White House Farm - The Bamber Murders. Jan 8th ITV 9pm

[Dogleg]

Is anyone else planning to watch this six part series? I vaguely remembered the killings and on seeing this advertised have now lost hours to reading up about it online and have also downloaded a book about the case. I’m really looking forward to this one!

www.radiotimes.com/news/tv/2019-12-25/itv-drama-white-house-farm/

Basically I agree. Technically possible but one the less likely scenarios.

Apple, I had wondered about someone else forcing Nevill to make the call rather than pretending (would make sense of the probable burn marks on his back) but it does add another layer of complication - why they are trying to summon Jeremy to the scene? To frame him? But you would think if someone was doing that they would try and add some more Jeremy-specific evidence, wouldn't you? It all seems a bit tenuous.

That seems a bit too far fetched to me.

I can't believe Jeremy would be stupid enough to put the silencer in the cupboard when he must have known the house had been searched.

The tv programme to me seemed to show Ann and her husband really sure that it was Jeremy who carried out the murders and it seems strange they decided to look round the property and find the silencer.

I would not want to live somewhere 5 people had been murdered and it would be even worse if they were family. I do believe in ghosts but it is not even that. It's just gruesome and I am surprised anyone would want to live there let alone a relative. She did come across as strange though.

They didn't look round the property to find the silencer. They were going round the property with the executor to take away valuables so they couldn't be stolen, because everyone knew the house was lying empty.

I think if you're used to houses being passed down from generation to generation then you're not squeamish about living in a house where someone died. I know I have relatives who live in houses where older relatives died at home. I agree it feels different when it's a murder but maybe it felt more important to them to try to continue their aunt and uncle's legacy.

Technically possible but one the less likely scenarios.

Yes exactly - let's call it a parallel universe theory because none of us actually believe it.

why they are trying to summon Jeremy to the scene?

So in this theory I suppose they could be trying to get JB there so 'Sheila' can kill him too. Or as you say, to frame him. But that would be very risky if JB called the police before going to the farm.

In the parallel universe theory the motivation would still be money.

I think I recall reading that NB's will said JB had to be working the farm to inherit. Did JB know the details of the will and did the extended family also know this?

We had a strange will situation in our extended family. It was believed that an only child would be the sole beneficiary of the will but the estate was split between them and a few other parties. The family was divided between those who wanted to 'do the right thing' and those who just wanted the money!

It's a tv drama, it's not real life; you really can't base opinions on how the characters are depicted. I knew the family slightly, and I knew Jeremy. I've never doubted for a minute that he was guilty. Neither did the majority of the jury.

It takes a very unusual individual to be able to kill 5 people in cold blood. It takes an even more unusual individual to kill 5 members of his own family, including 2 small children, in cold blood.

If he didn't kill them, and Sheila couldn't have, then who did? Somebody did. Jeremy Bamber.

Watching it now.

I feel very uncomfortable that the policeman that died has had what seems to be his last scene portraying him as a nasty bully. Even in pursuit of truth there should be some kindness to his surviving friends and family.

I still think he should have got a few years off his sentence because the family were so awful. He really didn't have anywhere to go in times of trial - sister was too ill and the favourite, the parents were very peculiar.

One of the things that makes me feel pity for him - taking out of the equation what he did for the moment - is finding out he was the product of an affair (hence his adoption) and then his parents went on to marry and have more children..how much would that mess with your head!? His bio father was found and interviewed after the shootings (not sure how long after) and said he was evil and had ruined his and his wife’s lives and they wanted nothing to do with him, ever. I just thought that was awful, no matter what he did, he is their flesh and blood and his behaviour is directly related in part to the fact they abandoned him.

Not to mention the fact he had none of the care and counselling that adopted children would get nowadays. He was just expected to be grateful.
He was very fucked up I think.

Bette you're a better person than me. I would say the adoption circumstances might be mitigating for forms of self harm - alcoholism, eating disorders or poor emotional health. If he did, he murdered five people (two of whom had no capacity to have caused him anguish) while they were asleep or preparing for a quiet night. I don't think it's unreasonable for his bio parents, tracked down by the press, to express horror.

I’m not for one minute excusing what he did - he’s a monster. I’m just doing some armchair psychology into why he’s a monster. You just wonder HOW someone could do that. What leads to that point?

But you know, if DH and I had a child then had it adopted and then found out it had done something terrible later on I still don’t think I could completely write them off. I’d want to speak to them and try to find out why. I’d feel I was somehow to blame.
But then again I don’t think I could give a child up for adoption in the first place. His bio father sounds like a horrible man too - I wonder if it was inherited.

I was surprised to see the photos of some of the dead bodies shown on screen. Presumably they had permission.

Just to give context to the £25k Julie M was paid. I bought my first house, a 2 bedroom terraced house in Essex, for £46k in 1988. 2 years after the trial. 25k was a lot of money.

I still believe he was guilty. But she made a huge amount of money, a life changing amount, from selling her story.

I don't think Julie Mugford was a saint - she'd just been done for fraud - but she was all the more credible for that. If Bamber hadn't dumped her, there's every sign she'd have stayed schtumb.

She was probably frightened he'd do her in if she started getting expensive.

I was surprised to see the photos of some of the dead bodies shown on screen. Presumably they had permission.

These weren’t the actual crime scene photos. They were staged for the programme.

I can't believe anyone would make excuses for him because of his parents/upbringing. Many people have difficult, even abusive parents. Some are birth parents, some adoptive. They don't usually kill them. They certainly don't usually kill innocent children.

But she made a huge amount of money, a life changing amount, from selling her story.

The News of the World was interested in her story and willing to pay her £25,000 for it only if Bamber was found guilty.

I can't believe anyone would make excuses for him because of his parents/upbringing

If you’re referring to my comments, I repeat I’m not “making excuses”, merely looking into possible reasons why he ended up the way he did. Its criminal psychology.

Since no-one found the contract how do people know the article was dependent on JB being found guilty?
It doesn't make sense from a media pov. You'd just change the focus of the article ie gf fears for life as bf walks free. Or gf spills details on mini crime wave with farm murder suspect etc etc etc

In the FB group I just found in the tv show people are commenting that the policeman's face when he found she had journalists there showed he realised she'd made it up.

I get where you are coming from Bette I just stop short at the upbringing and background causing him to murder all those people - surely he'd confess and pleas mitigation - to keep insisting it was Sheila is callous

I still think he should have got a few years off his sentence because the family were so awful

We really can't run the criminal justice system on the basis that you'll effectively get away with murder if you can con enough people that your victim was an utter bastard. Other considerations apart, there would be a whole industry in proving how much the victim deserved it, in circumstances where the victim would have no possibility of defending himself.

Just came here after watching it and I don’t know why but @Noeuf’s comment has made me feel ill. I hope he didn’t think she’d made it up, but now I’m doubting everything I believed