BBC 2 9pm Don't Exclude Me

[Snowdropsandbluebells]

Anyone watching?
It's an eye opener.

Maybe Oscars parents also need more support too...

It's really hard for teachers - impossible actually.

It's bloody hard for parents too - and all those problems from school are magnified and experienced at home too.

To be perfectly honest the whole set up is underfunded and massively flawed - then hoops schools and parents have to go through to even get assessments is horrific.

@Jaysmith71

Exclude them. Exclude the lot of them, and devote these precious scarce resources to the good kids who want to learn.

I beg your pardon?

3 years ago my son was as bad, if not worse, than the children in this programme. He was permanently excluded from a state school for violent behaviour which would never have happened had the staff actually been implementing the support in his EHCP. I had the exclusion challenged and overturned but by then his school related trauma meant he couldn't go back inside a school. Just talking about school caused him to start pulling his hair out and punching himself in the face.

But...

He wanted to learn. He was desperate to learn.

He now has an EOTAS package (education other than at school) funded via his EHCP. He spent this morning doing GCSE simultaneous equations with a maths tutor, whilst bouncing on a gym ball in the garden He will probably be able to sit GCSE Maths and English early (he's just turned 11 btw) and is starting Latin and Greek lessons after Christmas. He can make a cake from scratch, and ice it.

He has always wanted to learn. But he couldn't, in a mainstream environment with staff who had no clue how to support him.

Your opinion is borne of ignorance and tbh I pity you for having such a narrow world view.

@Missmissmiiiiiiiiisss agree

@YoghurtWeaver I hear you and have heard so many tales like this.
We were lucky to have a great SEN advocate who helped us fight our local authority to get out sons needs met.

I 100% agree and empathise with the kids who aren't disruptive too - it's not their fault and of course their education is impacted.

I just don't think many people truly realise that 9 times out of 10 you actually have to fight the system which is stacked against you to get your child's needs met if they have SEND - it is made incredibly hard to support your child.

I think it's an awful program. Completely focused on attachment theory, no consideration for processing difficulties, sensory ASD ADHD which seem quite likely given presentation. The effects of masking can lead to significant mental health problems down the line so I'd be holding off calling it a success as this point.

I had to really fight to get DS3 out of mainstream, despite the school clearly not able to cope with him and telling Mr to move him elsewhere, thdy colluded with the LA instead. We won ( Thank you Subject Access Requests!) but I can't begin to say how awful it was.

And some of you would weep with fury about how much his education now costs!

@Jaysmith71

Exclude them. Exclude the lot of them, and devote these precious scarce resources to the good kids who want to learn.

What a horrendous thing to say. These children clearly have mental difficulties / special educational needs. They are not behaving this way for the fun of it, and their parents are competent and trying their best.

Shall we say the same if you or your child has physical problem such as a cancer diagnosis - just send you to the hospice and concentrate on the healthy in society.

You are a disgrace.

Ignore the troll. They have form for it.

@RAOK

Interesting that you pin it on the parenting, probably feeling very smug you are doing such a fabulous job. Having one typical child, followed by a younger child with SEN I can tell you that every child is different. A child with SEN can make any parent look and feel line a “bad” parent.

Is there such a thing as a 'naughty' child? Do teachers tell children their behaviour is 'naughty' or 'bad'?

I watched 10 minutes of it. As the parent of an autistic child I turned it off because it was wishy washy bullshit. All set up to make the behaviour lady look like a miracle worker. Didn't address a lot of key points/issues. Pissed me right off to be honest.

I'm watching it now with Oscar's behaviour in the playground
Really hard to watch
I'm not surprised his parents are finding it hard if he's like this at home too

@HopeClearwater

I’ve just looked her up. She runs a private behaviour management consultancy. Her colleague looks a lot like the young teacher in the episode tonight.

She really does!

@HopeClearwater

She’s not pioneering in any way at all. All of these teachers will have been trained in the techniques and language she is using. The male teacher with blondish scruffy hair was clearly well versed in dealing with children positively. It must have been annoying for him to have been praised by the so-called behaviour expert.

I assumed she was saying that cos he might have picked up the things from her? But yes you're right it's that's true Maybe that's why we didn't see his face when she was saying that to him if he wasn't impressed! 😂

Well I hope it goes well for the children
But it was Oscar's mum and dad I felt sorry for when they said they had been feeling like they were failures as parents 😟 I bet they were finding it so hard

I just watched some more as someone told me there was a little boy being restrained. I cannot believe what I have just seen, a child being restrained for no good reason. He was posing no immediate risk to anyone, and if they believed he was they should have cleared the area, not subjected a child to restraint, which should only ever be a last option. The lady was rambling on and on about good choices which was only agitating him further. How the hell did she think that was supporting him? Appalled the BBC thought this was appropriate to air. Absolutely disgraceful.

As a parent to an 'oscar' child speculation about diagnosis is offensive. Our child is not Autistic, nor ADHD and if you meet a child who is it is screamingly obvious that these conditions are not SEMH, and every teacher should be able to work this out in 10 minutes. The next speculation is that the child is 'abused' at home and I can tell you having to fight social services at the same time as trying to get your child appropriately treated is beyond traumatic, especially with school teachers pointing fingers when actually they simply do not have the training or skills to address the problems of your child. And that goes for SEN and SENCO's I am afraid except in specialist SEMH schools. Even referral units. In two weeks with skilled teachers our child was near normal. Not only was he traumatised, we were. I visited 9 schools, including all special needs. ALL teachers need to spend 3 mths at one of these schools as part of their training. 'I feel sorry for the other children', they cried when our child was excluded, they were desperate to help our child when he was locked in a room and guarded. Is he fine now, yes, does he need help with transition between years and teachers, yes. Does he need locking away? NO he is the sweetest most loving child just scared in a loud noisy room of kids.

If I were a parent of an autistic child I would be offended by this programme. It should be stated right up front that this programme is dealing with SEMH needs. I get very offended when it is assumed our child is autistic, our child does not have 'attachment issues' another 'diagnosis'. Our child is just scared and like any cornered and scared creature lashes out. When included, beavers, cubs and scouts he is happy and co operative and 80% of the time like any other child.

Its a good programme, but needs more say from parents and more insight into the trauma that getting help is.

Our child is not Autistic, nor ADHD and if you meet a child who is it is screamingly obvious that these conditions are not SEMH

Can I just ask what you mean by this? ADHD falls under SEMH in the SEND Code of Practice.

On the restraining thing - this was the second episode of the show. If you'd seen the build up, you'd have seen that Oscar spat at staff and hit children, threw stuff around the room and that the teacher had to evacuate the class more than once.

The restraining obviously is the last resort and something the staff didn't do lightly. They were afraid he would hurt himself, or other people, as he had done in the very recent past.

ausojdad guess it depends what lens you're looking through, your child isn't autistic and you "see" Oscar mine is and I "see" him too.

My 8 year old is autistic, ADHD and sensory difficulties and he's very like Oscar. Oscar's parents said he started having prolonged meltdowns from when he was 2, and they struggled with his behaviour at home. There were things about his speech, like having to finish his sentence, repeating back what was said - that were really familiar, not just the disruptive behaviour.

I have another autistic child whose presentation is very different and he's never lashed out (he's 16). I think most people realise there's different presentations of ASD and there's no reason to be offended.

We took our child to an Autistic support group event, they were lovely people. I quickly felt a fraud as our child was very obviously not autistic but oddly found it easy to get on with the other children. When I visited '9' schools I felt guilty that ours might take up a place needed by a child with different needs. When I visited a school that was purely SEMH I could see within minutes that it was the right place for him. Not that he got a place, he is in a school with a mixture now and if supported appropriately could be in mainstream near home not a 30 minute taxi ride away. That he does this is extraordinary but also means he has no local friends from school and isolated. This programme brought back the trauma we suffered getting him a place, put me off work with stress exhaustion for 6 weeks, but it presents only the school and is not balanced. Our child suffered 18 mths of what can only be described as persecution, for just being scared which could have been addressed as shown by this programme in a few weeks, and was at another school.

it does, you are correct but ADHD and Autism are assumed to be the '2 conditions' - there is a whole spectrum of emotional needs and these labels make it 'this or that' - also termed 'complex needs'

apologies

If Oscar was just spoiled and babied why was he worried that his mum would be angry about his behaviour that morning in school? The conversation with the Deputy Head where he explained at length thry could tell her he had turned his behaviour around etc.

It doesn't say much for the adults of they've all just been manipulated by a 6 year old either!

No it doesn't!