What next for the Sussexes?

[Casuaala]

I thought yesterday couldn't have gone better, all things considered; there was the least amount of drama or negative coverage possible regarding the Sussexes.

I'd like to hope that this marks a fresh start. Harry's got all the recriminations off his chest. The Royal Family have maintained a dignified silence and hopefully the future is rosy. The Sussexes can have the life they want in the US, with a small presence in family events back here when appropriate. (I wouldn't be surprised however if Megan never makes it back on UK soil).

Harry was very clear that they are not the same thing.

I suppose it's the difference between intentional and unintentional bias that he was emphasising.

IMO many of the threads become about racism because some posts are racist or contain thinly disguised racism.

Look at the goading of @Whaeanui on this thread and the support the goader got. She remained dignified in her response despite provocation. MN removed the original comment. Many of the racist comments are removed quickly so what we read does not always give the full picture. Reading the comment '@Whaeanui defines racism as anyone not agreeing with me' is such an offensive post and is indicative of a number of posters, some who have stated they are white, trying to dictate what people of colour should or should not find racist or offensive.

As I stated earlier there are many threads where Harry is castigated but so many more about Meghan. Why is that? The language used when talking about Meghan, the barely disguised hatred, presumably coming from women talking about another woman is horrible and deeply uncomfortable. Analysing everything she does or doesn't do even though she is thousands of miles away. Why? We can draw our own conclusions as so many others do on here.

What Meghan described was not unintentional bias though, it was blatant racism.

I am with Meghan on this as I feel that white people do not have the right to tell POC that what they experience as racism is not.

What's not clear is whether Harry is saying what Meghan described did happen but it's not racism it's unconscious bias (denying a POC's experience of racism), or what Meghan described didn't happen (essentially calling her a liar). Either way it makes me uncomfortable.

As I stated earlier there are many threads where Harry is castigated but so many more about Meghan. Why is that? The language used when talking about Meghan, the barely disguised hatred, presumably coming from women talking about another woman is horrible and deeply uncomfortable. Analysing everything she does or doesn't do even though she is thousands of miles away. Why? We can draw our own conclusions as so many others do on here.

I agree. And I think a lot (not all) of the criticism of Harry is by default, criticism of Meghan. After all, everything Meghan does is criticised, so it stands to reason that would include her husband. I have even seen charities she supports endlessly criticised. How horrible is that?

To actually have 44 bile filled rants about her in a mainstream newspaper in 24 hours, must tell us something... surely?
(p.s. this is fact, can link headlines should anyone dispute this)

I agree it was racist, and I think Harry is minimising to try and smooth things over with his family. It’s reported that Prince Charles apparently said the comment was ‘without malice’ which implies that it did happen. It’s still sounds like racism, however it’s described.

I agree it was racist, and I think Harry is minimising to try and smooth things over with his family.

You might be right. I wonder how it feels to be a POC experiencing that and have your white husband go on TV and minimise it.

MN would say she doesn't have an IL problem, she has a DH problem!

How would (Meghan lying/embellishing) that put back racial equality

Because as I said yesterday, some choose to take one person's lies and extend it to the rest, as in "See! You just can't trust a word they say!"

It isn't right and it isn't true, but sadly it stirs the pot and instead of focusing on the horrors of real racism everyone falls on everyone else over trivia, distracting from the bigger picture

Fortunately noone disputes that Meghan has suffered true racism - it's there in black and white and it's hideous - so it seems a shame that she doesn't just refer to what's actually happened rather than blowing her credibility on untruths

Thanks very much for the support and for calling out that some posters here agreed with the racist comment that’s now deleted, attempting to goad and get a reaction. It’s not pleasant for a woman of colour on this board sometimes and to have white people constantly mock our discussions of racism and dismiss it as ‘people not agreeing with me’ is just plain wrong. Clearly as it’s now gone. When the pile on is happening I always think of a scene that happened to my mother with white women goading her on the street and poking their tongues out mocking Maori culture, while my mum had to do and say nothing for fear of being arrested ( we were in a land March in nz ). I hope some people here take a pause and actually remember they are talking to real people and victims of racism who come to discussions with a lot of history of oppression and cruelty.

I do understand why you ask that question. I just wonder what you think of the person who said it and the rest of the royal family’s minimisation of it? It seems Harry is under more scrutiny than the person who said it, and the Queen who minimised it.

It isn't right and it isn't true, but sadly it stirs the pot and instead of focusing on the horrors of real racism everyone falls on everyone else over trivia, distracting from the bigger picture

So you know it’s wrong to do that to her or any other POC, blame them for racism. So maybe we can just stop it here too? The people who are racist are responsible for their racism. People of colour shouldn’t be held to impossible standards or higher standards than white people are nor held responsible for not dealing with racism in a perfect way. There is no perfect way.

I do understand why you ask that question. I just wonder what you think of the person who said it and the rest of the royal family’s minimisation of it? It seems Harry is under more scrutiny than the person who said it, and the Queen who minimised it.

I think racists are despicable and Meghan was quite right to call it out.

There is also something very nasty about a white man (with a history of racism himself) going on tv and minimising his wife's experience of racism on the part of his family. There would be a lot of LTBs on here if that was ever in an OP.

So you know it’s wrong to do that to her or any other POC, blame them for racism. So maybe we can just stop it here too?

Works for me, Whaeanui, but then I've never blamed Meghan for the actual racism she's suffered - only for accounts which are less than credible

It’s a bit ridiculous to declare “it was racist” or “it wasn’t racist” when we have absolutely no idea what was actually said, especially when Harry and Meghan’s own statements contradict each other’s

Yes it was said once, it was said a few times. It was said when they met, it was said when she was pregnant. They need to get their stories straight really before going on chatshows.

I see people of colour have mostly taken it as either racist or unconscious bias but few who thinks there’s no issue at all. I have been in that position, and with my in laws and my fathers family too so to me, in that position, it was racist. I have some light siblings who had that happen more often and it was used to dismiss their Maori ancestry.
Unconscious bias is to me when the intention isn’t there to be racist, but what is said still is.

There is also something very nasty about a white man (with a history of racism himself) going on tv and minimising his wife's experience of racism on the part of his family. There would be a lot of LTBs on here if that was ever in an OP

It's a fair point, So Tedious, though it might have helped if Harry, too, could get his stories straight and resist ridiculous remarks about his curated memories being the same as objective facts

Curiously, despite his own racism, Harry seems to get a free pass for no better reason than marrying a woman of colour, and I'm afraid it doesn't work that way for me

I see people of colour have mostly taken it as either racist or unconscious bias but few who thinks there’s no issue at all.

But taken what exactly as racist?? No-one has any idea what was said or who even said it? It’s impossible to form an opinion about it either way.

@Whaeanui

You seem to be projecting your experiences with your own in-laws onto this situation.

I’m sorry this happened to you.

Here we go again. Course you’re not sorry. I’m not projecting, I’m sharing my lived experience over the exact same thing happening to me. Quite often POC have shared experiences you know, and they are relevant here. We are in the middle of discussing if this was a racist incident so my experience is valid here thank you.

What was said was there were concerns expressed over what the skin colour of their child might be. What is important is that she felt othered by it. Clearly or they wouldn’t raise it.

Curiously, despite his own racism, Harry seems to get a free pass for no better reason than marrying a woman of colour, and I'm afraid it doesn't work that way for me

Not by me. I’m open to forgiveness if someone apologies admits and changes their behaviour. If we didn’t have room for that we would always be divided.

I’m open to forgiveness if someone apologies admits and changes their behaviour.

He hasn't changed his behaviour though has he - he might have learned which words not to say out loud, but he's going on telly and minimising his wife's experience of racist treatment by his family. Surely everyone can agree to be furious about that?