's coronation IMO - having to publicly curtsey to Catherine? I struggle to picture that.

Long rambling post to say a reconciliation may likely happen, but it could all just be very surface level and really doesn't need to involve W&C much, if at all.

Edit: spelling.