Harry’s security case

[smilesy]

The judgment is in Harry loses High Court challenge over UK security protection www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-68421992 See here

I think there is something else going on with Harry that he won’t admit to. I think Meghan won’t sign the relevant documents that will allow him to take his children to the UK unless he has the same sort of security he had when she married him. If that is the case then he will have to continue on his mission to have better security (as they see it).

Poor Harry, always the understudy never the star, the pair of them will really struggle when George, Charlotte and Louis become the media darlings, how will they cope when the world is just not interested anymore in a pair of ageing royal exiles.

<Miaow>

Why does she need to sign documents to allow him to do this? They aren’t divorced.

@EchoChamber I live in the US and I think she could prevent him from taking the children to the UK if she didn’t want him to. Anyway we have no idea whether that’s an issue or not. It could be him not wanting to bring them until he gets his way with security-which he won’t.

Would that also hold true when the kids are older, say 8 plus? I wouldn’t be happy for my dh fly off with small kids to a different country without me. There again, I wouldn’t jet off to a distant continent and leave them alone without either parent.

I find it very dismaying that Harry declined to see his father on his last visit as he wished tax payer funded security then had a statement put out lying about it and said it was as his dad was too busy to see him. That’s fucking appalling. What is wrong with him.

declinging to see his father to make a point over security , when offered accommodation at a heavily protected royal residence is ludicrous, but behaviour we expect, but to outright lie and try to make his father look bad, like he didn’t want to see him is just utterly horrible behaviour. It says everything about who he is.

the fact his kids aren’t coming to the uk I really doubt is Megan’s fault. People need to start to see Harry for who he is, how heinous the behaviour is, sure she behaves just as badly, but blaming her is absolving Harry for the nasty shit he pulls.

When Charles dies, he will be completely adrift because William will never forgive him.

How sad is that thought? But Harry's behaviour is vindictive, damaging and, at times, unhinged. If I were William I wouldn't forgive him, either.

I don't think Harry sees the contradiction between refusing to bring his family here without MET security and visiting Nigeria. It isn't logical but he doesn't approach things logically, he responds emotionally. The sad thing is that you cannot convince someone of something if they won't believe facts and only focus on how they feel. There is nothing anyone can do to get through to Harry because he goes by what he feels and his feelings are his facts. One would hope that therapy would help him with this but it doesn't seem to have so far.

I think Harry is entrenched in his issues over security , he’s still making a point over it, he’s still at war with the home office. He’s now refusing to visit his father unless he gets security, he’s basically blackmailing him, same as why he won’t bring the kids over. Or Megan. He’s emotionally blackmailing him to get what he wants.

he will stay in a public hotel with just his own security before staying in a royal residence, and then go to Nigeria , of all places, just to make a point and continue his emotional blackmailing of his father, saying basically I won’t see you unless you give me what I want, tax payer funded security.

And he’s stepped it up, telling the world his father didn’t make time to see him when he knew it was a complete and utter lie. His father did make time to see him, even offered him residence, and harry bare faced and proactively lied as he didn’t wish to admit he was refusing to see his father as he wanted security when staying at a palace.

Yes, it’s really really toxic . Poor Charles. He also tried to blackmail Charles over Frogmore too. ‘Don’t you want to see your grandchildren?’ In other words if you take away this house which sits empty all year apart from a few days, you won’t see your grandchildren. Both he and Meghan have a toxic dynamic with their fathers.

Therapy seems to have made him a lot worse. I have someone like this in my family. MH issues, full of bitterness and bile. Poor me syndrome. Therapy has made it far worse for some reason.

Yes, I think William is entirely justified. Harry is a total loose canon and no one knows when the gun will next be fired or who it will hit. Best to stay behind the wall.

But it's not within Charles' remit to grant him security. It's down to Ravec. I'm not sure if Harry really understands that. He can't blackmail Charles into giving him security as it is out of Charles' control.

The Queen asked Ravec to consider giving Harry the security he wanted. Ravec said no and the Queen accepted this. Harry can't.

The Queen should never have asked that. Hiw did she think it was even remotely justified?

This is smoke and mirrors, if Charles said do it, they’d do it, and Harry knows that, and if the queen had said do it, they’d have done it. The queen asked them to consider it, as in it’s your decision, you consider it and then you decide, I’m not getting involved.

asking someone to consider it, is asking them to out it on the table and decide, it is not asking them to do it.

edit, the better word would be review it. The queen asked them to review it.

She didn’t, I think there is some confusion on semantics here. The queen didn’t ask them to give Harry security, if she had, he’d have had security, simply Harry wanted it, she said fuck all to do with me, it’s a ravec decision, I’m not getting involved, ravec, go review it and whatever you decide I’m good with,

I guess she was a very old lady trying to keep her family together. I don't think there was anything wrong in her asking. She accepted the decision and didn't contest it.

It just goes to show how Charles cannot influence or change the security issue for Harry. So Harry flouncing and refusing the Royal accommodation just seems more and more ridiculous.

Behind a paywall but details here;

www.telegraph.co.uk/royal-family/2023/12/08/keeping-sussexes-safe-paramount-importance-late-queen-aide/

I do wonder how much of Harry’s paranoia is fuelled by Meghan to serve her own purposes. I don’t believe she wants the children to go to the UK or have any contact with Harry’s family. It serves her purposes to keep him in a lather of outrage and fear about their safety because that way she doesn’t have to deal with the RF.

It also is how a narcissist operates- keep the other party on the hop, make them feel insecure because you want to be their all.

Pretty supportive of Harry getting his security I'd say, but the answer was still No.

It's not down to the Queen or Charles who gets security.

Very supportive. But rightly mindful of where the decision actually lies.

This is smoke and mirrors, if Charles said do it, they’d do it, and Harry knows that, and if the queen had said do it, they’d have done it.

This is actually a clear example of QEII (and presumably Charles as well) understanding the role they occupy in a constitutional monarchy: they don’t get to make demands on matters that are managed by the Government. They can express their views, as the Queen did, but also recognise the decisions are for others to take.

The Queen was not in a position to overrule RAVEC, nor should she or any monarch be. She wrote a letter expressing her desire for Harry to have security but recognising the independence of the process. Which is what she clearly did as RAVEC didn’t change their minds. As pp have said, she was able to understand that no means no. I’m sure Harry wanted her to try and exert influence and as his grandmother, that is what she did. But she was unable to and accepted that.

eta it is also possible that the letter was written to get a clear response from RAVEC about how they decide security to try to show Harry exactly why he wasn’t going to receive it all the time. Obviously he didn’t want to hear that

Maybe I am misreading something but does the article not claim that Harry wouldn’t have security if he left the royal residence ? So although the place itself ( eg St James) would be guarded , if he went out and about - probably with Netflix- he wouldn’t have the security ? The statement talks about entrances in public view .
Whatever the reason , there was no need to issue the “ Pa’s too busy “ statement.