The Nights Watch: GAME OF THRONES SEASON 8 EPISODE 4. May 6th UK. SPOILERS AFTER 2 am.

[OneInAMillionYou]

Hail survivors of The Battle of Winterfell.

The 'mysterious' episode 4 premieres tonight.

Who will be with us at 2am?

I am desperate to find out if Arya's kill is openly discussed and acknowledged, or does Bran take the credit, or does it remain a mystery.

Given Emilia Clarke has said Episode 5 is the one for which we will need 'bigger television screens' what will lead up to it?

Yeah but Dany is a bit mystical isn't she-she'd have some weird dragon-y connection with the new ones.
They might naturally gravitate towards her because she has dragonblood and dragons are very intelligent, but she taught her dragons to breathe fire on command and to fly when she says, completely wild dragons aren't going to do that.
If there are more dragons Rheagals death was completely pointless, esp as it seems to be Missandei that tips her over the edge not the death of her 'child'.

It makes literally no sense for ‘new dragons’ to appear at this point. The whole narrative for Dany seems to be how she does or does not cope with the losses she has suffered and the perceived threat to her fulfilling her destiny.

The introduction of new dragons would make as much sense as the sudden introduction of gunpowder at this point.

I'm with you SweetSummerChild

With only two episodes to go, the show would be a laughing stock if some handy additional dragons showed up at this point.

Whether another Red Priestess could bring back Rhaegal is barely credible. Maybe if we had another six episodes to introduce such a character etc.

I'm distraught how much we've been deprived off in this race to the finishing line.

The reveal of Jon's parentage and his feelings about it would have occupied at least 2 or 3 episodes in the earlier seasons.

Kit is at his best when tackling the slower emotional stuff. His face when he hugged Bran, lifting Arya off her feet in their reunion, maybe saying goodbye to Ghost (😡) etc
Some moments of grief at not being Ned's son and wanting to learn more about Lyanna...

Anyway, there is still pleasure to be had in watching how it pans out. For me, there is nothing else to touch it on television. I've never been so invested in a show.

Of...... Not 'off'

Apols

@OneInAMillionYou I agree 100%.

The show is definitely not as good as it was in earlier seasons, but I still love it (even if it’s sometimes just bitching about it).

There are lots of unanswered questions and plot holes, but that comes as no surprise as there is no book material to work from.

It does amuse me when people criticise the Harry Potter films and finish by saying “They should be adapted in a Game of Thrones style TV series”. Well, that’s fine - as long as they don’t mind thestrals/dementors/dragons being cut due to CGI budget!

Me too @OneInAMillionYou! I don't know what I'm gonna do with my life when GoT is over 😂 I don't think anything they do now could stop it from being my favourite tv show of all time, I'm absolutely in love with it and so sad it's nearly over.

I agree too that it's to be expected the writing won't be as good when they don't have the mastermind behind the story working with them anymore, I accepted that ages ago though which means I can enjoy the season without being too sour about all of the parts that could have been better, although I do get it's been so good that expectations are really high.

It's one of those shows you are dying to know the ending to but at the same time don't want it to be over.

Jon MUST have something important coming. He can't just be a soldier going in to fight. He's been brought back for a reason, and that reason wasn't the NK so WHAT IS HE GOING TO DO?

I can barely stand the suspense. Like the PP said, I am beyond frustrated at the rushed season but so want to see how this pans out. There has to be something clever coming. A wow moment.

Jon MUST have something important coming. He can't just be a soldier going in to fight. He's been brought back for a reason, and that reason wasn't the NK so WHAT IS HE GOING TO DO?

Agreed I think it has to revolve around Danny so either she kills him and that makes her realise how crazy she is and stop/run away. Or he kills her to save everyone. Tragic and noble it's the only option for his story arch I think. After abandoning ghost I think most people would prefer option one 😂😂

I’ve been watching since season 1, episode 1, and had read the first book before season 1 finished.

The biggest ‘red flag’ to me that the series was losing its way was when Stannis burnt Shireen. It seemed to come from nowhere, go nowhere and was just stuck into the story for shock value. I am 100% sure it will happen in the books, but the circumstances, consequences and impact that it will have on other characters will be far more meaningful.

My expectations have been fairly low since. Operation Wight Hunt was a spectacular feat of idiocy in its conception and execution, and the less said about it the better.

To me, this season is actually better than season 7 (which I thought was truly pants). I’m not sure why so many viewers are suddenly switching on now to the fact that the subtlety and pacing of the series is all out the window - it’s been pretty evident for a long time!

To me, this season is actually better than season 7 (which I thought was truly pants). I’m not sure why so many viewers are suddenly switching on now to the fact that the subtlety and pacing of the series is all out the window - it’s been pretty evident for a long time!
This exactly sweetsummer! This season is better than 5 or 7 IMO and I can't remember either of those seasons getting as much stick as this ones had so far. For me, I don't think anything could've been worse than Dorne and even if I hadn't read the books I'd still think it was badly executed. I think it must just be because it's the last season that people are more irritated, it's pretty much what I expected it to be though.

I think part of the problem is that because it's been a series that invites so much speculation, pretty much every plausible theory has been thrashed out.

This makes it quite hard to have a genuine 'oh shit' revelation without it being totally implausible.

I don't see how it can end satisfactorily....ideally, you'd want a twist that you couldn't see coming, that also makes sense in hindsight. It will be interesting to see what they do.

I've started rewatching series one... My they're all so young and sweet! I'm trying to work out how much time has passed in GoT.

In the first episode, Bran is ten, and sansa is 13. However, I read somewhere that Arya was 11 in season one, which would fit with her being 18 now, so around one year a season? Makes sense, I suppose, as its allowed the actors to grow up as well without having to be replaced.

In the books the characters are all several years younger than their TV counterparts. So, Arya is 8, Sansa is 12, Dany is 13 and Jon is 15 etc. I think the writers made them older because they thought the TV audience would be shocked by a 13 yr old Dany having sex, or Arya murdering people.

I agree, I have been watching since 2011 and this series MUCH better to watch than series 7. I can't wait for episode 5 - even though it is bound to be irritating in parts.

I understand the expense side of things but why didn't they make one or two extra lower budget episodes for this series to allow them to have the time for an extra twist or a bit more story telling?

yumyumpoppycat the ‘per episode’ cost for the main actors (Kit, Emilia, Lena, Nikolai and Peter) has skyrocketed this season. I can’t remember how much it is now, but it is a huge part of the budget whereas many of these actors were relative unknowns and probably much cheaper back in 2011.

I guess that’s why they’ve gone for fewer episodes but have several which are close to 80 mins long.

twitter.com/DSilvermint/status/1125856091261136896

Interesting thread on shift in style of GOT - Basically GRRM just writes and sees where the characters take him, which is great for characters but makes the plot messy and difficult to untangle.

On the other hand the show runners have a plan and an eventual end point, hence sometimes characters make seemingly unlikely decisions for the sake of the plot.

Personally, I think the problem with episode 4 was not that the characters made the 'wrong' decisions, but that they made them too quickly. Probably this is because I'm less invested in who gets the Iron Throne than the relationships between the characters. I don't really mind how Dany gets to Kings Landing. I do mind that we didn't get to spend more time in Winterfell after the Long Night.

I think the writers made them older because they thought the TV audience would be shocked by a 13 yr old Dany having sex, or Arya murdering people.

Also difficult to find really good child actors.

Historically children of the nobility were betrothed at ridiculously young ages. Margaret Beaufort nearly died in childbirth with Henry VII at 13.

Yes that makes sense summer, I guess spreading the actors out over more episodes with more minor characters wouldn't have done much to progress the story really.

Deadwife I do wonder if HenryVII's mother is part of the inspiration for dany, that is why I wondered if her destiny is getting a child on the throne, obviously getting Jon on the throne would be close to that as there isn't time for her to have a child now - unless her dragon is the child.

I think there are a lot of parallels between Dany and Cersei - even down to Dany's dragons/children and Cersei's children having similar stories/fates. So does this mean the third dragon will somehow mirror Tommen (betray Dany and then deliberately kill itself)?

Also I wonder if the three Stark children are fated to kill a 'baddie' each... Arya has taken out the NK, so Sansa kills Cersei, maybe via Brienne, and Jon kills Dany, maybe prompted by Jaime warning him that he and Dany will end up entwined like Jaime and Cersei otherwise? Jon has to have a destiny after being brought back by Melisandre, but maybe it's not what we think...

I would also love it if Tyrion somehow gets to ride a dragon, but that's probably wish-fulfilment on my part.

Sansa killed Ramsey, who was a baddie.

I think Cersei and Dany are similar in that they had families obsessed with power who weren't kind to them. Cersei's dad was cruel to all his children and looked down on females. He didn't see that his child most similar to him was right under his nose, he kept pushing Jaime to be like Cersei is naturally, when Jaime wasn't interested. Both Dany and Cersei have nothing in their lives other than the pursuit of the throne. Everyone they loved or who cared for them is dead (or has turned out to be their nephew and is consequently backing away).

Jon has to have a destiny after being brought back by Melisandre, but maybe it's not what we think...
I agree Jon has to do something more as he hasn't really done anything dramatic and I don't think his arc is over, but I do also wonder if Melisandre bringing him back was so that he could retake winterfell (or help Sansa to), as if he had never done that the Walkers would have won and the Long Night seemed to be her main objective in the series.

I don't know I think Jon bringing everyone together and being the kind of leader that people who hated each other wanted to follow; wildlings, northmen and the night's watch (minus the ones who killed him of course). Then he convinced Dany and her army to help. I think that's enough justification for bringing him back after 7 series of the show just trying to get people to believe the white walkers were real.

After all if they hadn't had all those troops to throw at the wights they never would've won

Agree Merry Not enough showing why people are doing what they’re doing.

I would have sacrificed most of the budget for Dorne, quite a bit of Dany in Essos and Arya with the faceless men to have this money used now.

And more Jon n’Ghost.

I do wonder if HenryVII's mother is part of the inspiration for dany, that is why I wondered if her destiny is getting a child on the throne

I did wonder if they were doing Margaret Beaufort - or Henry VII and Elizabeth of York uniting the claimants a- perhaps Jon Snow and Dany having a baby but there doesn't seem time for that now.

Also wondered if Cersei would keep the thrown like King Stephen and Henry II - fighting to a standstill then Stephen heir being killed and them coming to a compromise he kept thrown till he died then Henry II got it.

Henry II mother – Empress Matilda/Maude was a remarkable woman, but her tomb reads daughter, wife mother – maybe that could be Danny.

However I think Cersei days are numbered – as she on Arya’s hit list.