Eurovision 2023 Grand Final - thread 4

[GrandTheftWalrus]

Just incase anyone wants to carry on the chat.

I think it's a matter of taste and and who is anyone to say a song is good or bad? A performance can be good or bad if the singer doesn't deliver or there are production problems. As Red implied earlier, you can enjoy a song that's in the charts or a song you hear during a Eurovision* *show. Even the whacky-looking Croatians had a serious message behind their song (dictatorship).

Didn't much care for the costumes and showing of belly tbh! 😂

I think the Finns gave the performance their all. It reminds me of a haka in the way it raises your energy when you watch.

Yes, so did all of my friends too (40-55) and my kids (11/14). A friend who is a serious musician (and who has taught some of the very biggest names in the music industry) couldn't believe the Finnish entry (what the heck is that, was her comment)!

I think it's a matter of taste and and who is anyone to say a song is good or bad?

Yes, this - absolutely. My sister thought the UK entry was a great song, well performed - I thought neither. I tend to like a song if it sounds good. I'm not into the message behind it etc.

You'll never convince people to change their mind as it's all subjective like saying comedian x is great when somebody else doesn't find them funny at all.

But it doesn't really matter as we all have different views on things but I just don't like the mud throwing against a winner, whether we / you like it or not!
And the conspiracy theory - that's just hilarious!

I wouldn't agree with the mud-throwing either. That's not right.

gawd that's supposed to say mud throwing. auto correct's not having it's finest moment...

it's doing it again! mud slinging!!!!

It's boo-hooray theory. Emotivism:

(ethicss^) The meta-ethical stance that ethical judgments, such as those containing the words "should" and "ought to", are primarily expressions of one's own attitude and imperatives meant to change the attitudes and actions of another.

Essentially we are stating we like or dislike Finland's entry and using ethical, rather than emotional words to express why (or why not). It's like telling someone pizza or ice cream is dreadful. It's just taste. No one will magically decide they don't like it based on someone else's taste.

I'd love to see the crowd reaction to the Swedish song...

As you wish @SoupDragon

Thank you :)

slightly livelier than I thought it would be!

I still really don't like the song. It just seems warbly and lifeless to me. Odd.

Well, that's precisely the role of the jury. They are objectively deciding if a song is good or bad.

Yes. There's no denying that. They have a set of criteria to judge songs by. I remember one of the features of the successful Eurovision song used to involve a change of key; going up one tone towards the end to give the song a lift.
I'm in favour of keeping the juries, but I don't like musical snobbery. It reminds me of people who judge other people's accents.

It would be an interesting experiment to devise a song that was technically perfect in every respect, and judge audience reaction to it.

I am not qualified to judge the technical merits of a song, but if you look at (for example) a list of all UK no 1 hits, you can be confident some of them are low on technical merit - novelty songs for example - Mr Blobby, the Chicken Song & similar - the wide appeal of a song must rest on many less tangible qualities.

Same as Eurovision then. There are plenty of other no ones which are musically very good too.

The Voice might be technically better but I'm never voluntarily choose to listen to it over Ooh Aah Just A Little Bit. That probably makes me an unpatriotic pleb but am I bovvered?

The one entry that I have very strong feelings about was the abomination that was Dustin The Turkey in 2012. I maintain it wasn't a song :)

No it was an embarrassment not a song Fuzzy

Is a good song about the technical aspects or is it about enjoyment?

Oh, without a doubt. But the point of the experiment would be that technical perfection would be the only consideration when writing the song.

Depends on if you're a music snob or not @Bigtitsbetty

Absolutely Jane. I don't think the Irish public should ever be trusted again. They blew it! Juries from now on!

I think you could consider Estonia's song to be a technically perfect song. I really liked it. I thought it was beautiful and that it had emotional depth and performed really well (the girl in blue with the self-playing piano 'Bridges'). It was only popular with the juries though. According to my dd, it was boring!

That's the one my music snob partner 😃perked up at and commented on. I don't like lots of popular song styles that are big sellers - Beyonce, Katy Perry etc. The big corporate written-by-numbers type sounds but I'm sure they're technically "good" songs because they're written to be hits. This was a good Twitter thread on what makes a Eurovision winner. twitter.com/kitlochery/status/1396160993504415744?s=20