Endgame Part 6

[Mymilkshakebringsallthepapstomycar]

A turkey, absolute balls of stuffing or a right Christmas cracker? We'll let you decide. Please keep the discussion interesting, civilised and relevant - the Holiday Armadillo is lurking!

Previous thread:

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/the_royal_family/4960903-omid-scobie-endgame-part-5?page=1

Like the 'QE2 did her Xmas message with a photo of William and George in the background, but no photo of H&M' - she is snubbing them! The whole RF is racist!

Whereas none of the other grandchildren (or great grand children) were there, it was about the line of succession not her personal feelings. And probably never occurred to her, or her advisers, that any of the other grandchildren were relevant in that context - although probably much loved in a personal capacity.

I think it's a shame that they're so quick to take offence. No context, no nuance, no understanding.

If rumour is believed, isn’t this to do with Harry wanting /expecting to be treated exactly the same as William? We know Diana insisted on it and she told Jeremy Paxman Harry would be happy to be king when William said he didn’t want the throne. This is of course children speaking.

He was brought up as part of an hereditary monarchy. It's very strange that he hadn't worked out what that meant, well into adulthood.

In an interview in 2017 Harry said no one wanted to be monarch but they would do their duty. So he knows perfectly well it’s a rubbish job to have and there’s not much to envy.

Well yes, I agree. However, we have daily proof of thread after thread of people, who have difficult relations / friends / neighbours etc.

Idk how much of his behaviour is linked to trauma and how much is his upbringing. Not trying to excuse the behaviour as he is a grown man now.

He's had the time, the opportunity and the financial ability to get excellent help and process all of this. I'm not saying it's easy, but you have to want to move on, though.

I agree @Maireas he has spent a large chunk of his married life running to and from court , doing tv interviews and similar instead of just living and enjoying life and his family. Cue certain posters with "how do you know he isn't" but really he rarely looks happy. Every week is drama week with him in some way. He must be a real PITA to live with.

I agree he’s had everything he needs at his finger tips. He’s either chosen yes wo/men or refused to engage to reach a point of healing. Therapy is hard work and you have to want to go through the process.

William experienced the same trauma Harry did. He has had a lot more pressure on him too . As heir he can’t afford to put a foot wrong and the spotlight has been on him all his life. Yet William shows loyalty to his family and keeps his mouth shut. He doesn’t bleat on and on about his suffering and how hard done by he is. I’m sure he has many dark nights of the soul but doesn’t feel the need to write books and give interviews for money all about his perceived grievances.

I think a result of his upbringing he has no idea of how privileged he really is as a result of being a member of the RF. They don't want to be Monarch, so dont. It will make little difference. What he means is that they don't even want to do the bare minimum they have to to keep the whole show on the road but do it in order to keep themselves even vaguely relevant. They are Constitutional Monarchs. Their official 'duty'to the country is to rubber stamp what the government tells them to do. Nothing they do, say or think is of any consequence. The King could take his red boxes and tip them into the fire every night. It would make no difference. The government could gain a ginormous majority and decide they want a 50 year term and the Monarch could do nothing about it. They do some charity stuff and show up at stuff. Like many celebrities do in their spare time. Even if they were aristocrats, they would have to do some kind of bill paying to pay for their roof repairs, etc. Their children may even have to get jobs. None of this applies to the Monarch or their children.

I agree, @Chouxpastryishard . The difference is that William is a very private person, and chooses not to publicly share his struggles in this respect. This makes the fraternal betrayal in "Spare" (et al) all the more dreadful. Tell your own story, but don't be so invasive of others' privacy.

That is right @Maireas and there is another thread about Harry v Andrew interviews. Andrew was talking about himself - whereas Harry and Meghan it is all slagging other people off.

Angrycat - I agree with a lot of that. And it must be soul destroying to have the sense of duty hammered into you that you can’t be the one to drop the ball. The one who ends it all. Charles and Camilla won’t say sod this for a game of soldiers, and retreat to the country to garden and walk their dogs like every other rich aristocrat. Nor will William, I don’t think. The Duke of Windsor isn’t a good example for them to follow in their eyes.

So the red box doesn’t go in the fire, the PM is met each week (this seems to have been valuable to PMs who met with QE2 because of her decades and decades of doing it), they do bring attention to good causes, wealthy people cough up to be at a charity event with them, they highlight things that people ask them to highlight and try to do what they can in what is a ceremonial job. What I don’t want from them is whingeing. And they oblige me in that thankfully. I want them doing their bit as a search and rescue pilot or something in the forces then when they can’t do that any more, I want them trudging round the country doing 10% glamour with glittering gold evening dresses and 90% visiting local farmers’ shows and meeting nurses and visiting food banks to encourage donations or mills and learning about and highlighting the work done by different regiments and thanking the people who do the grunt work because for whatever reason, those people do quite like meeting them and find it interesting.

Harry has withdrawn his libel case against the Mail on Sunday over security and may have to pay the Mail's costs

(sorry for DM link)
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12983337/Prince-Harry-withdraws-libel-case-against-Mail-Sunday-security-row.html

I agree @DuchessOfPort .

It is glaring that Harry can't find anything positive to say about his incredibly privileged life to balance against the parts he found (understandably) intrusive.

Would he have been accepted into Sandhurst (and an elite regiment at that!) if he wasn't the Queen's grandson? How many people are in a position to develop a taste for polo? Or go on long visits to Africa (country always unspecified, which is one of my pet annoyances, as if the whole of Africa is still the playground of wealthy Europeans!)?

Sadly, thousands of children around the world have to deal with the death of a parent (one of DD's friends parents has just died from cancer 😥). All too many have to deal with the financial impact on top of the emotional impact, as they are living in, or on the brink, of real poverty.

Very few have access to any help in dealing with that - but we know Harry has access to therapy, because he has said so himself.

I think having too much money is a curse (although preferable to having nothing) - having to make a living, having to deal with reality, having to get up in the morning when you would rather hide under the duvet, is in many cases helpful. It gives a routine, structure, makes you interact with other people and get out of your comfort zone a little. Avoiding discomfort doesn't help in the long run.

I say that as someone with personal experience. I am not saying 'just get over it'. But that learning to live with trauma is about creating a daily routine that gets you through the crises, bit by bit. There is no magical answer, but there is a lot you can do to help yourself. And I am glad I had enough money for emergencies, but not so much I could insulate myself from the helpful (but uncomfortable) aspects of daily life.

So, if I understand it, basically admitting that his offer to pay for the Met security on demand (as opposed to when there is a need based on risk assessment), was following the negative publicity around his demand?

That will a hefty bill !

I don’t think these legal cases are about “winning” for Harry. You’ll notice every time there is something critical about Harry in a newspaper, someone will pop up to say “what source? Oh the same <whatever newspaper it is> that Harry is suing?” That’s the whole point, Harry is trying to create a conflict of interest with every single outlet so that his fanclub has an excuse to ignore every bit of criticism.

For most people I think being notoriously litigious has had the opposite effect - you can reasonably assume every article about them over the past 24 months has been lawyered to death. My friend works for a national newspaper & she said what gets past the lawyers and to publication is just the tip of the iceberg - I guess they’ve both left lots of people in the dust with axes to grind!

I have read in several places that H&M are hoping to be taken back into the rf fold.

I must admit I can’t bear the Prodigal Son story - so unfair! - but it appears to be the case that King Charles is a father first and foremost and, believe me, I know what it’s like when a parent will forgive their child anything , no matter how badly it impacts their other children.

I don't think it goes as far as an admission of that. Rather that he accepts that he has no prospect of winning against their stance that it was a fair comment. It doesn't mean he agrees with it, or even that it's objectively true. Just that it was a fair comment based on what was known at the time (other fair comments are also available)

Fair enough! A resonable person might form the opinion that his offer to pay was in response to the negative publicity, given the timing.?

He’d never admit it, but the evidence shows this is effectively what it is. I posted the below exert from the fail on another thread, he tried to bully and threaten but it does appear he lied and tried to mislead the public and the mail on Sunday was correct. There is obviously no evidence he offered to pay, only evidence that he made it clear he wouldn’t pay. And this from a man worth 30 million when he left.

At a preliminary hearing, in March last year, the newspaper's KC showed the court an extract from an email in which Harry – far from offering to pay for his security – argued he needed a job first, writing 'we couldn't afford private security until we were able to earn

Also would add that Elton John, who he seems to emulate, is probably the most litigious celeb there is, he has a legal team and takes immediate and harsh action against anything false against him and gives all “profit” to charity,

the difference is, Elton doesn’t sue when it’s true. He’s sought an injunction before over his husbands activities, but he doesn’t sue unless it’s not true.

harry legally threatens and takes action if he doesn’t like the fact someone told the truth about him.

I suspect his definition of a 'job' isn't the same as most of us - more like ' a source of large amounts of money without the need for effort or expertise'!

I would love a job along those lines!