First visit of royal tour cancelled because of local protest

[Viviennemary]

Just seen on sky news William and Kates visit to a farm in the Caribbean was cancelled becsuse of a local protest. I am with these locals. From their point of view why should those two very entitled unelected multi millionaires who have virtually nothing to do with their country be visiting and expecting to be honoured and bowed and scraped to. They are no better or important than anybody else.

*@JaniieJones this brings up one of the issues that I find odd about this whole debate. Does anyone really think that the Queen is sitting in Windsor Castle furiously plotting how she can retain power over the various nations still associated with the UK? *

Its the royal biographers and reporters who keep telling us how the queen's beloved CW means to her and she wants to retain it. The CW is really the Empire, with a different name. I assume she did not want to drop the ball during her reign and honour her ancestors.

Keeping the CW on side, with nothing I may add, also stops people questioning too much the issue of reparations. Right up till about 7yrs ago we were still footing the 'reparations' bill to the slave owners. It took so long because it was about £20M back then, a figure that is estimated at billions currently. We never paid the slaves themselves.

Someone said there must be a referendum. There was none in Barbados. And considering that the people did not vote to have the queen as their head, why should there be a referendum.

The CW membership has just stayed there in the the background as some harmless, if not that useful club. One of the main advantages of membership to any club is access, which is not given anyways, unlike the EU, where you don't need a visa to travel within the club.
Nowadays, it's being revisited that this club is not doing much, and it's leaders seem a bit racist too.

The CW is really the Empire, with a different name

Absolute twaddle. Insulting it its members, too.

Someone said there must be a referendum. There was none in Barbados. And considering that the people did not vote to have the queen as their head, why should there be a referendum

You do realise that not all countries have the same constitution, don’t you…?

they are also carbon offset). Whatever the hell that means

@Serenster

The CW is really the Empire, with a different name

Absolute twaddle. Insulting it its members, too.

It's the members themselves who have called it that.

@Serenster

Someone said there must be a referendum. There was none in Barbados. And considering that the people did not vote to have the queen as their head, why should there be a referendum

You do realise that not all countries have the same constitution, don’t you…?

Jamaica has not said anything about a referendum.

The CW membership has just stayed there in the the background as some harmless, if not that useful club. One of the main advantages of membership to any club is access, which is not given anyways, unlike the EU, where you don't need a visa to travel within the club.
Nowadays, it's being revisited that this club is not doing much, and it's leaders seem a bit racist too

Funnily enough I was watching a discussion on the news earlier this week where a Foreign Affairs Expert was saying that there had been some debate about Ukraine joining the Commonwealth, as membership is voluntary and open to all (there are members with no history of British involvement) and given the organisation is “absolutely thriving at the moment” - their exact words. They considered it would be a good, if quirky, way for the international community to send a message that Ukraine remains in international good standing, when they clearly can’t join NATO and the EU membership they have sought would take a very long time to implement.

Perhaps you need to track the expert down and let them know you know better?

It's the members themselves who have called it that

Where? It’s a voluntary organisation. If they don’t like it, they can leave.

It's the members themselves who have called it that.

So why remain then?

The door is wide open. They can leave the CW any time they want. Nobody is stopping them.

The fact is that very few countries have chosen to leave the CW, and a few with no link to the British empire have chosen to join. Clearly these countries feel there are advantages to being in the CW.

As had been stated on here, the government has to decided that. So it depends on who is sitting as the leader there. (and as people have said, it depends if some of these leaders themselves have something to gain with remaining on the queen's pocket).

@notanotheroneagain

As had been stated on here, the government has to decided that. So it depends on who is sitting as the leader there. (and as people have said, it depends if some of these leaders themselves have something to gain with remaining on the queen's pocket).

Not sure what 'remaining on the queen's pocket 'means, but the CW has existed for nearly a century. Leaders come and go. In many cases they are democratically elected so if there was real pressure from the people to leave the CW it would happen.

But the fact remains that very few countries have chosen to do so.

As I said, they have been by and large a harmless, useless membership, that has sat in the background. No one had any particular strong feelings about it. Daily, it's not even in people's minds.

Some of the leaders get titles from the queen, nothing new there, we have the same in this country, where some leaders benefit or get status in this way. So those individuals, will not disturb the apple cart.

The public however, if they get reminded of the racism, lack of reparations etc. they will not be happy.

@notanotheroneagain

As I said, they have been by and large a harmless, useless membership, that has sat in the background. No one had any particular strong feelings about it. Daily, it's not even in people's minds.

Some of the leaders get titles from the queen, nothing new there, we have the same in this country, where some leaders benefit or get status in this way. So those individuals, will not disturb the apple cart.

The public however, if they get reminded of the racism, lack of reparations etc. they will not be happy.

And yet mostly they seem happy enough.

Hardly any of them have chosen to leave, and several have chosen to join. Even those countries which removed the queen as head of state opted to remain in the CW. Those are the facts, however much they go against your agenda.

As I said, they have been by and large a harmless, useless membership, that has sat in the background. No one had any particular strong feelings about it. Daily, it's not even in people's minds

I’m not sure why you expect the people of a country to have a particularly informed view about an international organisation that largely operates at a government to government level? I don’t find it at all surprising though that some of the smallest countries in the developing world find it advantageous to have an equal seat at the table with some of the richest and most populous countries in the world, plus two of the G7 members.

I didn't realise it had become about aircraft emissions, notanotheroneagain - though I agree it's an issue - but next time I fancy something the government own I really must try telling them it's the equivalent to it being private

Not sure where you got "a boeing (which usually has around 600-800 passengers)" from? It's true the 747-8 can carry about 700, but most are very far from being that size

I'm with you on much about the Commonwealth though. Certainly it's not the same as the empire, which ended with HM's parents, but I've always believed that, for the Queen, it's largely a toybox which allows her to play at still being an empress bestriding the globe.
In many ways I find it a shame that plenty still want to belong, but of course that's a decision for them, and one they may continue to make while the money/influence is still available

In many ways I find it a shame that plenty still want to belong, but of course that's a decision for them, and one they may continue to make while the money/influence is still available

Some of the projects that are being taken forward by the Commonwealth is to develop charters on environmental issues that particularly affect its members.

The Maldives and Kiribati are for example leading the work on developing a sustainable fishing charter that, when implemented, will impact a third of the world’s national waters. Australia, Belize and Mauritius are leading on coral reef protection and restoration (hence why William and Kate were diving in Belize’s reef this week). There is no other forum that would provide countries of this size with the ability to have such an involvement on an issue which impacts them so directly.

There is no other forum that would provide countries of this size with the ability to have such an involvement on an issue which impacts them so directly.

Are you somehow under the impression that other small countries do not have access to those resources because they don't belong to the CW?

I’m not sure why you expect the people of a country to have a particularly informed view about an international organisation that largely operates at a government to government level?

As I have said, people just want to know what are the advantages either on a day to day or low level basis. I made the example that EU membership means freedom of movement - a basic requirement, that we do not provide.

Are you somehow under the impression that other small countries do not have access to those resources because they don't belong to the CW?

No, not at all; but equally, I'm pretty sure it can be handy to have a monarch onside as your Head of State - especially one who appears to care deeply about the organisation and has form for putting an oar in when something matters to her personally

What you need is a good leader. A good president/government etc. who will be here with you, not miles across the sea, and they can put in an oar when something matters to you, not just them personally. But one who will also not be hands off, because that is 'political' when it means the most to you.

Notanotherone you are very welcome to come up with some examples where they do have that direct impact and influence,.

The Commonwealth Fisheries charter - as I said, that will affect 1/3 of the world’s national waters. That’s a big sphere of influence for two small island nations to be working with. They have access to a budget, a secretariat and a formal charter to undertake their work.

Other intergovernmental organisations that these small island nations can belong to do exist of course, but they are lobbying groups, which aim to amplify the voice of their members, and influence UN policy. They aren’t funded, and have no mandate to change behaviours - they just have to try and convince the various climate conferences to adopt their proposals.

@notanotheroneagain

What you need is a good leader. A good president/government etc. who will be here with you, not miles across the sea, and they can put in an oar when something matters to you, not just them personally. But one who will also not be hands off, because that is 'political' when it means the most to you.

And these countries all have that in their political system, with a Prime Minister, who is there with their government locally. The Queen is merely the symbolic Head of State in various countries, with no political power at all.

And in those outside of the UK, she is represented on a day to day basis by a Governor General, who performs the ceremonial role that the Queen and her family performs in the UK (hosting foreign visitors, bestowing honours on citizens, etc etc). They are normally selected from those who have a long career in public service in their repressive counties.

You don't even need to know the stats, you can see looking at the beast that it's gas guzzling and emissions.

Seriously?

“Repressive countries” - excellent autocorrect there :D :D

(Should have been respective countries!)

There has to be over 400 international environmental organisations, which have an impact.

The likes of UNEP, IPCC, IUCN, GEF etc. have been directly helping small countries which are not in the CW for ages.

@smilesy

You don't even need to know the stats, you can see looking at the beast that it's gas guzzling and emissions.

Seriously?

Except, I did in fact give the stats !