New Meghan and Harry interview

[elprup]

JAN MOIR: She gave Harry an icy stare any husband would know - watch what you're saying, mister!

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/royals/article-13707697/JAN-MOIR-Harry-icy-stare-husband-watch-saying-mister.html

🙄 birth not north!

Funnily enough Hughs it was all the shenanigans around the birth made me realise that Meghan and Harry 100% had their own agenda and it was all about themslves and controlling the narrative around them. I switched from defending them (and their “missteps”) as I had been doing up til then and started to view their conduct more critically.

Recently?

Yes set out like that you can see how grasping they were about it all. Very distasteful

Twenty odd years ago.

Googling it, it says you can still request them in 2024.

Yes, you can, but it's not generally advised for no medical reason

@llamajohn consultants , privately, will encourage C sections often IME. They like doing them, again IME. Kate Winslet’s ‘natural delivery’ for her first was a C section in fact via consultant & she said she felt she’d failed so didn’t want to admit it initially or something like that. USA Actresses etc freeze eggs & using surrogates becoming much more commonplace stateside.

M may have had a C section & we’d not know unless she told us. Although prob doesn’t fit with logistics & timings.

Meghan doesn’t take advice. My point was (rightly or wrongly, just my opinion) she doesn’t strike me as the pushing them out naturally kind.

Yet again very many tthanks, @Serenster; I was digging already but your information's a lot of help

It's also interesting that this too involved CBS, the very media which chose to broadcast the awful images of Harry's mum dying
Strange how the usual objections about "intrusion" are so easily cast aside when a personal opportunity arises, but then that's Harry and Meghan for you

The cold, planned monetisation of the birth. The RF must have seen at that point how things were going.

I always thought that the "Meghan is in labour" thing was a muddle by Buckingham Palace staff. I hadn't realised that the timing of that message coincided with the morning TV news in the USA. Thanks, Serenster, for pointing that out.

So, I assume that everything was controlled by H&M, and not by BP. That might explain the absence of the consultant's name from the official notice placed at the front of BP - presumably because H&M (for whatever reason) didn't want that to be publicised.

That is fascinating. He hates the media so much, but sold his privacy to the very same company???

If Archie was born at 5.30am, that rules out a planned c section, but Meghan having a natural birth seems very unlikely from a cultural point of view. The time line makes sense from an American news point of view.

If I'm honest, I didn't mind the non traditional announcement and not standing on the hospital steps was absolutely fine. I liked that Doria was included in the first photos, but I didn't get Charles not being there. However it's now obvious it was all a big silly game with the British press while aiming to sell their souls to the American press. I have to admit it was the first time I felt some negativity, I was pretty neutral before.

Hospital steps is not a big royal tradition.

Princess Anne was photographed leaving with one of hers (with a nurse carrying the baby)

Diana Princess of Wales posed, as did her SiL Sarah Duchess of York, as did the Duchess of Cambridge.

And that's it

Refusing to tell the press where they were, slipping out and avoiding any speculative press pack (if there were one, camping out when you know where the new mother is one thing, but covering two or more multi-entry hospitals on the off-chance is quite another) would be easy - they can say that details will be kept private.

So it would have been very easy to announce the onset of labour (even though I think its weird to have agreed to that bit) at some point during the labour, or if that were not done in time, to dump that bit of the plan. And then announce the birth.

Personal announcements, such and birth and marriages are not made without the explicit consent of the individuals concerned. The press office does what those individuals instruct. Harry fucked up the instructions (and may perhaps have been sulking if he wasn't totally happy with the advice on birth announcements), timing fuck up followed, but he seeks to blame "the palace" rather than his own inability to issue proper instructions (something that would only have a taken a word to his private secretary, so even with a brand new born, it didn't take much effort to do it right - indeed as an announcement was made I expect doing it right took the same effort as doing it badly)

Hospital steps is not a big royal tradition.

Princess Anne was photographed leaving with one of hers (with a nurse carrying the baby)

Diana Princess of Wales posed, as did her SiL Sarah Duchess of York, as did the Duchess of Cambridge.

And that's it

No, it’s not. Edward and Sophie did with both their children. And the Duchesses of Kent and Gloucester with theirs too. And Princess Michael of Kent.

All senior Royal mothers since they started giving birth in hospitals rather than at home, in fact. Not to mention the fact it’s also the norm for European Royals also. (That doesn’t mean I don’t think Meghan could make her own choice by the way, but it’s foolish to pretend that this hadn’t become the norm, expected by both he press and the public).

I didn't include the Wessexes, as the first birth was a medical emergency, Sophie and Louise were in separate ICUs for several days and the home-coming was at least a week after that. It wasn't a "just given birth" photo-opportunity.

I didn't know about Kents/Gloucesters, but have found 1 pic of each (5 births total for the two of them) so that seems to be more the Princess Anne (smile nicely if you're spotted) mode, rather than an expectation

It's fine if they didn't want to do the hospital steps, but the glamorous presentation of Archie a few days later at Windsor Castle hardly speaks of people wanting privacy, or a low key life in the early days.
That castle backdrop was specifically chosen. As were the images with the late Queen and Philip.
Compare and contrast.

I completely agree with the decision to avoid a post-partum hospital steps moment (especially now that hospital stays are usually so short)

And don't have any quibble with using a room in a palace rather than having photographers in your own home. If the grand and great grandparents want to be there, that's fine as well.

At the time I defended Meghan for not 'posing on the steps like all the others did'. I didn't want to run into fisticuffs at a coffee morning so I just muttered quietly.

The long walk in the castle was quite stagey, come to think of it. I could see one of Meghan's best guys very well but honestly couldn't see the smaller one. I think he was real, though, just very covered. I didn't see him properly until she carried him up the steps to see Desmond Tutu, several months later.

Just suppose H and M hadn't appeared at all, either on the day of the birth or a few days later. If they'd put out a picture of baby Archie very soon would that have been acceptable and what criticisms would it have attracted and avoided?

Eugenie and Beatrice release photos only. I see no problem with that at all. They aren't working royals, get no funding and a private citizens are entitled to privacy.

The problem for me with what Harry and Meghan did with Archie was that they created more attention whilst saying they wanted privacy. They want to be treated as senior royals whilst refusing to fulfil the expectations that come with public service.

I thought Catherine was really interesting when she spoke about standing on the steps with George on a podcast. They were feeling all the nervousness of new parents but she also understood that the public were full of well wishes and that part of her position was to take 2 minutes to show her baby, the future King, off.

Harry doesn't want to be a senior royal, he gets to keep everything private but he also loses the security and status that goes with the position. He wants to be a senior working royal, funded by the Queen or the Duchy of Cornwall, then the public get to see his baby. It's an unspoken contract that I think he despises and the fact that people can see he despises it is a core part of their PR problems here.

I didn't know about Kents/Gloucesters, but have found 1 pic of each (5 births total for the two of them) so that seems to be more the Princess Anne (smile nicely if you're spotted) mode, rather than an expectation

Actually, as I said above, all senior Royal mothers since they started giving birth in hospitals rather than at home have done this. The Duchess of Kent has had three children, but only her youngest was born in hospital, so there’s only one photo of her leaving with a baby. Below are photos of two of the three Gloucester children and both of Princess Michael of Kent’s children.

I was a bit perplexed by what happened. And was very confused as to why Megan put on high heels, layered on the slap and strapped herself into a frock, after all the mutterings about not wanting to appear glammed up on the hospital steps - soft cashmere cardigan and luxe yoga-style trousers with lovely soft, flat comfortable shoes would actually have been a great look. 'Look, we don't want to do the blow-dried, posh frock thing on the hospital steps, but here we are all soft and baby-snuggly - want to take a look at him?' They just looked like twats who wanted to be seen in a castle instead of a hospital.

Serenster

Actually, as I said above, all senior Royal mothers since they started giving birth in hospitals rather than at home have done this.

I noticed you said that and thought well yes, there's no reason why new traditions shouldn't evolve.
Obviously with all the disclaimers of "If the mother feels up to it" etc.

I was lucky and didn't feel too bad post-births of my DDs. I think I could have coped with standing and waving for 5 minutes (having had my hair and make-up done for me) knowing I was going to be very well looked-after when I got home.
Yes, I was lucky. No, I don't expect everyone else to have the same experience or opinion.

PigglyWigglyOhYeah

😁

Out of 18 senior royal babies born in a hospital in the UK since 1970, we have photos taken of 16 of them as they left hospital, or 89% of them. I think that counts as an expectation.

The missing ones being Alexander Gloucester, the oldest son of the Gloucesters (who was born prematurely and was not photographed until 2 months later), and Archie. Anne was photographed with both Peter and Zara by the way.