Buying an ex breeding dog..

[Eeehbahgum]

have seen an ad for a kc registered ex breeding bichon
i rang the breeder today and was told that she os really friendly , likes other dogs and people. Been in car etc , part of family not kenneled.
she is low energy.
( often bichon s can be )
I asked why the sale? (£800) and was told that they are hobby breeder and they cant keep all their dogs as they need new ones to
keep breeding and domt have room for all the older dogs.
they put it like - its her turn for her own sofa now. I know that due to
k c rules she cant have more litters.

really don't want a pup.

they assure me that she is a v easy going dog , house
trained. . i am concerned that she has lived her life with other dogs - thus wont she feel the loss of other dogs ( they say no she loves human fuss! Or have separation anxieties as she is used to never being alone ?

i am allowed to go and spend time with her , stay locally and re visit her the next day . But i cannot test of she will be anxious as outlined until she is in out home. Any ideas about this please?

Whilst you're caring so much about the welfare of animals, maybe you should think about the way you treat and talk to people and the way you make them feel. Your manner and tone are awful.

I'm totally on your page @CellophaneFlower- it can take a lot of research but there are decent enough breeders out there too. You've just got to find them if that's what you want.

It is because I am fed up of people enabling animal abuse and dressing it up as rescue.

The people that purchase from puppy/cat farms (and farm isn't used as a place description, it could be a flat) are animal abusers.

Well I'm fed up of being verbally abused by you. You've now accused me of being an animal abuser with absolutely no context to your claim or knowing the bigger picture. Nobody here has said they have bought an animal from a breeding farm and nobody has supported breeding farms. You've just decided to single me out and have a go at me, which isn't the kind and caring qualities that you apparently preach about. Not every breeder is operating on a farm basis and there are some amazing and historic breeds that are being kept alive by good breeders. I could go on but that's now what this thread is about and the OP is looking for advice on how to go about getting the best dog for them in a very responsible and caring way. Maybe channel your energy into helping others and not be out to attempt to attack, acuse and belittle people.

It must have hit a nerve as I was very careful not to single anyone out.

I was simply responding as to why my tone might come across as prickly. People, that is a general term, people who purchase from puppy farms are animal abusers.

I agree that there are breeders that are ethical, but that wasn't what we were talking about, you specifically mentioned breeding cats that hadn't had a lovely life. A good breeder would make sure all their animals have a lovely life.

This post is about advice to the OP, I just didn't agree with yours where you supported getting a animal from a dubious source.

I see it as rescuing in a way as you can then give them the lovely life that they deserve and probably haven't had!

nope . don't touch with a bargepole. please don't enable these evil people by buying their leftovers. disgusting humans . no reputable breeder would sell their beloved bitch!

Hi all - I took your advice and contacted cavashons uk
they have a list( small ) of approved breeders.
I contacted one called scarlettstrue In Llaneli-
she has a wait list

she says she does things differently and not everyone likes her ways.
basically when the pups are born you choose remotely and then you get uodates and visit at 5 weeks , collecting around 8 weeks.
she has a good rep and has people wait a good while.
what i dont understand is that i think this assumes that the pup can be shaped by owner and thats that? I thought that you matched the pup to you - such as choosing the confident one, or the calm one - depending on what attracted you ?
i rang another breeder called dashhunds and doodlles - who say they also ask them to tell you what you are like and they match dog to you .
they specialise provision of dogs with a thereapy dog history in their parents- for people with adhd , autism - but again you dont get to see the dog as they match it.
Reading my posts , you can probably tell I have adhd.
its late diagnosed - following years of dedication in a health setting- good with emergency- not so good at normal life . Which is why I can sometimes struggle and would appreciate help and advice .

Anyway- what do you think to these practices? I can send links.
ps
also seen a poodle - 50 years of home breeding- mum present- dad stud. I can also send link re that.

Well 'Scarletstrue' is a puppy farm.

They also appear to know sweet sod all about either breed. What a surprise. They also 'vet check' rather than 'health-test.' They do some health tests...but definitely not the ones that should be done on two breeds so prone to so many issues.

That is exactly the thing I warned about - with mongrel breeding, like this 'breed', the 'recommended breeders' are almost always going to be puppy farmers.

I feel like I repeat this all the time on mumsnet...but for the people in the back who did not hear: Just because a breed club recommends a breeder does not mean they are not a puppy farmer or that they are a good breeder

Thank you
Am absolutely in tears .
i feel so vulnerable.
how do you know that she is a puppy farm? She has few litters and you have to wait 2 years.
Do u mind if i send you the link to the other two and a older dog.?

https://dachshundsanddoodles.co.uk/

state do therapy dogs

https://www.pets4homes.co.uk//classifieds/xxxdtrzb2-pedigree-toy-poodles-leeds/?pmg_source=share

eldery lady - has all her older girls

https://www.pets4homes.co.uk//classifieds/nzr0d21fz-gorgeous-female-shih-tzu-stowmarket/?pmg_source=share

Fuck me. £3.5k for a cross breed!

People have different definitions of what a puppy farm is.
Most people think of places that keep multiple dogs (often of various breeds) in barns/kennels. The dogs are kept in poor conditions and never see the light of day.
Then there is BYB (back yard breeders) or hobby breeders, who breed their pets for money, without bothering with the proper health checks or researching lines and best suited studs etc.
Anyone breeding multiple crosses or breeds would be a no from me, as they are in it for the money and not the welfare of the dogs. The only possible exception to this would be a working kennels that had different gundog breeds.

I have contacted the people overseeing particular breeds .
no one has responded or answered the phone.

please may i ask of experienced people.
A lot of ads seem to post puppy 1
puppy 2 etc

then u choose when they are really. Young- several have stated pups dont form character till left litter so it does matter what one you choose

my. Novice view wd be to visit at about 5 weeks , choose then - then go from there as id choose the not dominant puppy , but the gentle character.

how on earth does one choose a pup and at what age ??

my confidence is badly affected. The ex breeding dog- you were all completely right.

the choice out there seems to be choose puppy one two or 3 etc then they are reserved—
it feels wrong to me .
plus i have heard that some people can buy in pups and pretend they are the litter
so what age is it best to see a pup?
(obvs with its mum)
pups seem to be getting reserved
before people can even visit ( or course thats best for mum)
the only person who has asked me to wait 5 weeks then choose is the link to the poodles! She says its the. Bond on meeting
what do you think to the dashhounds and doodles- choosing for uou- is it a sales thing -gimick?
i do want a therapy type dog- the adhd me is absolutely soothed by gentle dogs- it changes how I feel and operate - it’s evident to my dh ( when with my friends calm poodle )

@Eeehbahgum it's one of those things that comes with experience. I've been breeding/involved in the dog world for years so it's incredibly easy to tell!

Avoid Daschunds&Doodles. Reason: I sell Golden Retriever puppies for £2.5K (so £1K cheaper than their dogs). No one should be selling a dog for as much as they are - least of all a glorified mongrel! I have multiple generations of fully health tested dogs in my lines and several SHCH (Show Champs - think Crufts) so I charge about the top rate for my breed. Daschunds&Doodles dogs almost certainly do not have the SHCH in their lines or the full heath tests you would want. They also have a litter 'every three months' = puppy farm.

And, being honest, only a complete arsehole would breed a Pyrenean Mountain Dog with a Poodle. I love PMDs (there's a poster here who has one) but only a particular group of people are truly capable of owning them and anyone breeding that breed with a cross is negligent.

So, puppy farm, breeding too many dogs of stupid crosses and charging far too much.

The second one you linked, might be okay. But you should ask to see all evidence of health tests (not vet checks) that have been done on the parents.

Avoid the third one. 14 months old and being given up? Why? 'Change in Circumstances' does not cut it.

Honestly, you really would be better off going on the KC website. Searching for the pedigree breed (toy poodles) and then looking for puppies from fully health
tested parents. Too many of the websites you're linking do not have parents that are health tested.

Yes i agree that i am not experienced and i dont wnat to get it the hard way x thanks so much. I feel so vulnerable.

The other issue is that with adhd - I have the insight to know that my emotions can be disregulated and i am concerned about the ability to do consistent training.
i am admitting that to myself as i need to some how address this .

our old bichon followed me around all the time ( and when I was with her i felt grounded- she even came to work with me and the team looked after her under my desk when i was with patients) and I functioned far far far better with a dog than without one . They ground me and i think clearer. I focus as I think about their needs.

I am hoping somehow to get round this as my old dog simply followed me and she was so easy.
the only training i could recall was the toilet training . I did not have to do recall as she just wanted to be near me!
ive read on here that a poodle may be good- i am just unsure as the prey drive is in poodles - and they may also outsmart me ? 😂

I never thought that the finding of a good , human focused, low prey drive dog would be this hard to find.

ive rang the national no s for bichon and poodles - no response.

LandSharksAnonymous
sharlottestrue to screen - for various illnesses.

please can someone tell me when pups show character? I am being told that the character is formed by the human when the pups go he by some people? My instinct- despite my panic - is they do have individual characters?!!

I don't think there's an exact science when determining puppies characters very early on.

My pup was said to be the instigator of all the play by my breeder. She sent many videos of all the pups snoozing whilst mine was bouncing off the walls (and them 🫣) and I did worry what I'd let myself in for. She turned out to be a pretty chilled dog in reality, she just adapts to her environment. If my children are running around like nutters, she will join in, but if there's nothing going on she'll just totter about and snooze.

I never thought of that but the only ex-breeder bitch I have known was also a dreadful eater of other dogs' poos, to the point she would be sick. Lovely dog but stressful to walk as she couldn't really be off-lead unless you watched her like a hawk.

https://www.pets4homes.co.uk//classifieds/mldjw2zh7-top-quality-extensively-tested-f1b-toy-cavapoos-brough/?pmg_source=share

any red flags here ? Thanks!

You started off this thread saying you didn't want a puppy. Now you're looking at puppies. Is that your ADHD?

I know the struggle with ADHD. I'm late diagnosed and it makes something like this feel like a minefield. Having had wider family experience of buying puppies, rescuing from abroad, and rescuing in this country, i would go to a reputable rescue where you can meet the dog. My relative got a Greyhound from the dogs trust and she had to meet it 3 times in different settings before being allowed to take it home. It's the gentlest, calmest dog and was everything the rescue said it would be. They'd fully assessed the dog and had no reason to lie about the things the dog would struggle with - such as toilet training. Turns out it's been fine.

She's got two litters of crossbreeds advertised. 16 puppies x £2350 each. That's over £37,500. Nice little earner, but it doesn't scream someone who is breeding discriminately. The breeding dogs are her "family pets". Yeah right. What are the odds that someone who just wants a litter from their much loved family pet would have 2 litters on the go at the same time?

https://www.pets4homes.co.uk//classifieds/t308-mrj8-gorgeous-cavapoochon-puppies-sutton-coldfield/?pmg_source=share

what about this breeder- she has the g ma , the mum , and a sibling?

LittleYellowQueen

thank you for the reg cognition re the adhd.

It is a struggle and one that inam aware of and it makes me nervous!!

i dont want a puppy - but Ive been looking at people with older dogs and I really dont trust a lot of what they are saying! Plus i just domt have the confidence to take on a dog with issues.

out of all the dogs i have looked at , its the red poodle that i feel may work- as the lady does joy not take deposits but allows you to go and see them .

the amount of dogs ive seen that require deposit with no viewing- due to post covid , is huge !

Feel like am going in circles .
my ideal would be a post puppy poodle , shiz, bichon - but trusting what people say is pretty tough and scary.