Good Omens 2 - all episodes watched so spoilers aplenty to discuss

[TyneTeas]

Oh :{

I forgot to say, the author is arguing that we are being tricked or misled with some of the flashback scenes, in order to set up the storyline in S3.

@missmoon i just read through all that. Really interesting intelligent long essay on the show. Good to know I'm not the only one obsessing on it. That guys takes it to a new level!

I think he's got a point, Alot of the nonsensical stuff must be a set up for S3. Neil Gaimen is making people work hard to like S2 though!! If you need a 16000 word essay on why "it's not rubbish really!!!"

thank you for posting that though. I'm weirdly enjoying giving this so much brain space. It's a nice break from real life 😊.

@Pinkbakerscap Yes, same here, nice to have this as a distraction :)

If the guy who wrote that is right then the scene where Aziraphale discovers he's been tricked by the metatron and makes up with Crowley will be a lovely watch. I'm sure something like that will be planned for S3 unless Neil wants to be very unpopular.

Right, I've gone proper crackers now and just started reading about the book of Job (because of the quote on the matchbox). Turns out Bildad the Shuite is actually one of Job's friends in the bible who he speaks to of his woes. I honestly thought it was a silly name the writers came up with 🤦‍♀️😝. Every days a school day. Probably most people knew that but I didn't.

Thank you so much for posting this, @missmoon , it's really interesting. Quite reassuring as it mentions some of the things I had found a bit strange about this season (plus more I hadn't thought about) and makes me feel a lot better about them. I really hope the author is correct!

That’s a fascinating read @missmoon I’m not convinced that they would really make an entire series that’s intentionally a bit crap just for a payoff in a following series - which won’t even happen if enough people think S2 is a bit crap …

Also, a couple of things I didn’t find convincing, like the shoe-horned in relationship between Gabriel and Beelzebub, don’t seem to be covered by it, which makes me less convinced that it was all secretly genius. But it was pretty well thought through - I hope he’s right!

I’m not sure I buy all of it, some of the quirkiness is there in the first series too. But I think there is something odd going on with the minisodes, and those scenes appear in the title sequence with Gabriel’s box (Neil Gaiman confirmed that there were hints for S3 in the S2 title sequence). Also, I think that is why they haven’t released the S2 script, my guess is that it has directions that would give some of it away.

I wouldn’t say that it’s a bit crap, I’ve enjoyed it a lot, just that many things feel unresolved.

Yes, a bit crap is harsh. But all the examples of weak dialogue, deus ex machina devices and multiple plot threads going nowhere were pretty justified. I did enjoy it but felt it was quite weak in places, and even if this is brilliantly resolved next series it will still leave it as a bit weak as a middle series.

To me it felt much more like what happens when you take brilliant source material and then decide to carry on beyond it because of the popularity of the show. I don’t know Neil Gaiman well enough to know if the writer’s conviction that he is a justified. I do think John Finnemore is brilliant though, so was surprised at the cliches.

Yea, I thought this too - would the writers really make a whole series a bit rubbish just for the reason why to be cleverly revealed in the next (possible)) season? Wouldn't Occam's razor apply here?

I've just had a couple of thoughts:

1. Disappearing Eccles cakes. I think the 16,000 word essay author mentioned this, and said he wasn't sure why it happened. But Aziraphale asked Nina for something to calm people down - if the editing Metatrin theory is correct, perhaps Metatron didn't want anyone to be calm.
2. Which mini-sodes had we seen before in Series 1? Is it only the church being bombed? I wonder if close watching would reveal any differences.
3. Is there something in the fact that Crowley probably can't be written out of the book of life, due to having played an integral part in starting off the universe?
4. Metatron gives Crowley such an evil look, and looks massively relieved when Aziraphale is safely in the lift. I think the combined power of C&A (the however many Lazari miracle) is the driver between him wanting to separate C&A.

I need to let all of this go like a normal adult.

I suppose my unhappy thought is what if the writers were distracted by writing for such great characters (C&A), and putting in lots of fun Easter eggs, and they knew they had to move things to a certain point for the start of Series 3, that they just rushed the plot a bit.

That essay is, indeed, very interesting - enough to make me want to rewatch S2 with it in mind and see how it all feels and fits with this new interpretation.

Sometimes fan predictions/interpretations are far more ingenious than the original's turn out to be. I really hope this is not that and that S3 is like a glorious firework display.

Yes, I agree with that! There has been a lot of talk about the sequel that TP & NG wanted to write and how the second series was necessary to get it to that point - I think the focus was too much on getting there and having fun. Maybe there were a few things they needed to put in place for S3, hence couldn’t really go straight into it, but not really enough necessary to the core plot to fill a whole series - hence a lot of filler and things that are quite fun but don’t really mean anything (resurrectionists, nazi zombies, magic, etc).

oh, point 3 is really interesting, I hadn’t thought of that!

I’ve been spending far too much time thinking about this and lurking on Tumblr etc. I came across this thread on what might happen next, and what we know about the sequel book TP and NG had been planning: https://twitter.com/mjjoycecrowley/status/1691656303771594965?s=46

Also this earlier thread: https://twitter.com/mjjoycecrowley/status/1686180021772386304?s=46

I had noticed the plane in the title sequence and didn’t quite know what to make of it, this makes a lot of sense (it’s a reference to
the second coming storyline).

Would be brilliant to have a S3 partly set in New York!

@missmoon me too!! The links you're posting are all fab I'm really enjoying reading through them all. Thank you. It's nice to know I'm not the only one who has a Good Omens shaped blister in my brain!

@Pinkbakerscap Thank you, it’s good to know I’m not the only one! I don’t know why it’s lingered in my mind so much, I think I’m just impatient and hate unfinished business!

I read the book as a teenager 30 years ago, and it made a huge impression on me. The bits I’ve liked the most in the TV series are the new plot and character developments, because they are like a sequel to the original novel. So I can’t wait to see what happens next :)

Btw the meme in that twitter feed that says

Crowley's lips are the last thing Aziraphale tasted on earth.

made me 😭😭😭😭😭

@Pinkbakerscap I know, the the final 15 minutes are devastating, but I think also a credit to how good the acting is until that point, and over the two series. It is so subtle and shows us their evolving relationship. I know not everyone is keen on the romance part, but it's so warm and subtle, I love it!

@missmoon i love the romance too. I've done a rewatch and I'll admit I've read a bit of the quite pornagraphic fan fiction and now I think I'm more invested in this fictional romance than I have been in any for years 😳. Hey ho I'm still enjoying myself so it's harmless enough.

@Pinkbakerscap @missmoon I also like the romance aspect (and the fanfiction)! I've rewatched it and I think I like it better the second time around, I think I might have slightly more faith that it's leading somewhere than I did the first time I saw it.

Well that was a long read. I feel certain that the 6 episodes could have been covered in a film just fine and that the essay could have been 12 or so thousand words shorter! Fantasy writers are known for always wanting to be more epic than the last one I guess.

My verdict is that I will be very annoyed if the entire series was set up to be rubbish so that they can pull a Metatron interference twist. Millions of people had to sit through the crap hours and if it isn't well received enough they won't even get to make the third series and prove how clever they all are! Unlike the writer, I don't think Neil Gaiman is a God. Didn't enjoy Sandman and his interference killed off American gods before we got to see the end. Particularly annoyed that technical boy didn't get his arc finished.

I rather hope that the ones pulling the trick are Aziraphale and Crowley themselves. The "getting closer" was never explained, so might not have been meant to happen on series 2. They do want to live on Earth, so maybe need to get Aziraphale into heaven to stop the second coming being the next apocalypse. The smile in the lift was joy that they succeeded.

@TheIsleOfTheLost i agree. I like "the lie" theory too.
https://twitter.com/star_rainbow4/status/1689917155645489152

This made me smile also
https://twitter.com/StrayMylse/status/1692957905559908451