RAVEC - Prince Harry

[pilates]

Can someone explain to me the procedure and how this works?

But anyone who thinks racism and misogyny doesn’t lead to violence is “batshit”
in my view.

Racism and misogyny sometimes lead to violence. Not always. Hence the need to assess the threat level.

Yes, I completely agree they do. As experienced by thousands of people in the UK on a daily basis.

That doesn't mean it increases the risk to Harry or Meghan, in their very protected world. I would guess they are more at risk from political extremists (as high profile targets who are part of the RF and Establishment) than people with a racist/misogynist grudge.

Let's face it, the major threat to the RF for years was the IRA - nothing to do with racism or misogyny, and yet the UK had a female head of state. Where were all the violent, activist misogynists?

And before we get to the 'proved plans to attack Maghan because she is mixed race' - delusional individuals with no credible plan. Who were - rightly - prosecuted because of their intent, not because of any realistic chance they would either act or succeed.

I think it does. Because once you allow that level of vitriol to be published and broadcast in every day newspapers and magazine programmes aimed at the general public, then it becomes normalised.

People don’t remember the outrage afterwards and that Morgan was sacked and Clarkson was made to apologise. Mainly because these two hideous men are still popping up in the media and making a nice living thank you.

What people remember are the words.

And once something is normalised, and spread globally, that language and attitude is given tacit permission to flourish.

And what is the next level up from Clarkson’s piece? It’s not that far a leap to physical violence imho.

But hang on. We are now going around in circles.
we can accept:

• media is racist
• Murdoch has it in for Harry and Meghan
• they have faced a great deal of vitriol
• as the Met Police themselves have said there have been threats to theke life.

And still think that Harry’s case has no value???

Two things can be true. Like my kid is sick today AND he’s being a total pain. Both are true.

It’s like how I love Suits, really enjoyed the Harry and Meghan wedding, think she’s very pretty and has had a raw deal from a racist press and still think their documentary was duller than dull and that they are entitled whingers who want all the status and wealth and titles of the RF but won’t call out the deep rooted political problems of having a monarchy like this because they enjoy the perks of it.

Of course things said by media personalities can be seized upon by extremists and used as an excuse for violence. But that is not what we are talking about. We are talking about judgements about security being made in the presence of current and credible actual threats. Not what could possibly maybe happen due to the hot air spouting from some pompous arseholes. Misogyny and racism should never be condoned but as was said previously they do not in themselves constitute a threat that the security services can act upon.

I don’t think anyone is denying that there are credible threats to their lives (or the lives of the many heads of state the UK security apparatus looks after). Harry thinks that in HIS case and his unique case they lack the willpower, resources and the necessary know how to protect him.

Not the Obamas or Macron or Modi or Trudeau. Just him and his family.

I’m not sure Parksandrecs . People who identify with the establishment are more likely to behave within the rules I think.

And doesn’t the racism and misogyny play in to all the extreme right wing nutter-hood?

There are the random malevolent disturbed people like the murderer of poor Jo Cox who believed in a deluded way that they were defending the establishment from Remainers and refugees I suppose.

Then there are all the Incel types who oppose everything Meghan stands for.

As I say, I hope I am wrong.

Of course Morgan and Clarkson are not a direct threat themselves to M&H. They are two older men who revel in stirring up hate though. And what they do normalises revolting language.
Which can lead to other things.

Yes like this:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-63804711.amp

Where the Met Police assessed and neutralised those threats. They did their job. Which somehow Harry thinks they are now incapable of doing because they live in California.

Yes, there are random, malevolent threats. Yet I think the major threats to most public figures e.g. QE2 weren't random misogynists, but people organised around a political ideology.

Just as the major threats to Sunak are not racists, but people organised around a political ideology.

Is Harry actually saying that? I don’t believe he is.

My understanding is that he is querying the decision making processes at the highest levels.

Ok so Harry’s not criticising the rationale, resources and intelligence behind these decisions but he is criticising how they are made????

…….

He is very much criticising all of those things. Didn't he say that decisions made on some of his visits were 'irrational'? Because he is the font of all reason.

And we're still waiting to be told what's wrong with that

Yes, Harry claims he feels unsafe, but multimillion services aren't provided just because someone "feels" something; there has to be a reason, and their record on security shows this is best left to the professionals

Is anyone including Harry saying that PC influenced RAVEC’s decision and would be willing to let himself and his wife come to harm?

Well nobody's actually said it yet, even though it's being heavily implied

Let's say, though, that Charles called the Home Office insisting they hung Harry out to dry, that they listened and that something happened to Harry.
As with the conspiracy theories about the RF offing Diana, anyone care to imagine how that would look if it came out?

He may be able to control his own lackeys and have his own info sealed, but all it would take is one official going rogue and the result can only be imagined

What's your evidence that racist concerns aren't given enough weight?

And yet it appears that if any influence was brought to bear it was in favour of Harry having security...

So Harry is protected. Rightly so.
According to assessed need.
Not what he decides.

What's your evidence that racist concerns aren't given enough weight?

Would probably be good if you shared this evidence with Rishi Sunak also, if the security services are not giving enough weight to racist threats.

Yes, given RAVEC are also have oversight of his security, I think you should get in touch to let him know that the racist white men are underplaying the risks, because they don't value his life sufficiently.

Then there are all the Incel types who oppose everything Meghan stands for.

But threats from those sort of people could be directed to any woman. You just seem to be applying any sort of hypothetical situation to the Sussexes. Which is why security is allocated when there is a credible and current threat. Not some hypothetical possibility. As pp have said many times, what is wrong with the arrangement that the Sussexes be given appropriate security as and when they visit, which is what is happening at the moment?

I think women, everyday ordinary women, are at risk of violence because of misogyny.

I think people of colour, everyday ordinary people of colour, are at risk of violence because of racism.

Let's face it prejudice and violence are expressed most in intimate and everyday relationships. I wish there was more funding for the police (and other agencies) to intervene and keep victims safe.

The threat to Harry and Meghan? Hmmm, less convincing.

It's a bit rum to argue that racism inevitably leads to violence on a thread about Harry, who used racist slurs but as far as I know never resorted to violence.