Harry and Meghan (15)

[Froq]

No harm in having it ready for the next event/announcement...

Do you genuinely believe that a helicopter containing a member of the royal family was used as a decoy for missiles?

It seems unlikely I must admit. I imagine there are a few people around who think it might not have been the worst idea...

i bet M weighed it well CoolCarrie. she would get the title of Duchess even if she got divorced.

I just clicked on the link of Charlotte sticking her tongue out and then having a tantrum and I just thought that Kate is a lovely mum.

I think a side effect of this whole 'being in the RF is so difficult' thing is that Kate will have gone up in a lot of peoples estimation. I have only ever thought of their privilege before, if I thought of them at all.

@katiegoestoaldi well why not ignore it ?

Oh I don't know Lalala205 - look at the eldest Trump boys. However, they obvs think they have met the standard of "being good at something." I despair.

As I said on a much earlier thread, this Anglo Yank can't remember anything but delight at the engagement interview with H&M - the anti- Kushners, as it were. Shame things got to where they are now. IMO. I hope there's a way back for them.

Peridito the same could be said for Rocking and other critics of this thread so I'm not sure what your point is

Stop it Rocking, now I may have to start liking you

I think I'll set them up with a nice apprenticeship first...

I would absolutely cheer to see some of the Royals given 'proper' everyday work experience (including, but not limited to, the Sussexes). A stint in Tesco or a call centre would give a good sense of perspective.

Shame things got to where they are now. IMO. I hope there's a way back for them.

I do too. On a personal level I wish them a happy life. On a "business" level I'm not so sure.

Fundamental to the issues between H&M and the RF is their refusal to do things through the machinery of the Palace, and instead go off on their own. Every time they do this it ends in disaster for them.

I don't think either of them are comfortable with authority. That's not a failing as such, many of the most successful businessmen and entrepreneurs have that characteristic so it has its benefits. But it's a dealbreaker when you are a royal.

Harry, despite his rebellious nature, does hold a profound respect for the military hierarchy and HMQ as Commander in Chief. Meghan doesn't share that with him.

That's why I think ultimately their marriage is doomed. Because he is fighting against something deeply ingrained in his core and in the end his love for M won't be enough.

That's why I think ultimately their marriage is doomed. Because he is fighting against something deeply ingrained in his core and in the end his love for M won't be enough.

fleas that's so sad, but I think you're probably right. Its very hard to go against everything you've always been brought up to believe is right. Think of how people struggle to escape from cults!

rockingchair nice post.

I wish M&H could come to some solution that made them both happy whilst still being acceptable to the royal family.

The Swedish princess Madeleine married her husband. He never took a title, he is not representing the Swedish royal family and has just kept working. Madeleine kept her title (didn’t take his name), keeps occasionally represent the Swedish royal family and does a lot of charity work. Theo’s children have no titles and the family lives in the US.

The press will occasionally print horrible things (the German press especially I think) and there is the occasional “she abandoned Sweden”. Apart from that, everyone goes on with their lives, I assume they are happy and the children I think are beyond cute.

I wish H&M could find a model like that.

Do you genuinely believe that a helicopter containing a member of the royal family was used as a decoy for missiles?hmm

This is the sort of tone that irritates. I didn't present it as fact - simply said what I'd read. Sub-text - 'you're an idiot for thinking that could be true'.

A post followed yours which was also skeptical, but so much more pleasant in tone.

It seems unlikely I must admit. I imagine there are a few people around who think it might not have been the worst idea...

Just my thoughts......

@katiegoestoaldi sometimes I feel the need to criticise a post on this thread ,this is not the same as being a critic of the thread .

From what I've read it's Rocking's tone and asking how attitudes have been arrived at/what they're based on that seems to annoy ppl.

She has explained more than once why she challenges different views on here and I agree that certain accusations /suppositions need to be challenged and not blindly accepted and repeated.

Feeling like that means that I( and probably Rocking ) are not going to ignore posts .On the other hand posters who find being challenged about their views annoying are free not to respond aren't they ?And if posters don't like the tone ,feel they are being bullied then reporting to HQMN might be more effective than railing on the thread .

I was thinking about their shared interests: the environment, mental health, Archie and perhaps dogs (although I never heard he was particularly keen but I guess he must be). Also dysfunctional family background in common.

And then their different ones:
H: huntin, shootin, fishin, army, brought up in a very structured way.

M: actress, a hustler (I dont mean that critically), celeb-wired.

To me it seems like two very different worlds colliding, all well and good if it works.

peridito, I think it just how posts come across - and rocking made a very thoughtful post that she sometimes came across wrong whilst posting here (It is hard as we all interpret things differently, have varying levels of sensitivity and as we cannot see each other non verbal clues).

I made a post at one point which was interpreted as a strong support for the Express (?) whilst my intention was a gentle banter making fun of the statement that getting the weather forecast right (in the UK!) was in any way an indication of general reliability. We get misinterpreted.

I don’t mind at all that my posts are questioned. If I have had a sleepless night, I might go off I I felt a poster was implying that I was an idiot or that my opinion wasn’t valid (which may not at all have been the poster’s intention, they might just have been very engaged).

I like these discussions, sometimes we disagree and that makes for more interesting discussions. I hope we can keep going .

I CAN actually see H&M (not the shop! ) coming back. In one of two ways: just Harry coming back alone - which I massively doubt and he strikes me as the sort who wouldn't leave his kids, even if his marriage does go to shit.

I think they could BOTH come back if they achieved huge popularity in LA as producers perhaps, made a fortune, and became massively popular on the celebrity circuit and in gossip magazines etc. At that point, they would be so famous for stuff outside the RF, that the RF would possibly snap their hands off to come back.

But I don't see them ever coming back and settling for being "working royals" again. He hates it and she will clearly want more money. I don't begrudge them raising their son outside the RF with all its restrictions. It isn't real life and won't set him up for a future as a non-Royal. I can't imagine H wanting that for his son at all.

I just hope they can find a role for themselves which makes them happy, and that they do treat the RF with dignity.

I really don't think that security costs will influence the RF for one second. 100m is sod all in the scheme of things. Its a fortune to us, but not in terms of security expenditure, when we have people like Tony Blair provided with security all the time.

Ugh, thinking about TB reminds me of a second sex dream I had about Boris Johnson last night. So disturbing!

yes I absolutely agree GH ,good points well made !

PS Rocking, that was such a lovely post

I think the thread has moved on from wrangling about tone now peridito, largely to do with rocking herself, all credit to her. A gentle reminder doesn't hurt though.

Kudos to Rocking for her post. Very measured and eloquent.

Ugh, thinking about TB reminds me of a second sex dream I had about Boris Johnson last night
I am seriously worried about this, you must have been very grateful to wake up!

GracefulHippo Totally agree with your post about the Swedish RF, they have made it work as have other european royals. I wish for something like that for H&M.

SirChing

A second sex dream about Boris Johnson . It has happened before? This would seriously worry me too!

Feeling like that means that I( and probably Rocking ) are not going to ignore posts .On the other hand posters who find being challenged about their views annoying are free not to respond aren't they ?

Good for rocking and her post. However I feel there's a little bit of revisionism going on here. No one minds being challenged, no one expects you to ignore posts, what they mind is being told they're full of hate, vitriolic, misogynistic, racist and stupid. That was how the discord started and is still going on over on the "support" thread. The regular expressions of incredulity that these terrible threads are allowed to stand don't help. All this makes people defensive.

It would be great to see the threads carry on without unpleasantness

Don't, I already feel sullied! AND I had one about Donald Trump once - he kept his suit on and was surprisingly good although I remember thinking "what tiny hands" in my dream.

In my first Boris sex dream, he too kept his suit on. And I mercifully can't remember much else.

Last night, I dreamt that I worked for him. He decided that Carrie was a social climber who was trying to change him into someone he isn't. I told him that everyone else could see it, but that he wouldn't be told and had to come to that conclusion himself. We then did the deed. At which point he changed into Obama (I think my brain was protecting itself!).

I have been ill and had a temperature both times which does explain it. So, the Queen may have a pervert son and H&M being problematic, but she is still winning at life if she hasn't had a "repulsive leader" sex dream!

Thank you for the kind words

@SirChing that's awful! Get (& stay) very well soon, I'd be terrified to go to sleep again.

@GracefulHippo that sounds a very workable model. Hopefully, M&H/ RF will get past this messiness and sort something but it's so hard when the situations already broken down. I think, like people have said on here, it'd be a real positive from all of this, if they all try and pre-empt it for the next generation so they can have more options.